I hope you realize that you’re rolling around in irony when mentioning spin-doctors.
Again, this is not about what the King “deserves” (whatever that is in your mind). Its about the propaganda. Getting the King these awards is hardly a sign of a competent Foreign Service. Getting him the Nobel Peace Prize would truly be talented, regardless of whatever an outgoing UN Secretary General says. If the King’s achievements go beyond any other human being’s, why don’t we just make him the Supreme Ruler of the Universe? For everything else, there’s a few worthwhile Prizes lying around already, no need for any new ones.
The propaganda surrounding the King is hardly a “Thai myth.” As many Thais see through it as foreigners are deceived by it. When a foreign diplomat works with Thai officials, its easy to only see one side of the story and very easy to oblige their pride by awarding an unknown award or even making one up.
Your argument here relies almost entirely on perceptions. You compare and compare, but the truth is, these awards mean not a lot. I am not a spin doctor nor do I want to see the monarchy abolished. If you insist that I am merely spouting “spin”, why don’t you answer those questions I posed in my post above? Or how about you buying me a Philae Medal from UNESCO?
Just open your eyes and accept the fact that these “awards” are as meaningless as the honorary degrees the royals hold. You can continue to think of them as benevolent supermen, that is your choice, but please don’t try to delude us (and yourself) by overplaying the significance of these awards. You should see the number of medals the Burmese generals wear.
As a Thai, I view monarchy pragmatically. They will rise and fall, they will come and go. If Thai history is any precedent to go by, even regicide can be justified (King Taksin, anyone?). If it has outlived its usefulness, it must go.
It’s not so much that anyone dislikes the king because he is the king. What people dislike, I suspect, is the concealment of the truth, the endless sycophantic idolizing and the suppression of anything critical of the man.
To the Jops of this world I have a question: can you give any examples at all of criticism of the king which you consider fair and valid? No one’s perfect, are they?
It’s so ironic that the original script has not been that widespreaded.
I searched for it on the internet, and it is difficult to find. I don’t think any Thai newspaper provides the script. Matichon provides the translation. The Manager has an analysis of the speech, which I don’t think is worth reading cause everyone know what they want.
I don’t think any Thai newspaper provides the original transcript. Is it because they are afraid of the Les Majeste as well? Does reporting the Les Majeste material count as Les Majeste? (I remember that the manager was accused of Les Majeste when they reported Sulak’s case years ago).
Anyway, if only a few people have read what he actually said, then it is sad that people are willing to criticise without looking at the real evidence. They are willing to read the Manager or listening to the Democrat MPs and believe them. I wonder, for people that have read the speech, do you actually believe that Jakkrapob can be accused of Les Majeste?
For me, I have read it, and strongly think that nothing in his speech is “offensive” to the monarchy. It’s just a normal analysis of Thai democracy (which would inevitable touch the monarchy).
It’s weired that this speech can be accused of Les Majeste. I mean, if this is the case, then the analysis of anything in Thailand that touches on the Monarchy is impossible.
“…He greeted Prem with a wai. Prem simply stood still with his face grim and listened to Thaksin. The only words that Prem said to Thaksin were: “Maybe later.””
“If article 297 was eliminated and Thaksin paid a penalty for his Ample Rich dealings, and Samak served out his term?”
Sounds good jonfernquest, I’d take that compromise (my “national hoping project” according to Teth!) and hope TycoonSondhi, MajGenChamlong and PMThaksin does too… then “fiction” might just become a reality!
And it just might, I was pretty surprise to see PMThaksin wai PMPrem at GenAnupong’s mother’s funeral followed by a seemingly amicable 5 minutes talk… (and it may not be merely coincidence with the resignation of Jakrapob)
I am still waiting for your lived memory of Thai politics, Teth. As a common Thai to another common Thai, let’s be transparent and honest with our agendas (we might just start the small ball of change rolling!). Practice what you preach if you really value “honesty, hard work, and integrity”…
In my past two and a half decades of lived memory (minus the fun fun-filled childhood days, ofcourse), I have observed change and evolution in Thai society – from what you are saying, it seems that you haven’t seen any??? Be a man (or woman? it doesn’t matter) and let’s hear your side of the story, Teth…
The Bangkok Post reported today that Col. Wattanasak filed a fresh lese majeste complaint against Jonathan Head of the BBC related to the FCCT panel discussion.
