There is another explanation for why the road map was not accepted. Perhaps this violence and terrible loss of life that we now see was the ultimate objective – if there was no dissolution. There were many threats for blood to flow, and much talk about war. Maybe the harder elements of the Reds felt the road map offered no more than they were offered in the televised negotiations – and that if blood flowed, it might stir a mass uprising. That the million that were promised would take to the streets of Bangkok, and that the provinces would burn.
Of course, some of the yellows have also been crying for blood and have a lot to gain from ‘terrorist violence’.
So who gains from this kind of violence? Will it further the democratic cause? Will it lead to political reform, to resolving the persistent problems of inequality, land title, debt etc. Or will it lead to a popular call for order from those despairing with apparent chaos – on the back of which a more familiar type of Thai government might emerge?
As someone said – don’t be afraid of the government you have now, but be afraid of the government to come.
Thank you so much for your articles and thank God that you are ok.
I have many friends who doesn’t believe that Red Shirts is not “Terrorists”. They just believe anything that Thai Gov. announces through Thai TV.
I just can’t believe that my own Thai friends support Thai Army to kill the red shirts!
I’m so worry about the situation and the protestors. I always believe that they need REAL democracy for my country and they are now fighting for it. I shame on myself that can not do anything to help them.
One thing I can do is to share some truth to everyone I know including your articles and pray to God for my country peaceful.
Thanks again and God Bless
Orawan S. F.
A Thai Girl Who Doesn't Take Sides and Wants Peace says:
This is going to be a long note, but I want our overseas friends to understand what has been happening here in Thailand. You would only see the soldiers’ shooting scenes or injured people being carried away on international TV channels for 30 seconds, but never got to know about the background. The truth is, the Thai government has been too accommodating by withholding the use of force since the rally started 2 months ago (with the exception of 10th April event, when the soldiers were ordered to move in without live weapons and subsequently got slaughtered by unknown gunmen shooting from the ‘Red Shirt’ protesters).
The majority of us support the government in dealing with the terrorists hidden amongst the protesters. It held talks with the rally leaders and offered peace solutions to them 10 days ago. The Prime Minister publicly urged the protesters to disperse for fear of violence created by the terrorists. But the plan wasn’t accepted. So, it’s time to block food and water supplies entering the center of the protest. If the protesters were peaceful, they wouldn’t rush out to throw rocks, firecrackers and even bombs at the soldiers’ barricade — thus, causing the soldiers to defend themselves by firing rubber bullets and live rounds.
It has been very frustrating for the law-abiding citizen of Bangkok — we even voiced our dissatisfaction at the government for its failure to uphold the laws. The situation was like Bangkok was being held for ransom. A lot of businesses got affected because it’s right in the middle of the major commercial area.
Again, think what your government would do if there were a large group of protesters blocking all traffic at Orchard Road in Singapore; Times Square in NYC; Ginza in Tokyo; or Knightsbridge in London for two months. They set up barricades to search through personal belongings of everyone travelling through the area. Also think what it would do if those protesters invaded a nearby hospital, causing doctors & nurses to evacuate patients — some of whom are newborn babies in incubators and those in ICU — to other hospitals. And most important of all, think what it would do if the protesters were found to have large stockpile of M79 grenades, M16 & AK47 assault rifles.
Do you think your government would be as tolerant as the Thai government?
If you can understand Thai, you will know that a topless guy asked for a weapon (maybe a gun) from a guy wearing sunglasses but the second guy rejeted his request. He was afraid that the first might not be able to aim at the right target. Later, an armed men in black ran back and called out “soldiers”. Then they all ran into the small street.
* Published: 16/05/2010 at 12:00 AM
* Newspaper section: News
I’m not in a popularity contest. I’m not a two-faced diplomat playing it safe and trying to please everyone. So let me say it loud and clear: It’s a rebellion, so put an end to it _ with swiftness, severity and certainty.
The military coup in 2006 wrongly overthrew the then democratically elected prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra. That was no democracy.
The coup council handed the power back to the people in 2007. The People Power Party (PPP) won the following election. That was democracy.
The PPP was banned by the Constitution Court for electoral irregularities and the parliament _ the democratically elected representatives of Thailand _ voted the Democrats into power. That was democracy.
The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) argue against the Democrat-led coalition government’s legitimacy and protest for the government to step down and call a general election.
That was democracy.
And the UDD had won.
The goals of the UDD from the very start: They wanted a House dissolution. They will have one in September. They wanted a general election. They will have one on Nov 14. All within seven months and PM Abhisit Vejjajiva’s term actually ends in January 2012, a year and a half from now.
