@ Job Searcho: Couldn’t agree more! And the next bit is that it should be up to each individual to decide whether it is necessary to express something, and different individuals will have different needs. But it should NOT be up to governments to decide. Why? Because it’s not their right. (Rights are conferred by law. If the constitution says “Free Speech”, then that’s the law. Governments have to obey the law too, you know.)
I take your points but it is not true to say that only the king can address the injustice of these laws and change them. The laws were enacted by Thai governments and a Thai government that cares about free speech and justice can just as easily revoke them.
Isn’t it time to get the Christians interested in this issue? I find it terribly offensive when I hear a positively awful song which takes words directly from Handel’s Messiah which refer to “the Almighty” to describe the King of Siam. This is nothing short of blasphemy and the composer and musicians who perform it any person who broadcasts it should be dealt with by the Inquisition.
Great – from what I can work out so far the most likely result of this load of balls is going to be rotting fish added to the stinking water …. and don’t believe all the reports, the family house in Rangsit has been under at least 1.5m of water for two months now …..
No one except the King himself can abolish this law without any risk of attack from brainwashed royal fanatics. The law will be abolished one day. It is up to the King to choose whether he would want to voluntarily abolish it to save his family, or let the law be forcefully abolished by the people. If he chooses to do nothing, then that means he has chosen the second option. And there will be heavy consequences.
My admittedly loose and probably inaccurate translation is this:
‘Do you believe that this kind of problem happens in every country? The difference is that in Thailand, you have an opportunity to see an entire litany of cases. Speak with the victims and you will be deeply moved. There is but one reason that their number is not at all small: people are imprisoned even though they have done nothing wrong; they are assigned guilt and long prison sentences. Where the assignment of guilt has power to strike only to the extent of withdrawing “freedom” (equivalent to saying “you cannot eat”) it is something that doesn’t hurt all that much: no more than death. But withdrawing the freedom of an innocent person has the power to damage entirely the lives of that person’s family members, the economy and society. Surely we cannot expect the achievement of “justice” in society, but we are capable of trying to support those who are the victims of injustice such that they have a voice, companions and strength, and, moreover, that they can recover (heal).’ (corrections of this translation are welcome. I am by no means fluent in Thai)
What strikes me about this response (as I told my friend) is the recognition of injustice and the seeming resignation to it. Other friends I have to about this case have emphasized the innocence of the victim, rather than the absurdity of the sentence or the lese majeste law itself.
The issue of Thai reactions to this case is an interesting one. One of my friends in Southern Thailand (someone I would definitely not describe as a “salim”) wrote the following:
An interesting analysis by Sakmongkol AK47 on the chances of the various political parties at Malaysia’s 13th General Elections.
These comments come from an interesting character. Sakmongkol AK47 is the nom de plume of Dato’ Mohd.Ariff Sabri bin Hj. Abdul Aziz. He was state legislator of Pulau Manis, from 2004-2008. Interestingly it is a seat in the Federal parliamentary constituency of Pekan, of which the current Prime Minister has been and is the member. From 2000-2004, he was the chief information officer for UMNO’s Pekan division, under Dato Sri Najib Razak.
Another incredibly harsh sentence. I am lost for words.
Besides the personal tragedy of each single accused and convicted, I wonder when the ultra-royalists will understand that each such case has done, and continues to do far more damage to the monarchy than any anti-monarchist can possibly do.
May I suggest some pages from David Streckfuss, Truth on Trial in Thailand, that may shed light on how the lese majesty charge and trial work in Thailand?
1. Chapter 12 on truth in news, art, and in history, esp. those “principles” on pp. 281-284
2. Then please read the section on pp. 67-80, esp. bottom of p. 75 to p.76
My view is that we are stuck with 112 for some time unless the King publicly repudiates the law which he could do if he is well enough to deliver his annual birthday address. It is difficult to imagine anything less lifting the terrible burden of fear that so grips Thailand today.
As for justice for the old Mr Arkong, it appears on the evidence presented he did not send the offending messages to this odious secretary of the PM responsible for the disgraceful events of 2010.
If the true “offender” were to speak up and proudly admit sending the messages while making their details public would the authorities not be forced into releasing old Arkong ?
If this admission were to be made in a foreign country while seeking political asylum would this not be a terribly embarrassing situation for the whole Thai political establishment and perhaps even alert the King to the need for him to repudiate 112 ?