Having been publicly accused myself of lese majeste by an overzealous monarchy-patronizing insincere and apparently half-insane Thai but not having had to undergo detailed investigation because there was no evidence (and charges were based on fraudulent claims), I can personally attest to the horrendously painful atmosphere that criminal lese majeste charges in Thailand can produce. People of ill-will, ignorant and indignant for perceived but unprovable in courts outside Thailand slights – but totally forgiving of their own religious and social irresponsibilities – seem to take glee in persecuting others using the monarchy as The Big Hammer.
There is little desire on the part of these sanctimonious troublemakers to arrive at a just resolution of social misunderstanding (on their part), but only to punish and denounce. The lese majeste law is Thailand is really little other than a tool of the police to whip deviants, and is used with distasteful enforcement and punishment. Yes, there are those who are guilty of lese majeste, but why not get this tool out of the hands of the zealots and into the hands of the monarchy itself? Thai police are not to be entrusted with this serious breach of the human ethic. They are, like the rest of Thai society, often unethical, duplicitous, self-serving and ignorant of the negative human conditions they help perpetuate in the Land of Smiles.
The level of sanctimony in Thailand is indeed nauseous, and sadly too often exposed in so-called defense of the revered monarchy. His Majesty himself has many times told the Thai people – who apparently are not listening closely enough – that they have double-standards and cause him headache and trouble by proceeding with lese majeste cases. Why not take a hint and revamp the procedure? It needs it. I have asked the Thai police to revamp it based on the following )and of course, have not received any reply):
7. In addition to the request for an investigation into criminal conspiracy and negligence leading to human rights abuses, I respectfully and humbly ask authorities to kindly review the process of filing lese majesty charges for possible reform as the process is conducted here in Thailand. It seems, for example, that it would be a significant ethical improvement in the process if those making charges of lese majesty were required to:
7.1. sign a sworn statement [affidavit] that the lese majesty accusation is true, accurate and fair to the best of their knowledge.
7.2. sign a separate statement/paragraph that they are aware of possible legal consequences (civil and/or criminal) should the charge be unsupported or determined to be false, etc.
7.3. sign a statement/paragraph that they have no personal motivations or prejudices against the person charged and that the lese majesty complaint is made on the basis of full ethical consideration toward all concerned.
7.4. That local police registering the complaint also sign a statement that they feel the charge is warranted to pass on to central authorities for prosecution, and that a copy of this statement, with supporting documents, is provided to the accused at the time of filing.
7.5. The person accused of lese majesty should also have an early opportunity to make a statement to police before they send the complaint to Bangkok. Although the lese majesty complaint is a unique and serious matter here in Thailand, it has often been abused by those with vested interests, unfair bias and even criminal motives. The police are in a unique position to determine this, and should provide everyone involved at the early stages with an opportunity to respond to the local charge before it becomes an official charge.
Yeah, i read some critical remarks about the King and felt compelled to say something. It was the feeling of injustice of people making unfair criticism.
In any case, it seems there are people here who, once they read some positive comments made about the King, are just as quick to jump in and try to refute it.
While Kofi Annan clearly made a point to say that this was the first ever UNDP Lifetime Award being granted to anyone, obviously making a point that the King’s achievements was truly so exceptional that he deserved something new to be distinguished from others, the spin doctors here were quick to suggest otherwise.
Funnily enough, the spin doctors also want us to believe that Thailand has a very talented foreign service who could go around the world and manage to convince intelligent people in international organizations to believing Thai “myths”. You know what? There are people who look at the facts before believing things. But clearly, these are not the kind of people these spin doctors wish to associate themselves with in here.
I can understand people disagreeing with the idea of the monarchy as an institution but I find it rather disappointing that there are some people who seem to immediately dislike the King simply because of his status as a monarch. I am sure there are atheists who strongly disagree with the idea of religion, but that doesn’t mean it is right that they should go around and ,for example, try to convince others that the praises Mother Teresa receives is all due to myth-making and her legion of Christian priests, sisters and believers who travel everywhere spreading the “myths”.
Why are people afraid to say I disagree with the monarchy institution, but I do admit the King has done many things out of his compassion and love which benefits innumerable poor and needy people in Thailand.
Are these the same people who are afraid to admit that most of the democratically elected leaders in Thailand have, in sharp and utter contrast, brought about so much harm and grief to the Thais through their corruption, abuse of power and unlimited greed and selfishness.
Thanks a lot for sharing this interesting info with us all.