They should be dancing in the streets, celebrating victory. Then we can all go to the voting booth in November. Peace and democracy. But no.
The truth has revealed itself. The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship is simply using democracy as a front in the interests of dictatorship.
Refusing the peaceful compromise, forsaking the democratic process, continuing to harm the country for the interests of one man, Thaksin Shinawatra, fighting against security forces of the rightful democratic government of Thailand _ that’s an uprising, it’s a rebellion.
It’s criminal. That is not democracy.
If you disagree with me and think the UDD is in the right, then let me simplify it: The next time you’re pulled over by the law in a traffic stop, you should just burn tyres, shoot slingshots at the cop and call him a dictator.
Anyone with an arrest warrant? No need to surrender. Barricade and fortify your home, fire slingshots and fire-crackers and call the law tyrannical.
Buy a lifetime membership to the Association of Anarchists. You don’t belong in a civilisation.
The UDD leaders agreed to the prime minister’s terms. But instead, Thaksin Shinawatra ordered Maj Gen Khattiya Sawasdipol to step on the brake. Because in his mind, he’s screaming: ”What about me!” ”What do I get out of this entire peace and democracy shenanigans!”
Here’s Thaksin’s dilemma. Peace and the democratic process don’t guarantee his return to power. Someone in Montenegro is kicking and screaming on the floor: ”Me! Me! Me! What about me!”
Accepting the compromise is a loss of face and may even make PM Abhisit look good in the eyes of the people, for biting the bullet and extending his hand. Thaksin Shinawatra can no longer rely on the voting booths. He can no longer rely on the democratic process.
The UDD has used democracy as a tool _ manipulated and exploited it to return Thaksin to power. Now that they are no longer confident that the democratic process will serve their interests, the UDD has transformed itself from a democratic movement into an uprising, a rebellion, a criminal organisation.
It’s worth repeating: They wanted a House dissolution. They have one in September. They wanted a general election. They have one on Nov 14. That’s democracy. Instead, they flushed democracy down the toilet.
So there’s no negotiation other than the complete and total capitulation by the government to the UDD’s every will and every whim. It’s a total victory that will embarrass the government in the eyes of the Kingdom and of the world and may possibly bury the Democrat party. That’s the game.
To Thaksin and the UDD, returning Thaksin to power is worth the 50-odd lives already lost. And that figure is bound to rise. More than 1,000 have been injured and that figure will rise. The billions of baht in economic damage. And that figure will rise.
It’s an uprising. It’s a rebellion. It’s criminal.
The UDD is screaming: ”Now! Now! Now! Prime Minister resign now!” Thaksin Shinawatra is crying: ”Me! Me! Me! I want my power back!” That’s not democracy. That’s a child that needs to be put across the lap for a good spanking.
Let me repeat it again: They wanted democracy. They had democracy. We can all go to the voting booth on Nov 14. But they flushed democracy down the toilet and chose instead, a rebellion.
And when there’s a rebellion, the government must put down the rebellion. Otherwise, we have anarchy. The law must be swift, severe and certain _ any student of criminology can tell you that.
I’ve watched television and read newspapers all this weekend. Most so-called intellectuals, academics and media talk about reconciliation. Well, that’s easy and safe _ using a thousand flowery words without saying anything worthwhile.
We reap what we sow. Again, I’m not in a popularity contest. I’m not a two-faced diplomat playing it safe and trying to please everyone. So let me say it loud and clear _ it’s a rebellion. To preserve civilisation, the government must put down the rebellion _ swift, severe and certain.
UDD members have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible. But they’ve died in a rebellion against the rightful, democratic government of Thailand.
The security forces that have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible.
Journalists and other innocent bystanders have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible.
It didn’t have to come to this. It shouldn’t have come to this. But here we are on the brink of anarchy because of the pride, greed and vengefulness of one man, and of the indecisiveness, uncertainty and lack of leadership of another.
Let me repeat: We reap what we sow. It’s a rebellion. Put an end to it, swift, severe and certain. Or step down and let the rebels take over. The longer this crisis drags on, the closer we are and the deeper we will be in a state of anarchy.
As a Thai who may be included in the “Ammart Society,” I don’t understand the logic of those who think that the Thai media, controlled by the Govt, are neutral while the international media are biased…
There was clear evidence that a hardcore group within the UDD was mingling with innocent protesters during the clash in April. Here is an interesting article about the shadowy gunmen:
These hardcore fighters have been using innocent red followers as shields. It is inevitable that there will be more casualties to come as the two sides are using heavy arms against each other. This is not a peaceful protest. Their aim is to provoke confrontation as has been happening over the last few days. This one group of people is making their own selfish demands just like the PAD did. Unarguably some of their actions are totally unacceptable like their raid on the hospital. They are also well armed.
