Well, Nganadeeleg, that might be one way to do it. However, I am not sure that one statement on LM qualifies the king as a “very prominent critic.” He might be prominent (in Thailand, anyway), but hardly a critic with any determination.
As far as I am able to tell from the currently available information, there is not a peep from any royal that would allow any of us to think that they oppose the way LM is crafted, used or the sentences handed out.
I have no idea if there is a farang who wants to become a Thai citizen.
However, I can assure you that there are many Thais who want to become a ‘farang’. I live in a country where there are many Thais who have immigrated from Thailand, and I can assure you that the vast majority of the Thais (if not 100%) I have spoken with in this country “want” to have the right to ‘live and work’ in this country. And after those people have gained such rights, they next thing they want is the ‘citizenship’ of this country. When they have a chance to apply to become one, they all do.
So to advertise it on TV that there is ONE farang who wants to become a Thai, while the truth (which needs no advertisement) is there are plenty of Thais who want to become farangs…is really a pathetic attempt to convince Thai people that Thailand is more pleasant to live than western countries.
Johninbkk (50). First Newin and now Chalerm have been pressed into the service of the yellows. Probably part of a deal which keeps them and their families out of prison, or in the land of the living. Their odour has rubbed off on both sides, but it is not yet clear where Chalerm’s will linger longest.
Interesting! I effectly heard about this lady Ferrari, daughter of a Swiss clergyman, for m’y book “Un roi en Suisse”, but I did not succeed. Which collegue did you contact in October 2011 in Lausanne?
This latest book was prepared under the guidance of an editorial advisory board comprised of ‘highly respected individuals’ who have ‘all worked closely with His Majesty the King’.
They have spelled out the ‘unambiguous’ opposition to the LM law by the King, so therefore I would recommend that anyone who wishes to discuss anything related to the monarchy (in less than glowing terms) ALWAYS preface their comments by making reference to the King’s views on being criticized, and this books clarification of that view.
Yes, watching Thai TV certainly produces a few surprises. Here’s one from yesterday, courtesy of PBS.
Before the 7pm news, PBS broadcasts different 5 minutes cartoons devoted to HM achievements, Thai culture, being Thai and so on.
Last night’s didactic instruction was certainly instructional, in a strangely sinister, even freakish kind of way.
Here’s the synopsis:
A wise uncle, teaching his awe struck young charges, introduces a ‘farang’ (country of origin unspecified) who – on listening to the wiseman’s words – is so impressed by a certain someone’s lifetime achievements decides that he wants to become Thai.
Yes, there is quite a lengthy section (on p. 313) that deals with those statements. It begins with what could very well become an immortal line — “Thailand’s law of lèse-majesté has one very prominent critic: King Bhumibol”.
It goes on to suggest that “the king’s observations [in 2005] were unambiguous” but that authorities disregarded them. All the authors can then do is repeat the judgement of the Reporters Without Borders’ World Press Freedom Index. Thailand, by that measure, dropped almost 100 places in six years.
I’m of the opinion that the ‘Burman’ reforms and the conflicts are closely linked – it’s about consolidating political and business dominance, as are all the other ‘reform’ measures, regardless of whether they do or don’t benefit the population. The government would never orchestrate its own downfall, but engineer the landscape to ensure it retains its grip on power. Out-and-out dictatorial governance will never last, but a softer authoritarianism can (as is the case in Cambodia, which is now largely uncriticised by the int. community). I feel the ethnic wars are part of the means to shape a new Burma that allows investment to flood into the border regions – harder to do when they’re being resisted by armed groups – and therefore make it a market-friendly country (the key qualification for interaction with the govt, as business between the west and elsewhere – Saudi Arabia, Colombia, and so – shows). The political reforms are a move towards meeting the key benchmarks for ending sanctions, and the conflicts a means to ready the ground for post-sanctions investment.
Securing these areas for exploitation is integral to the goals of both US/EU businesses, not to mention Asia’s hunger for Burma, and also serves to ensure longevity for the USDP. I don’t think people are really ‘getting’ the fact that these conflicts have evolved into ones driven by business.