Given the fact that Prince SuphaSawat had ever since the incident in 1946 tried to defend Pridi, to reconcile Pridi with Bhumibol and, as you say, to find the way out for both Pridi and Bhumibol (and I may addd, to cite the Prince himself in that letter you mention, to ‘lift a great weight off [his] mind’ over the incident), your story makes perfect sense and sounds very true.
However, I wonder if you could perhaps give further info or speculate or comment on the following.
(to continue below. I try breaking up my post to see if it works, after trying to post the full text over 30 times since yesterday but never succeeded.)
Well done Teth. Excellent work. Most of these awards are given to the king because Thai diplomats are ordered to go out and find awards that he can receive. It is all a part of the myth-making.
Jop – read something, anything, critical of the king and stop being such a propagandist.
So I can expect that some here are gonna say all these respectable international organizations were all “fooled” into thinking that the King is worthy of receiving these awards?
No, but can you name anyone else have received these awards?
Its called international diplomacy. Just like how HMK probably has the most number of honorary degrees to his name.
Let me do a little critical analysis of your medal list.
1) UN Development Programme (UNDP)’s Human Development Lifetime Achievement Award – HMK was the first ever recipient of this award. They may not have created it for him, but its far from prestigious–yet.
2) Norman Borlaug Medallion
Again, HMK is first to receive this prize, which is itself a “second place” prize for people who not normally get a “World Food Prize”.
3) United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) awarded His Majesty the Philae Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions in rural development and quality of life promotion.
A search in Google for the Philae Medal shows only 4 pages of results (if you search “Philae Medal” with the parentheses). Most of these results are websites from Thailand, but the only non-Thai website mentioning the Philae Medal and UNESCO says that “UNESCO itself is selling a ‘Philae Medal.’ Struck in gold, silver and bronze, the medal commemorates a campaign that will not only save “The Pearl of Egypt” but, when the mammoth job is completed two years from now, provide it with a new setting worthy of the old.” Apparently the Philae Medal is part of a campaign to save Philae.
4) the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) awarded His Majesty the UNEP Gold Medal of Distinction in recognition of long dedicated, exemplary and eminent contributions to the improvement of the environment and nature conservation.
I cannot even find who else has received this award. The UNEP’s website only lists 2 awards it gives, the Sasakawa Prize and Champions of the Earth.
And so forth…. Most of these prizes are not on any main page of their respective agencies. Surprising, seeing that these prizes are supposed to publicly honor their recipients? Not good if most of the world doesn’t know the prize exists.
Google searches for these prizes will usually bring up Thai websites. Surprising again? So much for “international” recognition. As I said, they are acts of diplomacy.
The whole point of this is not to “smear” HMK as you claim. I merely want Thai people to take a step back and view the monarchy is a reasonable light. Or is it only acceptable to give the monarchy over-the-top praise?
BTW, these prizes don’t make him the “Father of Thai innovation”. Hopefully you can spot the ridiculousness of “Thai innovation”.
Sidh: “Let PMSamak and the PPP government do the best job they could for the rest of their term and face another election.”
Yes, a cooling off period is in order, to stop the escalation of the conflict.
Sidh: “…it is up to PMThaksin really…”
Since Thaksin currently has the advantage, he might be able to concede something (a “concession” (sorry)) to end the dispute.
But can Chamlong Srimuang and Sondhi Limtangkul, who seem rather self-righteously and scarily bent on forcing a coup, really be stopped by a concession?
Some say the Ample Rich case is pretty solid and that the PPP side is going to do everything in its power to unfreeze those 8 billion in assets.
Article 297 was like a guaranteed street fight with the guilt of one party official implicating the whole party.
In short, it’s a mess and the economy continues to suffer, and it’s hard to see how this mess could be resolved amicably with a compromise from both sides, except of course, by His Majesty the King.
If article 297 was eliminated and Thaksin paid a penalty for his Ample Rich dealings, and Samak served out his term?
I see your national hoping project is coming along nicely, Sidh.
When you’re ready to try and change yourself and things around you, give me a call. Otherwise, continue to write that piece of fiction, because what are the chances that PM Thaksin is willing to change if common Thais aren’t?
3) United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) awarded His Majesty the Philae Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions in rural development and quality of life promotion.
4) the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) awarded His Majesty the UNEP Gold Medal of Distinction in recognition of long dedicated, exemplary and eminent contributions to the improvement of the environment and nature conservation.