Re Dove: whatever the sentiments, one has to ask whether Reungvit Nandhabiwat is simply a “business owner” or
— close to Finance Minister Korn via their both working with JF in investment/asset management?
— from a longstanding elite family which owned (before they really screwed up) the Laem Thong bank whose board included at different times much of the power elite of the politics-palace nexus including names like Thanarat, Pratipasen, Promyothi, Bhirombhakdi, Sampatsiri, Prachuabmoh, and a host of other important players from the 1940s to 1980s.
— from a family also closely linked to the royal Pramojs
I am disgusted by the tactics employed by this illegitimate government, the use of mercenary snipers, the head shots. I am even more disgusted by the biased coverage these crimes are receiving in the worldwide mainstream media.
As it is, I will not return to Thailand until a new government is in place and the current thugs have been tried for their crimes.
I also call for an immediate international boycott of “Made in Thailand” products. And don’t let anyone come forward with an argument that this would be negative for the people; the people do not starve in this beautiful country. Better they suffer financially for a while, on the road to achieving freedom and democracy than to suffer the thuggery of the current clique that runs the country from behind the scenes.
@ Mugford. Your Israeli video of the firing of an M79 grenade launcher seems to disprove your point, since there is quite a lot of smoke coming out of the grenade launcher fired by the guy in the night shirt, only is blown away immediately by the strong wind.
The weapon being fired by the non-violent red shirt protestor doesn’t look like a flare gun at all which is normally a snub nosed type of pistol. It looks just like the pistol grip version of the M79 grenade launcher that looks like a sawed off shotgun and is very convenient for urban guerilla warfare due its ease of concealment, even though it is not so accurate. There is, indeed, quite a lot of smoke, as indeed there is in your example but you don’t know what kind of 40mm ammunition the reds are using. The amount of smoke produced by any kind of gun varies a lot according to the type of powder used in the load. For example the same pistol will make a lot more smoke using cheap locally produced ammunition from Thai Firearms than it will with ammunition imported from the US or Europe. Maybe the Boss has been cutting corners again.
I don’t think the red shirts would go for the shopping malls, as both Siam Paragon and Central World is located on land owned by The Bureau of the Crown Property.
As scary as this article is, and suggestive of police state tactics, it also shows that the soldiers are probably just as scared. This close proximity skirmishing, between unarmed farmers, and armed but young soldiers, is never going to end well.
But despite the threats and shouting, it is slightly comforting to know that once the protesters were wounded and cornered, the soldiers allowed some sort of aid and help, however begrudgingly.
There is a backbone of morality from both sides that stops this escalating into cold Thai-on-Thai butchering, like what may be seen in west African countries.
In every situation that involves man, there are always different points of views involved; some truthful, more accurate than others. However, a lot of us that reside here in Thailand believe that some of the foreign press are depicting situation here rather unfairly, be it with intent or without.
It seems most news releases are to defame the government for harming innocent civilians; when in fact, the military force, under state of emergency, is fighting armed terrorist group that use civilians as their human shields. In order to leave minimum damage and to bring peace back to the country as soon as possible, the military force has been ordered to use rubber bullets in the operation. Only in restricted zone that real bullets are being used; and with prior notice.
If we may dare ask, “aren’t journalists supposed to remain objective & unbiased?” With that said, we plead for foreign press compliance in fulfilling these rather small requests; being the worldly acclaimed journalists that you all are.
With the use of our proficiency in English, we, Thai people, hope to publish the “Truth” of the situation to the best of our abilities.
CORE NOTIONS
1. The government has announced protesters to leave Rajprasong site and nearby area. The protest is considered unlawful act of terror.
2. ‘Red Shirts’ who refuse to leave are in the intention of escalating violence and causing unrest.
3. Red Shirts leaders are the reasons behind all violence. They arouse and provoke protesters to incite violence and chaos
4. Red Shirts leaders hide themselves behind human shields of women and children. Majority of protesters in Rajprasong site don’t know that they are being used as pawns
5. The government has never intended for any violence to happen and is not involved in Seh. Dang’s shooting
FOR YOUR COOPERATION
1. Please help us find facts if possible with photographs or video clips from news footage and articles within Thailand.
2. Please translate into English and paste it on this page in facebook. We can all use it to copy-paste onto other international websites.
3. We will try to spread these facts to as many as possible international websites as possible.
4. Please write in style of bulletin so it is short and straight to the point.
Unconfirmed reports that 300 M16s & Tarvers drawn from army store for an assassination attempt on red shirt leaders tonight by Newin thugs & PAD.
