@John Smith
The people responsible for the last coup are very pro-monarchy. PTP no doubt realizes they risk non-democratic power plays if they push the issue too hard. It’s a very politically sensitive topic and likely to backfire no matter which way they go. At the moment, there are more pressing issues – ie resolving the flood situation and enacting the promises from the election.
I think it’s too early to really judge PTP if they will ‘nullify’ 112, which is what I hope will happen. The new PTP government has so far not used 112 to silence the opposition, so it’s still one step forward.
I theoretically appreciate this initiative. However, and here I agree with #1 that AhKong is only one of many other convicts. Who starts initiatives for them? Secondly, I do not appreciate the way how the campaign is organized: via Facebook. I refuse the use of Facebook due to several rational reasons. There are plenty of other options how to collect the pictures – Facebook is only one of them. If you would broaden the way how people could participate in the campaign I would be happy to join.
Govt raids 13 community radio stations
Broadcasters accused of airing Jatuporn speech
Published: 27/04/2011 at 12:00 AMNewspaper section: News
Government officials yesterday raided 13 community radio stations in Bangkok and neighbouring provinces which have been accused of broadcasting a speech allegedly containing comments offensive to the monarchy.
A joint task force made up of officers from the Internal Security Operations Command (Isoc), the Office of the National Broadcasting and Telecommunications Commission and the Crime Suppression Division as well as local police carried court warrants to the community radio stations and seized their equipment.
Police spokesman Pol Maj Gen Prawuth Thawornsiri said Isoc had ordered police to take legal action against community radio stations which had broadcast a controversial April 10 speech made by Puea Thai Party MP Jatuporn Prompan, since he is facing lese majeste charges as a result. http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/233904/govt-raids-13-community-radio-stations
2) “Network of Monarchy Protection Volonteers”
Did the group mis-spell their own name, or was it the author (Nick Nostitz)?
The majority of the placards are placing all blame of the 600 flood victims directly on Yingluck and FROC. A bit unfair of a criticism, considering the floods started two months before PTP became government . . .
What is interesting about Mallika’s comments are that they reveal the mindset of the Democrats as being profoundly anti-liberal, anti-freedom of expression and anti-democratic.
Which is an amazing response Marteau’s actual comment: What is more relevant is what is the Yingluck government going to do to reform Section 112. They have the power and popular mandate to go for significant reform. Let’s see how they do
Why did Andrew direct the discussion to the Democrats and not comment on what the PTP is going to do?
Could it be because the PTP is made up of people with exactly the agenda to “attack the freedoms loved by many of their own voters and don’t care about establishing any kind of meaningful and principled political platform.”
But to do that, he would have to admit what type of people he has been backing.
There is little doubt that the western liberals who think the PTP share their views are in for very sad awakening over the next few months.
What is interesting about Mallika’s comments are that they reveal the mindset of the Democrats as being profoundly anti-liberal, anti-freedom of expression and anti-democratic.
But we already knew that.
What is also of interest is that a party supposedly aspiring towards being electable would even attack the freedoms loved by many of their own voters. It’s like they just don’t care about establishing any kind of meaningful and principled political platform. Again this is not now. For me all this just further reveals how out of touch the Dems are, how little they care about the democratic process and the ongoing danger they represent to Thailand’s attempts to democratise itself.
These scary and completely unelectable people, epitomised by Mallika, are waiting in the wings and would be more than willing to take power, by hook or by crook whilst using excessive violence and threats in order to do so.
The issue should not only be freeing Agong but to reform the 112 to prevent abusive use by individual groups and politicians. If we continue to allow this abusiveness of using the law, Agong won’t be the last one that needs a campaign to be freed.
O.K. so you started a campaign. Where can I find information on this campaign? What are its objectives? what do you define as fearlessness in the struggle against LM?
History shaped the present Jesse, like how the Vasille treaty directly responsible for WWII. The emerged of Islamic extremist in Iran was the result of 1953 coup detat which desposed the democratically elected Mosaddegh and replaced with the autocratic Shah (sounded familiar?). Without understanding history, we ought to repeat the mistake we made.
Now, may I ask, what kind of problem are you referring to?
re alleged openness to criticism, perhaps it should properly be regarded as no more an attempt at sending a “message” to evil toxin and hence insincere politicing?
You totally missed the point here, the water level in the dam suppose to be below 20%-30% (depending on the size of the dam) during August to braced for the monsoon season. If we have a half full dam (50% level) then it is too late. Its because they start to released water heavily at the end of August, that’s why its start flooded from September onward. If you check the rate of “water released daily” for all the major dams (Buhimipol and Sirikit namely) you will see that they had had released very little water during April-June (although its a dry season). There’s nothing much Yingluck can do, she official took office on Aug 17th, much too late to do anything.