5) the World Bank presented the Award of Recognition of technical and development accomplishment in the promotion of the vetiver technology international.
6) the United Nations International Drug Control Programme (UNDCP) presented the Award of Appreciation in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions to drug control efforts in Thailand.
7) the Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) awarded His Majesty the Agricola Medal in recognition of HisMajesty’s devotion to the well-being and happiness of all people in Thailand, particularly those who till the soil, lend the waters and nurture the forests.
8) the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) presented the Award of Recognition of His Majesty’s strong support for meteorology and operational hydrology.
9) the Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) presented the Tele Food Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s dedication to Thailand’s agriculture development, with the aim of raising the farmers’ standard of living and establishing food security.
10) the World Health Organization (WHO) presented theWHO Plaque in recognition of His Majesty’s unstinting and powerful moral leadership and example in public health.
11) International Merit Award, in recognition of His Majesty’s contribution to the use of vetiver for soil conservation and environmental improvement, presented by the International Erosion Control Association
12) ICCIDD Gold Medal, in recognition of His Majesty’s leadership, guidance and direction to the National IDD Control Project, presented by International Council for the Control of Iodine Deficiency Disorders (ICCIDD)
13) Lions Humanitarian Award, in recognition of His Majesty’s passionate and personal interest in, and devotion to, improving the quality of life and well-being of the Thai people, especially in the areas of health and education, presented by the International Association of Lions Clubs
14) UN-Habitat Scroll of Honour Award (special citation) in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contribution to sustaining habitats and improving the quality of the Thai people’s lives, presented by United Nations Human Settlements Programme
Ok, I am gonna stop now because to list any more would be pointless as i don’t think any more proof is needed to make my case. I had also not bothered to provide all links to prove the truth of the above as anyone who wants to check can just do an online search for themselves.
So I can expect that some here are gonna say all these respectable international organizations were all “fooled” into thinking that the King is worthy of receiving these awards?
Are some gonna argue that the King got them because of his status? Because that is certainly not true. Show me a monarch of any other country that has received even half the amount of awards the Thai king has.
So it’ clearly not about status. It is about achievements. Worthy achievements.
I saw some saying the doi tung project was a failure. But in fact The Doi Tung Development Project was awarded permission by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC) to affix the UNODC label on Doi Tung products.
The UNODC label reads: “United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime. The sale of this product contributes to the achievement of drug free world. Through alternative sustainable development, villagers who once depended on opium production and use can now earn secure legitimate incomes by making these products.”
“The trouble is, I would gather that the much vaunted poor rural electorate really has no really idea of what debate actually is, not that it’s their fault. Didn’t all the “intellectuals” sort of guide them in public hearings for the 1997 People’s constitution?”
A highly valid point jonfernquest – maybe this explains the ‘we already represent them, no need to ask them attitude’ amongst PPP MPs. According to them, the Democrats can do the Bangkok middle-class’ bidding.
However, if we are to avoid the street fight followed by coup scenario you outlined, opening up the constitution modification process is one of the few ways. It must be done with ‘sincerity’ though – which is increasingly difficult in an atmosphere where no one seems to trust anyone anymore. It has to be concurrently a participatory and educative process for Thais of all walks of life. It needs lots of time and patience…
Otherwise, just don’t change the constitution. Let PMSamak and the PPP government do the best job they could for the rest of their term and face another election. If PMThaksin truly believe in his innocence, or that he can manipulate the court process anyway, or simply decides to be ‘sincere’ to the country, just let the alleged corruption cases be deliberated in the courts of law. Sacrifice himself and set a new precedent where a former PM is convicted for the first time in Thai political/judicial history. Follow in the footsteps of South Korea where a former president as been jailed. With that precedent, there’s a greater possibility that cases against politician, bureucrat, businessmen, high-ranking soldiers can be tried…
Society can, then, just move closer to Teth’s ideal. I think we need that evolution and, at this point, it is up to PMThaksin really. He can just whisper into Newin’s and Chai Chidchob’s ears and say “enough boys, you’ve more than proven your loyalty. I will not use electoral politics to whitewash my wrongdoings and will fight the cases (transparently it is hoped) in the courts”… “why don’t you work hard for the people and PMSamak… don’t corrupt too much – 25% of project costs is too much – let’s practice some ‘sufficiency’ with 5%”…
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Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
I hope you realize that you’re rolling around in irony when mentioning spin-doctors.