Yes jess its totally odd, that’s why many people think this is not a case since the evidence is so weak, didn’t it tick you one bit of why the old man would send the sms to the person who certainly wouldnt stay quiet about it? dont you think this is just too funny to be true?
Cliff Sloan writes #21 Can somebody post some information on Somkiat? He is the one who, after receiving four anonymous SMS messages, chose to prosecute rather than just delete them. Would it be appropriate to hold him and his judgment up to public scrutiny?
A 17 years old senseless girl ,a daugther of one of the Thai elite
drove a car without a driver license hit a van killed 9 passengers ( most of them are highly educated ), no jail term and so far no legal punishment. Then a frial ,poor and defendless old man , no solid proof of his alleged crime of sending 4 sms deemed insulting the K and Q was sentenced to 20 yrs in jail. If this uttery distorted judiciary and society are not changed soon enough, the world community will soon witness a civil or class war in the once proud as a peaceful buddhist country.
The account of the proceedings Banphai posted (#3) is worth reading. Among the defence evidence presented was the fact that the IMEI no. of a phone can be changed using a device called a flashbox. Presumably this means you can make a call from your phone appear to come from someone else’s phone. The judge decided not to record this particular piece of evidence because, “he sees that it is irrelevant.”
Facebook 
Twitter 
Soundcloud 
Youtube 
Rss
What’s going on with the Thai Printing Act?
@ Job Searcho: Couldn’t agree more! And the next bit is that it should be up to each individual to decide whether it is necessary to express something, and different individuals will have different needs. But it should NOT be up to governments to decide. Why? Because it’s not their right. (Rights are conferred by law. If the constitution says “Free Speech”, then that’s the law. Governments have to obey the law too, you know.)
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Ricky (c.29) and CT (c.36)
I take your points but it is not true to say that only the king can address the injustice of these laws and change them. The laws were enacted by Thai governments and a Thai government that cares about free speech and justice can just as easily revoke them.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Isn’t it time to get the Christians interested in this issue? I find it terribly offensive when I hear a positively awful song which takes words directly from Handel’s Messiah which refer to “the Almighty” to describe the King of Siam. This is nothing short of blasphemy and the composer and musicians who perform it any person who broadcasts it should be dealt with by the Inquisition.
EM balls – a flood hoax?
Great – from what I can work out so far the most likely result of this load of balls is going to be rotting fish added to the stinking water …. and don’t believe all the reports, the family house in Rangsit has been under at least 1.5m of water for two months now …..
Ah Kong and his family
This can happen only in a backward, uncivilized country.
Ah Kong and his family
Well done Thailand.
I’m sure Malaysia and ASEAN are learning much from how you handle politically diverse views.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
No one except the King himself can abolish this law without any risk of attack from brainwashed royal fanatics. The law will be abolished one day. It is up to the King to choose whether he would want to voluntarily abolish it to save his family, or let the law be forcefully abolished by the people. If he chooses to do nothing, then that means he has chosen the second option. And there will be heavy consequences.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
My admittedly loose and probably inaccurate translation is this:
‘Do you believe that this kind of problem happens in every country? The difference is that in Thailand, you have an opportunity to see an entire litany of cases. Speak with the victims and you will be deeply moved. There is but one reason that their number is not at all small: people are imprisoned even though they have done nothing wrong; they are assigned guilt and long prison sentences. Where the assignment of guilt has power to strike only to the extent of withdrawing “freedom” (equivalent to saying “you cannot eat”) it is something that doesn’t hurt all that much: no more than death. But withdrawing the freedom of an innocent person has the power to damage entirely the lives of that person’s family members, the economy and society. Surely we cannot expect the achievement of “justice” in society, but we are capable of trying to support those who are the victims of injustice such that they have a voice, companions and strength, and, moreover, that they can recover (heal).’ (corrections of this translation are welcome. I am by no means fluent in Thai)
What strikes me about this response (as I told my friend) is the recognition of injustice and the seeming resignation to it. Other friends I have to about this case have emphasized the innocence of the victim, rather than the absurdity of the sentence or the lese majeste law itself.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
The issue of Thai reactions to this case is an interesting one. One of my friends in Southern Thailand (someone I would definitely not describe as a “salim”) wrote the following:
р╕Ыр╕▒р╕Нр╕лр╕▓р╣Ар╕Кр╣Ир╕Щр╕Щр╕╡р╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╕нр╕вр╕╣р╣Ир╕Чр╕╕р╕Бр╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╣Ар╕Чр╕и р╕Др╕╕р╕Ур╣Ар╕Кр╕╖р╣Ир╕нр╣Др╕лр╕б р╣Бр╕бр╣Йр╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╣Гр╕Щр╣Др╕Чр╕вр╕Цр╣Йр╕▓р╕Др╕╕р╕Ур╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╣Вр╕нр╕Бр╕▓р╕кр╕Фр╕╣р╕гр╕▓р╕вр╕Бр╕▓р╕г р╕Др╕╕р╕вр╕Бр╕▒р╕Ър╣Бр╕Юр╕░р╕Др╕╕р╕Ур╕Ир╕░р╕кр╕░р╣Ар╕Чр╕╖р╕нр╕Щр╣Гр╕Ир╕бр╕▓р╕Б р╣Ар╕Юр╕гр╕▓р╕░р╕бр╕▒р╕Щр╕бр╕╡р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Ир╕│р╕Щр╕зр╕Щр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╕Щр╣Йр╕нр╕вр╣Ар╕ер╕вр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ар╕Фр╕╡р╕вр╕з р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕бр╕╡р╕Др╕Щр╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕Хр╕┤р╕Фр╕Др╕╕р╕Бр╣Вр╕Фр╕вр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Хр╕▒р╕зр╣Ар╕нр╕Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕Чр╕│р╕Ьр╕┤р╕Ф р╣Бр╕ер╕░р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╣Вр╕Чр╕йр╕Ир╕│р╕Др╕╕р╕Бр╕нр╕▒р╕Щр╕вр╕▓р╕зр╕Щр╕▓р╕Щ р╕лр╕▓р╕Бр╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╣Вр╕Чр╕йр╕Щр╕▒р╣Йр╕Щр╕бр╕╡р╕Ьр╕ер╕Бр╕гр╕░р╕Чр╕Ъ р╣Ар╕Юр╕╡р╕вр╕Зр╣Бр╕Др╣Ир╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Вр╕▓р╕Ф “р╕нр╕┤р╕кр╕гр╕ар╕▓р╕Ю” р╣Ар╕лр╕бр╕╖р╕нр╕Щр╕Бр╕▒р╕Ър╕Др╕│р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Бр╕▓р╕г “р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕Бр╕┤р╕Щр╕Вр╣Йр╕▓р╕з” р╕бр╕▒р╕Щр╕Бр╣Зр╕Др╕Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Ар╕Ир╣Зр╕Ър╕Ыр╕зр╕Фр╣Ар╕Чр╣Ир╕▓р╣Др╕лр╕гр╣И р╕нр╕вр╣Ир╕▓р╕Зр╕бр╕▓р╕Бр╕Бр╣Зр╣Бр╕Др╣Ир╕Хр╕▓р╕в р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Вр╕▓р╕Фр╕нр╕┤р╕кр╕гр╕ар╕▓р╕Юр╕Вр╕нр╕Зр╕бр╕Щр╕╕р╕йр╕вр╣Мр╕Ьр╕╣р╣Йр╕Ър╕гр╕┤р╕кр╕╕р╕Чр╕Шр╕┤р╣Мр╕Др╕Щр╕лр╕Щр╕╢р╣Ир╕З р╕бр╕▒р╕Щр╕бр╕╡р╕Ьр╕ер╕Бр╕гр╕░р╕Чр╕Ър╕Чр╕▒р╣Йр╕Зр╕Кр╕╡р╕зр╕┤р╕Хр╕Вр╕нр╕Зр╕Др╕Щр╕Ьр╕╣р╣Йр╕Щр╕▒р╣Йр╕Щ р╕Щр╕▒р╣Ир╕Щр╕лр╕бр╕▓р╕вр╕Цр╕╢р╕Зр╕Др╕гр╕нр╕Ър╕Др╕гр╕▒р╕з р╣Ар╕ир╕гр╕йр╕Рр╕Бр╕┤р╕И р╕кр╕▒р╕Зр╕Др╕б
р╣Ар╕гр╕▓р╕Др╕Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╕кр╕▓р╕бр╕▓р╕гр╕Цр╣Ар╕гр╕╡р╕вр╕Бр╕гр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╣Ар╕Бр╕┤р╕Фр╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╕вр╕╕р╕Хр╕┤р╕Шр╕гр╕гр╕бр╕Вр╕╢р╣Йр╕Щр╣Гр╕Щр╕кр╕▒р╕Зр╕Др╕бр╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╣Ар╕гр╕▓р╕кр╕▓р╕бр╕▓р╕гр╕Цр╕Юр╕вр╕▓р╕вр╕▓р╕бр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Ир╕░р╕кр╣Ир╕Зр╣Ар╕кр╕гр╕┤р╕бр╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╕вр╕╕р╕Хр╕┤р╕Шр╕гр╕гр╕б р╕бр╕╡р╕Ыр╕▓р╕Бр╣Ар╕кр╕╡р╕вр╕З р╕бр╕╡р╕Юр╕гр╕гр╕Др╕Юр╕зр╕Б р╕бр╕╡р╕Юр╕ер╕▒р╕З р╣Бр╕ер╕░р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╣Ар╕вр╕╡р╕вр╕зр╕вр╕▓
Najib, Islam and the 13th General Election in Malaysia
An interesting analysis by Sakmongkol AK47 on the chances of the various political parties at Malaysia’s 13th General Elections.