Thanks to my English teacher, 40 years ago at amall,outclass school in the remote North Eastern part of Thailand, a son of poor farmer had a chance to learn A,B,C , now I had a chance to read what never appear in our mainstream newspaper. I had quietly follow up your work in many case and for a period of time, Good done Dr. Pravin.
Thanks for beginning this discussion. I had read the stories at PPT but hadn’t seen much more since then. Like you, I haven’t read the book yet, but have flicked through it. The think that struck me about it is that the three academic authors are just lumped in as writers. It seems that all authors bear responsibility for the whole thing. That seems a bit odd for a book that was proclaimed by Anand as a book that is entirely factual. Indeed, he says (this is all from the Bkk Post story of the time): “we did not use details without reference.” If that is true, why is there collective authorship? Shouldn’t each author have responsibility for the chapters they wrote? Or am I missing something about how the book was constructed?
I recommend that anyone reading this also read “Tragedy Strikes” in the Chapter “The Life: Second Cycle (1940-1951)” of “King Bhumibol Adulyadej: A Life’s Work” just published by Editions Didier Millet.
Zenjournalist which can be googled worldwide, shows important information on page two:
Memorandum of Conversation, U.S. Embassy Bangkok, March 31, 1948
Copy of a confidential cable, “Memorandum of Conversation”, sent by U.S. Ambassador Edwin F. Stanton on March 31, 1948. Cable is held at the United States National Archive, 8601 Adelphi Road, College Park, Maryland in box 7251, stack 250, row 38, compartment 24, shelf 1. Cable reference number is RG59 892.00/3-148.
“In discussing the question of the late King’s death, Thamrong said he did not know whether this tragic incident would ever be cleared up. He said speaking quite confidentially the evidence which was accumulated while he was Prime Minister tended to implicate the present young King, but that he would never have dared to hint by any official action that such was the case.” (page 2)
Ajarn Pavin,
Are you aware of the Book “Un roi en Suisse”, written recently by Swiss journalist Olivier Grivat. There are some mentions of Marylene Ferrari in it.
Arnaud D.
plan B,
You keep referencing the past. Apparently you’re stuck there. Try looking to the present, and then to the future.
Until the Burmese generals quit murdering minorities – and purposely killing civilians is murder – there will never be peace.
In your previous posts you either ignore, or attempt to gloss over, the continuous war crimes perpetrated by the SPDC. Until that ends, and the generals end up in the dock, there will never be peace.
Your unending defense of, and apologies for, the junta never ceases to amaze me.
Little regards to “Myanmar history”, as represented well by your useless careless statement , and acting in a useless careless way is why Myanmar has become a quagmire.
Burmans? The inhabitants originating from Myanmar.
Do you mean to say Bamar (lu Myo)/Ethnic Burmese.
Are you implying since the fall of Tathone (1057), this dominant entity, Bamar has regards other minority as less than equal?
Implying Bamar as racist/discriminatory in their ruthless approach to dominating since 1057!
Implying::
1) Killing Bamar soldiers,
2) Punishing the majority of the citizenry of Myanmar, ‘The Bamar lu Myo’, through decades of useless careless policy
justifiable as anti racist by you and your ilks is indeed glaring.
Read ‘Burmeses Days’ by G. Owell and realized the behavior of this military regime originated from in all it repugnant ways and means.
It depends on the people I guess. Many of the Salims and yellow still want to watch Royal news. When they see the King on TV speaking, even though most of the times what he said was completely incomprehensible, they just watch and cry and feel happy. However, many of my ‘Red’ friends (including their parents) would simply turn off the TV. One of my very long time neighbours (we are good friends since pre school) is Red and her entire family is Red. Her dad and mum in particular are very anti-Royal. They told me that every time they see the Royals’ faces on TV, they feel like wanting to vomit!
A good point Ricky. I have noticed several times that some people simply turn off their televisions when the royal news comes on each evening or change channels.
Perhaps related, it is my impression that fewer people are stopping when the national anthem is played in public places.