Furthermore, about her being novice, its obviouse that you don’t know much about PT (or former PPP), since her brother departure, Yingluck has been the main actor hehind the scene running PPP and PT for her brother, she is no novice just because you just know of her exitance recently. She was there all along since PPP time.
I have said again and again that anybody who thinks the K is opposed to LM should reconsider their stance. The final stage of the legislative process in Thailand (and most countries which have the Monarchy) is that the Monarch needs to ‘sign’ (the legal term is “give royal assent”) for the law to have effect. Thus, any law which the Monarch refuses to sign will never become law.
If the King is so opposed to LM, why did he sign to approve the law when Tanin Kraivixien increased the penalty of LM to fifteen years? Why did he sign to approve the law when the Military Dictatorship government eradicated the clause “criticism of the Monarch is allowed for reasons of upholding the Constitution and democracy”? What one says and what one does has to be consonant with each other. If the King says “I believe I should be criticised”, then what he did is he approved to increase penalty for LM and eliminated the opportunity for one to criticise him for political reasons, then it is just hypocritical. Thai people say this kind of conduct is “р╕бр╕╖р╕нр╕Цр╕╖р╕нр╕кр╕▓р╕Б р╕Ыр╕▓р╕Бр╕Цр╕╖р╕нр╕ир╕╡р╕е” (A person who preaches peace and morality, while holding a pestle, ready to smash anyone at the same time).
Thanks for the input, but it’s factually inaccurate. Yes, CIJ gets money from NED and other sources. The sources you name do NOT fully fund the organisation. CIJ gratefully receives funding, both in-kind and monetary, from volunteers, UNESCO and others – I don’t think you can really call UNESCO a US stooge! We have always been open about where we receive funding, and have turned money down when it either did not fit in with our aims and objectives, or if we had concerns that there were political strings attached. CIJ sets the goals and targets of the organisation, in consultation with a range of stake-holders, and we take money from those willing to help us reach those goals.
Your comment belittles the amount of primarily time but sometimes money that CIJ receives from Malaysian journalists, musicians and artists – those who are at the receiving end of government censorship and repression.
And I, personally, am not funded by anyone. I’m currently a stay-at-home Mum, former journalist and lecturer, who does not draw a salary. Since leaving the organisation as full-time staff, I have consistently given more to CIJ than I have received, primarily through in-kind donations of time and resources.
If the king is so opposed to LM, why is it that LM expands under the most royalist of governments? Thanin was a privy councillor. So was Surayud. And there is little doubt that Abhisit did the palace’s work. All the reference to the king’s speech back when is dissembling nonsense.
Jesse: I really appreciate your insights. I had never before thought that “People like you [the apparently academic Tarrin] who started the problem.” Now that I know that it has been powerful academics who have been killing and imprisoning Thais for decades, I can rest easy. I had always thought it was the police and army that had impunity on state murder. Now I realise I was wrong. Thanks indeed. I can now read Land Destroyer with a new awareness.
” . . .I am beginning to wonder if Khun Vichai actually understands the politics of water management . . Has Vichai not heard of EGAT? . ..”(Shane #36)
I couldn’t imagine EGAT suggesting to PM Yingluck in August2011 to keep more water when the dams are already near bursting and the monsoon season has only just begun.
Vichai N frankly does not have to understand politics of water management. I only know for a fact that Yingluck was a novice, untested in politics and unprepared in crisis situations, and, a clone full of insecurities and doubts goaded to assume the premiership by Thaksin as his surrogate.
Swamped by too many distractions perhaps, Yingluck was NOT paying attention even as the north of Thailand was already being heavily inundated by slow moving monster floods. Indecisive perhaps . . . she kept postponing to make the decision . . . hoping, desperately hoping.
In my opinion the devastations and death from the monster natural disaster could have been diminished, significantly diminished if Yingluck and her crew were paying attention.
Tom Hoy @36 is right. The penalties for lese majeste were sharply increased by a Thai government in the past without any public expression by the King to the effect that the earlier penalties were insufficient. Demanding that HMK should directly involve himself in the law making process today to reform Section 112 is ludicrous. He has already publicly expressed the view that he wants to be open to criticism. It is up to the Yingluck and its legal expert, Chalern Yoobamrung, to pick up the ball and run with it.
Of course this is childish rubbish from Khun Mallika but her party is not in power and not in a position to implement any of this stuff. So it is irrelevant.
What is more relevant is what is the Yingluck government going to do to reform Section 112. They have the power and popular mandate to go for significant reform. Let’s see how they do.
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Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
@John Smith
The people responsible for the last coup are very pro-monarchy. PTP no doubt realizes they risk non-democratic power plays if they push the issue too hard. It’s a very politically sensitive topic and likely to backfire no matter which way they go. At the moment, there are more pressing issues – ie resolving the flood situation and enacting the promises from the election.