Again, this is not about what the King “deserves” (whatever that is in your mind). Its about the propaganda. Getting the King these awards is hardly a sign of a competent Foreign Service. Getting him the Nobel Peace Prize would truly be talented, regardless of whatever an outgoing UN Secretary General says. If the King’s achievements go beyond any other human being’s, why don’t we just make him the Supreme Ruler of the Universe? For everything else, there’s a few worthwhile Prizes lying around already, no need for any new ones.
The propaganda surrounding the King is hardly a “Thai myth.” As many Thais see through it as foreigners are deceived by it. When a foreign diplomat works with Thai officials, its easy to only see one side of the story and very easy to oblige their pride by awarding an unknown award or even making one up.
Your argument here relies almost entirely on perceptions. You compare and compare, but the truth is, these awards mean not a lot. I am not a spin doctor nor do I want to see the monarchy abolished. If you insist that I am merely spouting “spin”, why don’t you answer those questions I posed in my post above? Or how about you buying me a Philae Medal from UNESCO?
Just open your eyes and accept the fact that these “awards” are as meaningless as the honorary degrees the royals hold. You can continue to think of them as benevolent supermen, that is your choice, but please don’t try to delude us (and yourself) by overplaying the significance of these awards. You should see the number of medals the Burmese generals wear.
As a Thai, I view monarchy pragmatically. They will rise and fall, they will come and go. If Thai history is any precedent to go by, even regicide can be justified (King Taksin, anyone?). If it has outlived its usefulness, it must go.
The Devil’s Discus – in Thai
[…] The Devil’s Discus – in Thai – р╕Бр╕Зр╕Ир╕▒р╕Бр╕гр╕Ыр╕╡р╕ир╕▓р╕И Andrew Walker New Mandala: May 29th, 2008 […]
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
It’s not so much that anyone dislikes the king because he is the king. What people dislike, I suspect, is the concealment of the truth, the endless sycophantic idolizing and the suppression of anything critical of the man.
To the Jops of this world I have a question: can you give any examples at all of criticism of the king which you consider fair and valid? No one’s perfect, are they?
What did Jakrapob say?
It’s so ironic that the original script has not been that widespreaded.
I searched for it on the internet, and it is difficult to find. I don’t think any Thai newspaper provides the script. Matichon provides the translation. The Manager has an analysis of the speech, which I don’t think is worth reading cause everyone know what they want.
I don’t think any Thai newspaper provides the original transcript. Is it because they are afraid of the Les Majeste as well? Does reporting the Les Majeste material count as Les Majeste? (I remember that the manager was accused of Les Majeste when they reported Sulak’s case years ago).
Anyway, if only a few people have read what he actually said, then it is sad that people are willing to criticise without looking at the real evidence. They are willing to read the Manager or listening to the Democrat MPs and believe them. I wonder, for people that have read the speech, do you actually believe that Jakkrapob can be accused of Les Majeste?
For me, I have read it, and strongly think that nothing in his speech is “offensive” to the monarchy. It’s just a normal analysis of Thai democracy (which would inevitable touch the monarchy).
It’s weired that this speech can be accused of Les Majeste. I mean, if this is the case, then the analysis of anything in Thailand that touches on the Monarchy is impossible.
Samak’s talents!
On PMThaksin’s meeting with PMPrem, a contrasting ‘tales of two newspapers”:
http://www.thairath.co.th/news.php?section=politics03&content=91790 :
“… р╣Бр╕ер╕░р╣Ар╕лр╕Щр╕╖р╕нр╕нр╕╖р╣Ир╕Щр╣Гр╕Ф р╕Бр╕▒р╕Ър╕ар╕▓р╕Юр╕Вр╣Ир╕▓р╕зр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Ыр╕гр╕▓р╕Бр╕Пр╕Ър╕Щр╕лр╕Щр╣Йр╕▓р╕лр╕Щр╕╢р╣Ир╕Зр╕лр╕Щр╕▒р╕Зр╕кр╕╖р╕н р╕Юр╕┤р╕бр╕Юр╣Мр╣Бр╕Чр╕Ър╕Чр╕╕р╕Бр╕Йр╕Ър╕▒р╕Ъ р╕Ю.р╕Х.р╕Ч.р╕Чр╕▒р╕Бр╕йр╕┤р╕У р╕Кр╕┤р╕Щр╕зр╕▒р╕Хр╕г р╕нр╕Фр╕╡р╕Хр╕Щр╕▓р╕вр╕Бр╕гр╕▒р╕Рр╕бр╕Щр╕Хр╕гр╕╡ р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕вр╕Бр╕бр╕╖р╕нр╣Др╕лр╕зр╣Й “р╕Ыр╣Лр╕▓р╣Ар╕Ыр╕гр╕б” р╕Юр╕е.р╕н.р╣Ар╕Ыр╕гр╕б р╕Хр╕┤р╕Ур╕кр╕╣р╕ер╕▓р╕Щр╕Щр╕Чр╣М р╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╕Шр╕▓р╕Щр╕нр╕Зр╕Др╕бр╕Щр╕Хр╕гр╕╡р╣Бр╕ер╕░р╕гр╕▒р╕Рр╕Ър╕╕р╕гр╕╕р╕й р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕вр╕┤р╣Йр╕бр╕вр╕Бр╕бр╕╖р╕нр╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╣Др╕лр╕зр╣Й…”
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008/05/31/headlines/headlines_30074449.php
“…He greeted Prem with a wai. Prem simply stood still with his face grim and listened to Thaksin. The only words that Prem said to Thaksin were: “Maybe later.””