I didn’t say Mogh is offensive. I just said Mogh is a term used by Bengalis, and Bengali agents led the British to Burma through Arakan. See, you again used the word Barua Mogh, which proves Bengalis like you are calling Mogh to any Buddhists, including Chittagonian Bengali dialect speaking Baruas who profess Buddhism. Your medieval Bengali poet Alaol (A Awwal) in his books including Padmavati, called the Rakhine as Roshang, again a Bengali form of Rakhine.
What kind of Arakan expert are you, if you just ignore Alaol? Alaol had a lot of praise for the Arakanese (ahem, Rakhine) Kings, telling in more than one place in his books the metropolitan nature of Mrauk-U, the capital. He never mentioned Rohingya.
Mogh is a Bengali word and the British learned it from their Bengali agents and interpreters who led them to Burma. Many Bengali historians in their writings testified to this fact. Dr Mabud Khan was one of them. For all your one-eyed observations, I have doubt of your scholarship … it is shame any western university should give you a doctorate, again on Arakan. It is a shame Bangladesh gave birth to a xenophobe like you. It is a shame you are so narrow and ignorant, even to your own little knowledge.
Socalled Rohingya writers including physician come terrorist doctor Yunus again and again used the word Mogh to denote the Rakhine, which proves his unerring Bengali origin.
Regarding Steve’s concern ” the cost of even suspending let alone cancelling contracts that have already been signed may well prove self-defeating “:
My answer is that legislation to deal with this is in order. During the floods the normal rights of millions were suspended and when it comes to the aftermath why should not the rights, granted by dubious contracts be similarly suspended. I douby that companies will go broke as a result.
Facebook 
Twitter 
Soundcloud 
Youtube 
Rss
There is no question…
Well, Nganadeeleg, that might be one way to do it. However, I am not sure that one statement on LM qualifies the king as a “very prominent critic.” He might be prominent (in Thailand, anyway), but hardly a critic with any determination.
As far as I am able to tell from the currently available information, there is not a peep from any royal that would allow any of us to think that they oppose the way LM is crafted, used or the sentences handed out.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
@JohnH,
I have no idea if there is a farang who wants to become a Thai citizen.
However, I can assure you that there are many Thais who want to become a ‘farang’. I live in a country where there are many Thais who have immigrated from Thailand, and I can assure you that the vast majority of the Thais (if not 100%) I have spoken with in this country “want” to have the right to ‘live and work’ in this country. And after those people have gained such rights, they next thing they want is the ‘citizenship’ of this country. When they have a chance to apply to become one, they all do.
So to advertise it on TV that there is ONE farang who wants to become a Thai, while the truth (which needs no advertisement) is there are plenty of Thais who want to become farangs…is really a pathetic attempt to convince Thai people that Thailand is more pleasant to live than western countries.
Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
Johninbkk (50). First Newin and now Chalerm have been pressed into the service of the yellows. Probably part of a deal which keeps them and their families out of prison, or in the land of the living. Their odour has rubbed off on both sides, but it is not yet clear where Chalerm’s will linger longest.
Desperately seeking Marylene
Interesting! I effectly heard about this lady Ferrari, daughter of a Swiss clergyman, for m’y book “Un roi en Suisse”, but I did not succeed. Which collegue did you contact in October 2011 in Lausanne?
There is no question…
This latest book was prepared under the guidance of an editorial advisory board comprised of ‘highly respected individuals’ who have ‘all worked closely with His Majesty the King’.
They have spelled out the ‘unambiguous’ opposition to the LM law by the King, so therefore I would recommend that anyone who wishes to discuss anything related to the monarchy (in less than glowing terms) ALWAYS preface their comments by making reference to the King’s views on being criticized, and this books clarification of that view.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Yes, watching Thai TV certainly produces a few surprises. Here’s one from yesterday, courtesy of PBS.
Before the 7pm news, PBS broadcasts different 5 minutes cartoons devoted to HM achievements, Thai culture, being Thai and so on.
Last night’s didactic instruction was certainly instructional, in a strangely sinister, even freakish kind of way.