This might be why the government was urgently wanting to get all women and children out, if there is going to be “hired mercenaries” raiding the red shirt camp tonight.
Turning a blind eye to it happening does not make you “not guilty” Abhisit !
Watch closely all events now, there could be a large group of shooters allowed to pass all Army checkpoints on their way to kill people, could be tonight or any day soon.
“men in uniform inciting violence”? as I said in my “Sunday Morning in Bangkok” Les’ piece [#10 blog]/it seems Panitan is conceding to the existence of hired border mercenaries to do much of the dirty work that I have just been informed about & who were introduced by Newin. But it is hard to see that he was not informed of these “infiltrated” (or rather planted) “hired killers”, though not impossible given the lies and deceit from Abhisit and his associates. Panitan is an establishment wannbe; he teaches international relations courses at Chula; his doctoral studies reflects his strategic and defence study interests; he is a specialist trainer for the army, and spent most of time outside of the academy with right wing elements in the military. His motivation to be the mouthpiece of such lies and misrepresentations? money, fame, notability, who knows?
Marko of Ruamkatanyu reports 1,000 people at Rama 4 protest site near Klong Toey market. A new Rajaprasong?
9 minutes ago via mobile web
Much anger here. One man says, “The people’s army is killing the people. Please help us.”
12 minutes ago via mobile web
Thai govt seems to think it’s quashing the protest. My sense is it’s igniting new ones.
24 minutes ago via mobile web
Talked to Yellow Shirt & “non-Thaksin Red” near Rama 4. Both furious with military, govt. “This is not my govt anymore,” said one.
35 minutes ago via mobile web
“This is going to be a long note, but I want my overseas friends to understand what has been happening here in Thailand. You would only see the soldiers’ shooting scenes or injured people being carried away on international TV channels for 30 seconds, but never got to know about the background. The truth is, the Thai government has been too accommodating by withholding the use of force since the rally started 2 months ago (with the exception of 10th April event, when the soldiers were ordered to move in without live weapons and subsequently got slaughtered by unknown gunmen shooting from the ‘Red Shirt’ protesters).
The majority of us support the government in dealing with the terrorists hidden amongst the protesters. It held talks with the rally leaders and offered peace solutions to them 10 days ago. The Prime Minister publicly urged the protesters to disperse for fear of violence created by the terrorists. But the plan wasn’t accepted. So, it’s time to block food and water supplies entering the center of the protest. If the protesters were peaceful, they wouldn’t rush out to throw rocks, firecrackers and even bombs at the soldiers’ barricade — thus, causing the soldiers to defend themselves by firing rubber bullets and live rounds.
It has been very frustrating for the law-abiding citizen of Bangkok — we even voiced our dissatisfaction at the government for its failure to uphold the laws. The situation was like Bangkok was being held for ransom. A lot of businesses got affected because it’s right in the middle of the major commercial area.
Again, think what your government would do if there were a large group of protesters blocking all traffic at Orchard Road in Singapore; Times Square in NYC; Ginza in Tokyo; or Knightsbridge in London for two months. They set up barricades to search through personal belongings of everyone travelling through the area. Also think what it would do if those protesters invaded a nearby hospital, causing doctors & nurses to evacuate patients — some of whom are newborn babies in incubators and those in ICU — to other hospitals. And most important of all, think what it would do if the protesters were found to have large stockpile of M79 grenades, M16 & AK47 assault rifles.
Do you think your government would be as tolerant as the Thai government?
Reungvit Nandhabiwat
Business owner, Bangkok, Thailand
15 May 2010”
Clearly, these people think that the foreign press have not been following the chain of events in Thailand. However, I think that overseas media know more about the conflict in Thailand than many Thais who have just started to read news on politics when it starts to literally affect their lives.
‘”Unfortunately parts of Thai public opinion seems prone to loud Thaksin demogoguery, the one man cult worship mass hysteria approach.””
===================
There is only one, “one man cult worship mass hysteria'”, in Thailand, in fact, one of world history’s most successful ‘”one man cult worship hysteria” programs, and it is not organized around a man named Thaksin.
re: other comments suggesting a certain person “step in”to calm the situation and help people find a “Middle Way”‘, would that person possibly be the same person who approved the present cleansing Thailand of red shirts operation, and if so, how would that be possible for the person who gave the generals the green light for the Final Solution to the Red Shirt Question to also serve as an ‘”impartial”‘ mediator………..