These comments come from an interesting character. Sakmongkol AK47 is the nom de plume of Dato’ Mohd.Ariff Sabri bin Hj. Abdul Aziz. He was state legislator of Pulau Manis, from 2004-2008. Interestingly it is a seat in the Federal parliamentary constituency of Pekan, of which the current Prime Minister has been and is the member. From 2000-2004, he was the chief information officer for UMNO’s Pekan division, under Dato Sri Najib Razak.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Today the Communication Minister warned Facebook users not to press the ‘like’ button on Lese Majeste material – or they might be charged under the Computer Crimes Act.
Anyone hoping that this government will do something about the Lese Majeste law is likely to be disappointed.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Another incredibly harsh sentence. I am lost for words.
Besides the personal tragedy of each single accused and convicted, I wonder when the ultra-royalists will understand that each such case has done, and continues to do far more damage to the monarchy than any anti-monarchist can possibly do.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Amazing Thailand indeed…
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
May I suggest some pages from David Streckfuss, Truth on Trial in Thailand, that may shed light on how the lese majesty charge and trial work in Thailand?
1. Chapter 12 on truth in news, art, and in history, esp. those “principles” on pp. 281-284
2. Then please read the section on pp. 67-80, esp. bottom of p. 75 to p.76
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
My view is that we are stuck with 112 for some time unless the King publicly repudiates the law which he could do if he is well enough to deliver his annual birthday address. It is difficult to imagine anything less lifting the terrible burden of fear that so grips Thailand today.
As for justice for the old Mr Arkong, it appears on the evidence presented he did not send the offending messages to this odious secretary of the PM responsible for the disgraceful events of 2010.
If the true “offender” were to speak up and proudly admit sending the messages while making their details public would the authorities not be forced into releasing old Arkong ?
If this admission were to be made in a foreign country while seeking political asylum would this not be a terribly embarrassing situation for the whole Thai political establishment and perhaps even alert the King to the need for him to repudiate 112 ?
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Jesse – 11
Yes jess its totally odd, that’s why many people think this is not a case since the evidence is so weak, didn’t it tick you one bit of why the old man would send the sms to the person who certainly wouldnt stay quiet about it? dont you think this is just too funny to be true?
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Cliff Sloan writes #21
Can somebody post some information on Somkiat? He is the one who, after receiving four anonymous SMS messages, chose to prosecute rather than just delete them. Would it be appropriate to hold him and his judgment up to public scrutiny?
Somkiat himself actually wrote some response to the verdict on his facebook. See the report (in Thai) at Thai E-News here http://thaienews.blogspot.com/2011/11/20.html.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
heads up people…
http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/267732/facebook-like-button-may-bring-lese-majeste-charge-against-users
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
A 17 years old senseless girl ,a daugther of one of the Thai elite
drove a car without a driver license hit a van killed 9 passengers ( most of them are highly educated ), no jail term and so far no legal punishment. Then a frial ,poor and defendless old man , no solid proof of his alleged crime of sending 4 sms deemed insulting the K and Q was sentenced to 20 yrs in jail. If this uttery distorted judiciary and society are not changed soon enough, the world community will soon witness a civil or class war in the once proud as a peaceful buddhist country.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
The account of the proceedings Banphai posted (#3) is worth reading. Among the defence evidence presented was the fact that the IMEI no. of a phone can be changed using a device called a flashbox. Presumably this means you can make a call from your phone appear to come from someone else’s phone. The judge decided not to record this particular piece of evidence because, “he sees that it is irrelevant.”
Great.