Here’s the synopsis:
A wise uncle, teaching his awe struck young charges, introduces a ‘farang’ (country of origin unspecified) who – on listening to the wiseman’s words – is so impressed by a certain someone’s lifetime achievements decides that he wants to become Thai.
Mmm…
There is no question…
Sabai sabai:
Yes, there is quite a lengthy section (on p. 313) that deals with those statements. It begins with what could very well become an immortal line — “Thailand’s law of lèse-majesté has one very prominent critic: King Bhumibol”.
It goes on to suggest that “the king’s observations [in 2005] were unambiguous” but that authorities disregarded them. All the authors can then do is repeat the judgement of the Reporters Without Borders’ World Press Freedom Index. Thailand, by that measure, dropped almost 100 places in six years.
Best wishes to all,
Nich
Burma’s independence and the year ahead
I’m of the opinion that the ‘Burman’ reforms and the conflicts are closely linked – it’s about consolidating political and business dominance, as are all the other ‘reform’ measures, regardless of whether they do or don’t benefit the population. The government would never orchestrate its own downfall, but engineer the landscape to ensure it retains its grip on power. Out-and-out dictatorial governance will never last, but a softer authoritarianism can (as is the case in Cambodia, which is now largely uncriticised by the int. community). I feel the ethnic wars are part of the means to shape a new Burma that allows investment to flood into the border regions – harder to do when they’re being resisted by armed groups – and therefore make it a market-friendly country (the key qualification for interaction with the govt, as business between the west and elsewhere – Saudi Arabia, Colombia, and so – shows). The political reforms are a move towards meeting the key benchmarks for ending sanctions, and the conflicts a means to ready the ground for post-sanctions investment.
Securing these areas for exploitation is integral to the goals of both US/EU businesses, not to mention Asia’s hunger for Burma, and also serves to ensure longevity for the USDP. I don’t think people are really ‘getting’ the fact that these conflicts have evolved into ones driven by business.
There is no question…
Good points Ralph. Does the book mention anything on the King saying he is not above criticism in 2005?
Looks like more glossy, well produced fodder for tourists visiting Kinokuniya at Emporium in Phrom Phong.
Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
Thanks to my English teacher, 40 years ago at amall,outclass school in the remote North Eastern part of Thailand, a son of poor farmer had a chance to learn A,B,C , now I had a chance to read what never appear in our mainstream newspaper. I had quietly follow up your work in many case and for a period of time, Good done Dr. Pravin.
There is no question…
Thanks for beginning this discussion. I had read the stories at PPT but hadn’t seen much more since then. Like you, I haven’t read the book yet, but have flicked through it. The think that struck me about it is that the three academic authors are just lumped in as writers. It seems that all authors bear responsibility for the whole thing. That seems a bit odd for a book that was proclaimed by Anand as a book that is entirely factual. Indeed, he says (this is all from the Bkk Post story of the time): “we did not use details without reference.” If that is true, why is there collective authorship? Shouldn’t each author have responsibility for the chapters they wrote? Or am I missing something about how the book was constructed?
Desperately seeking Marylene
I recommend that anyone reading this also read “Tragedy Strikes” in the Chapter “The Life: Second Cycle (1940-1951)” of “King Bhumibol Adulyadej: A Life’s Work” just published by Editions Didier Millet.
Desperately seeking Marylene
Zenjournalist which can be googled worldwide, shows important information on page two:
Memorandum of Conversation, U.S. Embassy Bangkok, March 31, 1948
Copy of a confidential cable, “Memorandum of Conversation”, sent by U.S. Ambassador Edwin F. Stanton on March 31, 1948. Cable is held at the United States National Archive, 8601 Adelphi Road, College Park, Maryland in box 7251, stack 250, row 38, compartment 24, shelf 1. Cable reference number is RG59 892.00/3-148.