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Reds’ fatal flaw: Thailand’s fatal flaw
There is another explanation for why the road map was not accepted. Perhaps this violence and terrible loss of life that we now see was the ultimate objective – if there was no dissolution. There were many threats for blood to flow, and much talk about war. Maybe the harder elements of the Reds felt the road map offered no more than they were offered in the televised negotiations – and that if blood flowed, it might stir a mass uprising. That the million that were promised would take to the streets of Bangkok, and that the provinces would burn.
Of course, some of the yellows have also been crying for blood and have a lot to gain from ‘terrorist violence’.
So who gains from this kind of violence? Will it further the democratic cause? Will it lead to political reform, to resolving the persistent problems of inequality, land title, debt etc. Or will it lead to a popular call for order from those despairing with apparent chaos – on the back of which a more familiar type of Thai government might emerge?
As someone said – don’t be afraid of the government you have now, but be afraid of the government to come.
Nick Nostitz in the killing zone
Dear Nick
Thank you so much for your articles and thank God that you are ok.
I have many friends who doesn’t believe that Red Shirts is not “Terrorists”. They just believe anything that Thai Gov. announces through Thai TV.
I just can’t believe that my own Thai friends support Thai Army to kill the red shirts!
I’m so worry about the situation and the protestors. I always believe that they need REAL democracy for my country and they are now fighting for it. I shame on myself that can not do anything to help them.
One thing I can do is to share some truth to everyone I know including your articles and pray to God for my country peaceful.
Thanks again and God Bless
Orawan S. F.
Nick Nostitz in the killing zone
This is going to be a long note, but I want our overseas friends to understand what has been happening here in Thailand. You would only see the soldiers’ shooting scenes or injured people being carried away on international TV channels for 30 seconds, but never got to know about the background. The truth is, the Thai government has been too accommodating by withholding the use of force since the rally started 2 months ago (with the exception of 10th April event, when the soldiers were ordered to move in without live weapons and subsequently got slaughtered by unknown gunmen shooting from the ‘Red Shirt’ protesters).
The majority of us support the government in dealing with the terrorists hidden amongst the protesters. It held talks with the rally leaders and offered peace solutions to them 10 days ago. The Prime Minister publicly urged the protesters to disperse for fear of violence created by the terrorists. But the plan wasn’t accepted. So, it’s time to block food and water supplies entering the center of the protest. If the protesters were peaceful, they wouldn’t rush out to throw rocks, firecrackers and even bombs at the soldiers’ barricade — thus, causing the soldiers to defend themselves by firing rubber bullets and live rounds.
It has been very frustrating for the law-abiding citizen of Bangkok — we even voiced our dissatisfaction at the government for its failure to uphold the laws. The situation was like Bangkok was being held for ransom. A lot of businesses got affected because it’s right in the middle of the major commercial area.
Again, think what your government would do if there were a large group of protesters blocking all traffic at Orchard Road in Singapore; Times Square in NYC; Ginza in Tokyo; or Knightsbridge in London for two months. They set up barricades to search through personal belongings of everyone travelling through the area. Also think what it would do if those protesters invaded a nearby hospital, causing doctors & nurses to evacuate patients — some of whom are newborn babies in incubators and those in ICU — to other hospitals. And most important of all, think what it would do if the protesters were found to have large stockpile of M79 grenades, M16 & AK47 assault rifles.
Do you think your government would be as tolerant as the Thai government?
Bangkok at war
I don’t know exactly what the red shirt guy was firing but it surely wasn’t a slingshot.
Remember the raid on two factories illegally producing grenade launchers? Were they making them exactly to the original specs?
They quite possibly could be crude knock offs that only resemble the originals.
The fact is that about two dozen grenades were fired at both civilians and the army in the past couple of days.
Nick Nostitz in the killing zone
Watch this clip, especially at 0.37 and 1.00-1.03. Is this unarmed red-shirt people? Take a close look again if you say so.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Td7lKYBfH1A&feature=player_embedded
If you can understand Thai, you will know that a topless guy asked for a weapon (maybe a gun) from a guy wearing sunglasses but the second guy rejeted his request. He was afraid that the first might not be able to aim at the right target. Later, an armed men in black ran back and called out “soldiers”. Then they all ran into the small street.
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
Re Polo
It just saddened me that his note is so popular and widely shared among my friends….
Here is another popular article on Facebook:
http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/37395/put-an-end-to-this-rebellion/page-1/?awesm=fbshare.me_AMdsW
Put an end to this rebellion
* Published: 16/05/2010 at 12:00 AM
* Newspaper section: News
I’m not in a popularity contest. I’m not a two-faced diplomat playing it safe and trying to please everyone. So let me say it loud and clear: It’s a rebellion, so put an end to it _ with swiftness, severity and certainty.