I think it’s too early to really judge PTP if they will ‘nullify’ 112, which is what I hope will happen. The new PTP government has so far not used 112 to silence the opposition, so it’s still one step forward.
Thailand’s Fearlessness: Free Akong
I theoretically appreciate this initiative. However, and here I agree with #1 that AhKong is only one of many other convicts. Who starts initiatives for them? Secondly, I do not appreciate the way how the campaign is organized: via Facebook. I refuse the use of Facebook due to several rational reasons. There are plenty of other options how to collect the pictures – Facebook is only one of them. If you would broaden the way how people could participate in the campaign I would be happy to join.
Siam Samakki
A few comments . . .
1) @tom hoy
I thought the same thing:
2) “Network of Monarchy Protection Volonteers”
Did the group mis-spell their own name, or was it the author (Nick Nostitz)?
3) For those who can’t read the Thai in the placards in this image:
http://www.newmandala.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/12.jpg
The majority of the placards are placing all blame of the 600 flood victims directly on Yingluck and FROC. A bit unfair of a criticism, considering the floods started two months before PTP became government . . .
4) Isn’t the guy in this image the person I occasionally see on those Thai snake-oil infomercials?
http://www.newmandala.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/08.jpg
Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
Andrew Spooner #24 says:
Marteau
What is interesting about Mallika’s comments are that they reveal the mindset of the Democrats as being profoundly anti-liberal, anti-freedom of expression and anti-democratic.
Which is an amazing response Marteau’s actual comment:
What is more relevant is what is the Yingluck government going to do to reform Section 112. They have the power and popular mandate to go for significant reform. Let’s see how they do
Why did Andrew direct the discussion to the Democrats and not comment on what the PTP is going to do?
Could it be because the PTP is made up of people with exactly the agenda to “attack the freedoms loved by many of their own voters and don’t care about establishing any kind of meaningful and principled political platform.”
But to do that, he would have to admit what type of people he has been backing.
There is little doubt that the western liberals who think the PTP share their views are in for very sad awakening over the next few months.
Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
Marteau
What is interesting about Mallika’s comments are that they reveal the mindset of the Democrats as being profoundly anti-liberal, anti-freedom of expression and anti-democratic.
But we already knew that.
What is also of interest is that a party supposedly aspiring towards being electable would even attack the freedoms loved by many of their own voters. It’s like they just don’t care about establishing any kind of meaningful and principled political platform. Again this is not now. For me all this just further reveals how out of touch the Dems are, how little they care about the democratic process and the ongoing danger they represent to Thailand’s attempts to democratise itself.
These scary and completely unelectable people, epitomised by Mallika, are waiting in the wings and would be more than willing to take power, by hook or by crook whilst using excessive violence and threats in order to do so.
Thailand’s Fearlessness: Free Akong
The issue should not only be freeing Agong but to reform the 112 to prevent abusive use by individual groups and politicians. If we continue to allow this abusiveness of using the law, Agong won’t be the last one that needs a campaign to be freed.
Thailand’s Fearlessness: Free Akong
O.K. so you started a campaign. Where can I find information on this campaign? What are its objectives? what do you define as fearlessness in the struggle against LM?
Ah Kong and his family
Jesse – 23
History shaped the present Jesse, like how the Vasille treaty directly responsible for WWII. The emerged of Islamic extremist in Iran was the result of 1953 coup detat which desposed the democratically elected Mosaddegh and replaced with the autocratic Shah (sounded familiar?). Without understanding history, we ought to repeat the mistake we made.
Now, may I ask, what kind of problem are you referring to?
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
re alleged openness to criticism, perhaps it should properly be regarded as no more an attempt at sending a “message” to evil toxin and hence insincere politicing?
Thailand’s Fearlessness: Free Akong
Only Arkhong?
Are there are any more persons (Thais or foreigners) convicted of lese majeste that are awaiting royal clemency? All should be pardoned.
The toll of flooding on lives and politics
Vichai N – 39
You totally missed the point here, the water level in the dam suppose to be below 20%-30% (depending on the size of the dam) during August to braced for the monsoon season. If we have a half full dam (50% level) then it is too late. Its because they start to released water heavily at the end of August, that’s why its start flooded from September onward. If you check the rate of “water released daily” for all the major dams (Buhimipol and Sirikit namely) you will see that they had had released very little water during April-June (although its a dry season). There’s nothing much Yingluck can do, she official took office on Aug 17th, much too late to do anything.
Furthermore, about her being novice, its obviouse that you don’t know much about PT (or former PPP), since her brother departure, Yingluck has been the main actor hehind the scene running PPP and PT for her brother, she is no novice just because you just know of her exitance recently. She was there all along since PPP time.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
I have said again and again that anybody who thinks the K is opposed to LM should reconsider their stance. The final stage of the legislative process in Thailand (and most countries which have the Monarchy) is that the Monarch needs to ‘sign’ (the legal term is “give royal assent”) for the law to have effect. Thus, any law which the Monarch refuses to sign will never become law.