“In discussing the question of the late King’s death, Thamrong said he did not know whether this tragic incident would ever be cleared up. He said speaking quite confidentially the evidence which was accumulated while he was Prime Minister tended to implicate the present young King, but that he would never have dared to hint by any official action that such was the case.” (page 2)
Desperately seeking Marylene
Ajarn Pavin,
Are you aware of the Book “Un roi en Suisse”, written recently by Swiss journalist Olivier Grivat. There are some mentions of Marylene Ferrari in it.
Arnaud D.
Burma’s independence and the year ahead
plan B,
You keep referencing the past. Apparently you’re stuck there. Try looking to the present, and then to the future.
Until the Burmese generals quit murdering minorities – and purposely killing civilians is murder – there will never be peace.
In your previous posts you either ignore, or attempt to gloss over, the continuous war crimes perpetrated by the SPDC. Until that ends, and the generals end up in the dock, there will never be peace.
Your unending defense of, and apologies for, the junta never ceases to amaze me.
Burma’s independence and the year ahead
Charles F.
Little regards to “Myanmar history”, as represented well by your useless careless statement , and acting in a useless careless way is why Myanmar has become a quagmire.
Burmans? The inhabitants originating from Myanmar.
Do you mean to say Bamar (lu Myo)/Ethnic Burmese.
Are you implying since the fall of Tathone (1057), this dominant entity, Bamar has regards other minority as less than equal?
Implying Bamar as racist/discriminatory in their ruthless approach to dominating since 1057!
Implying::
1) Killing Bamar soldiers,
2) Punishing the majority of the citizenry of Myanmar, ‘The Bamar lu Myo’, through decades of useless careless policy
justifiable as anti racist by you and your ilks is indeed glaring.
Read ‘Burmeses Days’ by G. Owell and realized the behavior of this military regime originated from in all it repugnant ways and means.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
It depends on the people I guess. Many of the Salims and yellow still want to watch Royal news. When they see the King on TV speaking, even though most of the times what he said was completely incomprehensible, they just watch and cry and feel happy. However, many of my ‘Red’ friends (including their parents) would simply turn off the TV. One of my very long time neighbours (we are good friends since pre school) is Red and her entire family is Red. Her dad and mum in particular are very anti-Royal. They told me that every time they see the Royals’ faces on TV, they feel like wanting to vomit!
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
A good point Ricky. I have noticed several times that some people simply turn off their televisions when the royal news comes on each evening or change channels.
Perhaps related, it is my impression that fewer people are stopping when the national anthem is played in public places.
BBC under fire on Rohingyas
Abid Bahar
I didn’t say Mogh is offensive. I just said Mogh is a term used by Bengalis, and Bengali agents led the British to Burma through Arakan. See, you again used the word Barua Mogh, which proves Bengalis like you are calling Mogh to any Buddhists, including Chittagonian Bengali dialect speaking Baruas who profess Buddhism. Your medieval Bengali poet Alaol (A Awwal) in his books including Padmavati, called the Rakhine as Roshang, again a Bengali form of Rakhine.
What kind of Arakan expert are you, if you just ignore Alaol? Alaol had a lot of praise for the Arakanese (ahem, Rakhine) Kings, telling in more than one place in his books the metropolitan nature of Mrauk-U, the capital. He never mentioned Rohingya.
Mogh is a Bengali word and the British learned it from their Bengali agents and interpreters who led them to Burma. Many Bengali historians in their writings testified to this fact. Dr Mabud Khan was one of them. For all your one-eyed observations, I have doubt of your scholarship … it is shame any western university should give you a doctorate, again on Arakan. It is a shame Bangladesh gave birth to a xenophobe like you. It is a shame you are so narrow and ignorant, even to your own little knowledge.
Socalled Rohingya writers including physician come terrorist doctor Yunus again and again used the word Mogh to denote the Rakhine, which proves his unerring Bengali origin.
Thanks,
msp
The toll of flooding on lives and politics
Regarding Steve’s concern ” the cost of even suspending let alone cancelling contracts that have already been signed may well prove self-defeating “:
My answer is that legislation to deal with this is in order. During the floods the normal rights of millions were suspended and when it comes to the aftermath why should not the rights, granted by dubious contracts be similarly suspended. I douby that companies will go broke as a result.