The military coup in 2006 wrongly overthrew the then democratically elected prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra. That was no democracy.
The coup council handed the power back to the people in 2007. The People Power Party (PPP) won the following election. That was democracy.
The PPP was banned by the Constitution Court for electoral irregularities and the parliament _ the democratically elected representatives of Thailand _ voted the Democrats into power. That was democracy.
The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) argue against the Democrat-led coalition government’s legitimacy and protest for the government to step down and call a general election.
That was democracy.
And the UDD had won.
The goals of the UDD from the very start: They wanted a House dissolution. They will have one in September. They wanted a general election. They will have one on Nov 14. All within seven months and PM Abhisit Vejjajiva’s term actually ends in January 2012, a year and a half from now.
They should be dancing in the streets, celebrating victory. Then we can all go to the voting booth in November. Peace and democracy. But no.
The truth has revealed itself. The United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship is simply using democracy as a front in the interests of dictatorship.
Refusing the peaceful compromise, forsaking the democratic process, continuing to harm the country for the interests of one man, Thaksin Shinawatra, fighting against security forces of the rightful democratic government of Thailand _ that’s an uprising, it’s a rebellion.
It’s criminal. That is not democracy.
If you disagree with me and think the UDD is in the right, then let me simplify it: The next time you’re pulled over by the law in a traffic stop, you should just burn tyres, shoot slingshots at the cop and call him a dictator.
Anyone with an arrest warrant? No need to surrender. Barricade and fortify your home, fire slingshots and fire-crackers and call the law tyrannical.
Buy a lifetime membership to the Association of Anarchists. You don’t belong in a civilisation.
The UDD leaders agreed to the prime minister’s terms. But instead, Thaksin Shinawatra ordered Maj Gen Khattiya Sawasdipol to step on the brake. Because in his mind, he’s screaming: ”What about me!” ”What do I get out of this entire peace and democracy shenanigans!”
Here’s Thaksin’s dilemma. Peace and the democratic process don’t guarantee his return to power. Someone in Montenegro is kicking and screaming on the floor: ”Me! Me! Me! What about me!”
Accepting the compromise is a loss of face and may even make PM Abhisit look good in the eyes of the people, for biting the bullet and extending his hand. Thaksin Shinawatra can no longer rely on the voting booths. He can no longer rely on the democratic process.
The UDD has used democracy as a tool _ manipulated and exploited it to return Thaksin to power. Now that they are no longer confident that the democratic process will serve their interests, the UDD has transformed itself from a democratic movement into an uprising, a rebellion, a criminal organisation.
It’s worth repeating: They wanted a House dissolution. They have one in September. They wanted a general election. They have one on Nov 14. That’s democracy. Instead, they flushed democracy down the toilet.
So there’s no negotiation other than the complete and total capitulation by the government to the UDD’s every will and every whim. It’s a total victory that will embarrass the government in the eyes of the Kingdom and of the world and may possibly bury the Democrat party. That’s the game.
To Thaksin and the UDD, returning Thaksin to power is worth the 50-odd lives already lost. And that figure is bound to rise. More than 1,000 have been injured and that figure will rise. The billions of baht in economic damage. And that figure will rise.
It’s an uprising. It’s a rebellion. It’s criminal.
The UDD is screaming: ”Now! Now! Now! Prime Minister resign now!” Thaksin Shinawatra is crying: ”Me! Me! Me! I want my power back!” That’s not democracy. That’s a child that needs to be put across the lap for a good spanking.
Let me repeat it again: They wanted democracy. They had democracy. We can all go to the voting booth on Nov 14. But they flushed democracy down the toilet and chose instead, a rebellion.
And when there’s a rebellion, the government must put down the rebellion. Otherwise, we have anarchy. The law must be swift, severe and certain _ any student of criminology can tell you that.
I’ve watched television and read newspapers all this weekend. Most so-called intellectuals, academics and media talk about reconciliation. Well, that’s easy and safe _ using a thousand flowery words without saying anything worthwhile.
We reap what we sow. Again, I’m not in a popularity contest. I’m not a two-faced diplomat playing it safe and trying to please everyone. So let me say it loud and clear _ it’s a rebellion. To preserve civilisation, the government must put down the rebellion _ swift, severe and certain.
UDD members have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible. But they’ve died in a rebellion against the rightful, democratic government of Thailand.
The security forces that have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible.
Journalists and other innocent bystanders have lost their lives. This is unfortunate. It should never have happened. They should all be in our prayers and their families should be assisted in any way possible.
It didn’t have to come to this. It shouldn’t have come to this. But here we are on the brink of anarchy because of the pride, greed and vengefulness of one man, and of the indecisiveness, uncertainty and lack of leadership of another.