If the King is so opposed to LM, why did he sign to approve the law when Tanin Kraivixien increased the penalty of LM to fifteen years? Why did he sign to approve the law when the Military Dictatorship government eradicated the clause “criticism of the Monarch is allowed for reasons of upholding the Constitution and democracy”? What one says and what one does has to be consonant with each other. If the King says “I believe I should be criticised”, then what he did is he approved to increase penalty for LM and eliminated the opportunity for one to criticise him for political reasons, then it is just hypocritical. Thai people say this kind of conduct is “р╕бр╕╖р╕нр╕Цр╕╖р╕нр╕кр╕▓р╕Б р╕Ыр╕▓р╕Бр╕Цр╕╖р╕нр╕ир╕╡р╕е” (A person who preaches peace and morality, while holding a pestle, ready to smash anyone at the same time).
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Marteau – 71
I didn’t want to go into detail but his speech was not the disapproval of 112 but rather a threat.
Malaysia – Defending the Constitution
Hi Tony,
Thanks for the input, but it’s factually inaccurate. Yes, CIJ gets money from NED and other sources. The sources you name do NOT fully fund the organisation. CIJ gratefully receives funding, both in-kind and monetary, from volunteers, UNESCO and others – I don’t think you can really call UNESCO a US stooge! We have always been open about where we receive funding, and have turned money down when it either did not fit in with our aims and objectives, or if we had concerns that there were political strings attached. CIJ sets the goals and targets of the organisation, in consultation with a range of stake-holders, and we take money from those willing to help us reach those goals.
Your comment belittles the amount of primarily time but sometimes money that CIJ receives from Malaysian journalists, musicians and artists – those who are at the receiving end of government censorship and repression.
And I, personally, am not funded by anyone. I’m currently a stay-at-home Mum, former journalist and lecturer, who does not draw a salary. Since leaving the organisation as full-time staff, I have consistently given more to CIJ than I have received, primarily through in-kind donations of time and resources.
Regards,
Sonia
More academic commentary on Burma
[…] [5] Online comment of October 31st, 2007, to a web-posting on New Mandala: http://www.newmandala.org/2007/10/20/more-academic-commentary-on-burma/ […]
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
If the king is so opposed to LM, why is it that LM expands under the most royalist of governments? Thanin was a privy councillor. So was Surayud. And there is little doubt that Abhisit did the palace’s work. All the reference to the king’s speech back when is dissembling nonsense.
Ah Kong and his family
Jesse: I really appreciate your insights. I had never before thought that “People like you [the apparently academic Tarrin] who started the problem.” Now that I know that it has been powerful academics who have been killing and imprisoning Thais for decades, I can rest easy. I had always thought it was the police and army that had impunity on state murder. Now I realise I was wrong. Thanks indeed. I can now read Land Destroyer with a new awareness.
The toll of flooding on lives and politics
” . . .I am beginning to wonder if Khun Vichai actually understands the politics of water management . . Has Vichai not heard of EGAT? . ..”(Shane #36)
I couldn’t imagine EGAT suggesting to PM Yingluck in August2011 to keep more water when the dams are already near bursting and the monsoon season has only just begun.
Vichai N frankly does not have to understand politics of water management. I only know for a fact that Yingluck was a novice, untested in politics and unprepared in crisis situations, and, a clone full of insecurities and doubts goaded to assume the premiership by Thaksin as his surrogate.
Swamped by too many distractions perhaps, Yingluck was NOT paying attention even as the north of Thailand was already being heavily inundated by slow moving monster floods. Indecisive perhaps . . . she kept postponing to make the decision . . . hoping, desperately hoping.
In my opinion the devastations and death from the monster natural disaster could have been diminished, significantly diminished if Yingluck and her crew were paying attention.
Thailand’s latest lese majeste disgrace
Tom Hoy @36 is right. The penalties for lese majeste were sharply increased by a Thai government in the past without any public expression by the King to the effect that the earlier penalties were insufficient. Demanding that HMK should directly involve himself in the law making process today to reform Section 112 is ludicrous. He has already publicly expressed the view that he wants to be open to criticism. It is up to the Yingluck and its legal expert, Chalern Yoobamrung, to pick up the ball and run with it.
Mallika Boonmetrakul: an appalling Thai Politician
Of course this is childish rubbish from Khun Mallika but her party is not in power and not in a position to implement any of this stuff. So it is irrelevant.
What is more relevant is what is the Yingluck government going to do to reform Section 112. They have the power and popular mandate to go for significant reform. Let’s see how they do.