Let me repeat: We reap what we sow. It’s a rebellion. Put an end to it, swift, severe and certain. Or step down and let the rebels take over. The longer this crisis drags on, the closer we are and the deeper we will be in a state of anarchy.
[email protected]
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
As a Thai who may be included in the “Ammart Society,” I don’t understand the logic of those who think that the Thai media, controlled by the Govt, are neutral while the international media are biased…
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
There was clear evidence that a hardcore group within the UDD was mingling with innocent protesters during the clash in April. Here is an interesting article about the shadowy gunmen:
http://uk.reuters.com/article/idUKTRE63C34020100413
These hardcore fighters have been using innocent red followers as shields. It is inevitable that there will be more casualties to come as the two sides are using heavy arms against each other. This is not a peaceful protest. Their aim is to provoke confrontation as has been happening over the last few days. This one group of people is making their own selfish demands just like the PAD did. Unarguably some of their actions are totally unacceptable like their raid on the hospital. They are also well armed.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/2010/may/14/thailand-troops-advance-protesters-live
Remember that Arisman Pongreungrong encouraged the Red followers to bring one-litre bottles to Bangkok for use as petrol bombs?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4z6wguu-klA&feature=player_embedded
How can people possibly consider this a peaceful protest?
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
Re Dove: whatever the sentiments, one has to ask whether Reungvit Nandhabiwat is simply a “business owner” or
— close to Finance Minister Korn via their both working with JF in investment/asset management?
— from a longstanding elite family which owned (before they really screwed up) the Laem Thong bank whose board included at different times much of the power elite of the politics-palace nexus including names like Thanarat, Pratipasen, Promyothi, Bhirombhakdi, Sampatsiri, Prachuabmoh, and a host of other important players from the 1940s to 1980s.
— from a family also closely linked to the royal Pramojs
A Sunday morning look at Bangkok
I am disgusted by the tactics employed by this illegitimate government, the use of mercenary snipers, the head shots. I am even more disgusted by the biased coverage these crimes are receiving in the worldwide mainstream media.
As it is, I will not return to Thailand until a new government is in place and the current thugs have been tried for their crimes.
I also call for an immediate international boycott of “Made in Thailand” products. And don’t let anyone come forward with an argument that this would be negative for the people; the people do not starve in this beautiful country. Better they suffer financially for a while, on the road to achieving freedom and democracy than to suffer the thuggery of the current clique that runs the country from behind the scenes.
Bangkok at war
@ Mugford. Your Israeli video of the firing of an M79 grenade launcher seems to disprove your point, since there is quite a lot of smoke coming out of the grenade launcher fired by the guy in the night shirt, only is blown away immediately by the strong wind.
The weapon being fired by the non-violent red shirt protestor doesn’t look like a flare gun at all which is normally a snub nosed type of pistol. It looks just like the pistol grip version of the M79 grenade launcher that looks like a sawed off shotgun and is very convenient for urban guerilla warfare due its ease of concealment, even though it is not so accurate. There is, indeed, quite a lot of smoke, as indeed there is in your example but you don’t know what kind of 40mm ammunition the reds are using. The amount of smoke produced by any kind of gun varies a lot according to the type of powder used in the load. For example the same pistol will make a lot more smoke using cheap locally produced ammunition from Thai Firearms than it will with ammunition imported from the US or Europe. Maybe the Boss has been cutting corners again.
Take another look at the two videos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyNT4Nn7uR0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyNT4Nn7uR0&feature=related
Thailand’s sideshow is over
I don’t think the red shirts would go for the shopping malls, as both Siam Paragon and Central World is located on land owned by The Bureau of the Crown Property.
Nick Nostitz in the killing zone
As scary as this article is, and suggestive of police state tactics, it also shows that the soldiers are probably just as scared. This close proximity skirmishing, between unarmed farmers, and armed but young soldiers, is never going to end well.
But despite the threats and shouting, it is slightly comforting to know that once the protesters were wounded and cornered, the soldiers allowed some sort of aid and help, however begrudgingly.
There is a backbone of morality from both sides that stops this escalating into cold Thai-on-Thai butchering, like what may be seen in west African countries.
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
There is also another Facebook note with a similar tone:
http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=390338578639&id=749448528&ref=mf
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
Unconfirmed reports that 300 M16s & Tarvers drawn from army store for an assassination attempt on red shirt leaders tonight by Newin thugs & PAD.
This might be why the government was urgently wanting to get all women and children out, if there is going to be “hired mercenaries” raiding the red shirt camp tonight.
Turning a blind eye to it happening does not make you “not guilty” Abhisit !
Watch closely all events now, there could be a large group of shooters allowed to pass all Army checkpoints on their way to kill people, could be tonight or any day soon.
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
“men in uniform inciting violence”? as I said in my “Sunday Morning in Bangkok” Les’ piece [#10 blog]/it seems Panitan is conceding to the existence of hired border mercenaries to do much of the dirty work that I have just been informed about & who were introduced by Newin. But it is hard to see that he was not informed of these “infiltrated” (or rather planted) “hired killers”, though not impossible given the lies and deceit from Abhisit and his associates. Panitan is an establishment wannbe; he teaches international relations courses at Chula; his doctoral studies reflects his strategic and defence study interests; he is a specialist trainer for the army, and spent most of time outside of the academy with right wing elements in the military. His motivation to be the mouthpiece of such lies and misrepresentations? money, fame, notability, who knows?
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
From journalist who does work for TIME magazine
http://twitter.com/Journotopia
Marko of Ruamkatanyu reports 1,000 people at Rama 4 protest site near Klong Toey market. A new Rajaprasong?
9 minutes ago via mobile web
Much anger here. One man says, “The people’s army is killing the people. Please help us.”
12 minutes ago via mobile web
Thai govt seems to think it’s quashing the protest. My sense is it’s igniting new ones.
24 minutes ago via mobile web
Talked to Yellow Shirt & “non-Thaksin Red” near Rama 4. Both furious with military, govt. “This is not my govt anymore,” said one.
35 minutes ago via mobile web
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
This is a note that has been posted and re-posted on Facebook
http://www.facebook.com/?ref=home#!/note.php?note_id=103595633019476&id=1039051882
“This is going to be a long note, but I want my overseas friends to understand what has been happening here in Thailand. You would only see the soldiers’ shooting scenes or injured people being carried away on international TV channels for 30 seconds, but never got to know about the background. The truth is, the Thai government has been too accommodating by withholding the use of force since the rally started 2 months ago (with the exception of 10th April event, when the soldiers were ordered to move in without live weapons and subsequently got slaughtered by unknown gunmen shooting from the ‘Red Shirt’ protesters).
The majority of us support the government in dealing with the terrorists hidden amongst the protesters. It held talks with the rally leaders and offered peace solutions to them 10 days ago. The Prime Minister publicly urged the protesters to disperse for fear of violence created by the terrorists. But the plan wasn’t accepted. So, it’s time to block food and water supplies entering the center of the protest. If the protesters were peaceful, they wouldn’t rush out to throw rocks, firecrackers and even bombs at the soldiers’ barricade — thus, causing the soldiers to defend themselves by firing rubber bullets and live rounds.
It has been very frustrating for the law-abiding citizen of Bangkok — we even voiced our dissatisfaction at the government for its failure to uphold the laws. The situation was like Bangkok was being held for ransom. A lot of businesses got affected because it’s right in the middle of the major commercial area.
Again, think what your government would do if there were a large group of protesters blocking all traffic at Orchard Road in Singapore; Times Square in NYC; Ginza in Tokyo; or Knightsbridge in London for two months. They set up barricades to search through personal belongings of everyone travelling through the area. Also think what it would do if those protesters invaded a nearby hospital, causing doctors & nurses to evacuate patients — some of whom are newborn babies in incubators and those in ICU — to other hospitals. And most important of all, think what it would do if the protesters were found to have large stockpile of M79 grenades, M16 & AK47 assault rifles.
Do you think your government would be as tolerant as the Thai government?
Reungvit Nandhabiwat
Business owner, Bangkok, Thailand
15 May 2010”
Clearly, these people think that the foreign press have not been following the chain of events in Thailand. However, I think that overseas media know more about the conflict in Thailand than many Thais who have just started to read news on politics when it starts to literally affect their lives.
A Sunday morning look at Bangkok
re: jonfernquest
‘”Unfortunately parts of Thai public opinion seems prone to loud Thaksin demogoguery, the one man cult worship mass hysteria approach.””
===================
There is only one, “one man cult worship mass hysteria'”, in Thailand, in fact, one of world history’s most successful ‘”one man cult worship hysteria” programs, and it is not organized around a man named Thaksin.
re: other comments suggesting a certain person “step in”to calm the situation and help people find a “Middle Way”‘, would that person possibly be the same person who approved the present cleansing Thailand of red shirts operation, and if so, how would that be possible for the person who gave the generals the green light for the Final Solution to the Red Shirt Question to also serve as an ‘”impartial”‘ mediator………..
Abhisit’s iron fist – Sunday
Images from Ubon.