What did Jakrapob say?
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008/05/27/headlines/headlines_30074013.php
The Nation provides the whole video of the speech split into three parts.
Samak’s talents!
“If article 297 was eliminated and Thaksin paid a penalty for his Ample Rich dealings, and Samak served out his term?”
Sounds good jonfernquest, I’d take that compromise (my “national hoping project” according to Teth!) and hope TycoonSondhi, MajGenChamlong and PMThaksin does too… then “fiction” might just become a reality!
And it just might, I was pretty surprise to see PMThaksin wai PMPrem at GenAnupong’s mother’s funeral followed by a seemingly amicable 5 minutes talk… (and it may not be merely coincidence with the resignation of Jakrapob)
I am still waiting for your lived memory of Thai politics, Teth. As a common Thai to another common Thai, let’s be transparent and honest with our agendas (we might just start the small ball of change rolling!). Practice what you preach if you really value “honesty, hard work, and integrity”…
In my past two and a half decades of lived memory (minus the fun fun-filled childhood days, ofcourse), I have observed change and evolution in Thai society – from what you are saying, it seems that you haven’t seen any??? Be a man (or woman? it doesn’t matter) and let’s hear your side of the story, Teth…
Lèse majesté and the BBC
31 May 2008
The Bangkok Post reported today that Col. Wattanasak filed a fresh lese majeste complaint against Jonathan Head of the BBC related to the FCCT panel discussion.
Having been publicly accused myself of lese majeste by an overzealous monarchy-patronizing insincere and apparently half-insane Thai but not having had to undergo detailed investigation because there was no evidence (and charges were based on fraudulent claims), I can personally attest to the horrendously painful atmosphere that criminal lese majeste charges in Thailand can produce. People of ill-will, ignorant and indignant for perceived but unprovable in courts outside Thailand slights – but totally forgiving of their own religious and social irresponsibilities – seem to take glee in persecuting others using the monarchy as The Big Hammer.
There is little desire on the part of these sanctimonious troublemakers to arrive at a just resolution of social misunderstanding (on their part), but only to punish and denounce. The lese majeste law is Thailand is really little other than a tool of the police to whip deviants, and is used with distasteful enforcement and punishment. Yes, there are those who are guilty of lese majeste, but why not get this tool out of the hands of the zealots and into the hands of the monarchy itself? Thai police are not to be entrusted with this serious breach of the human ethic. They are, like the rest of Thai society, often unethical, duplicitous, self-serving and ignorant of the negative human conditions they help perpetuate in the Land of Smiles.
The level of sanctimony in Thailand is indeed nauseous, and sadly too often exposed in so-called defense of the revered monarchy. His Majesty himself has many times told the Thai people – who apparently are not listening closely enough – that they have double-standards and cause him headache and trouble by proceeding with lese majeste cases. Why not take a hint and revamp the procedure? It needs it. I have asked the Thai police to revamp it based on the following )and of course, have not received any reply):
7. In addition to the request for an investigation into criminal conspiracy and negligence leading to human rights abuses, I respectfully and humbly ask authorities to kindly review the process of filing lese majesty charges for possible reform as the process is conducted here in Thailand. It seems, for example, that it would be a significant ethical improvement in the process if those making charges of lese majesty were required to:
7.1. sign a sworn statement [affidavit] that the lese majesty accusation is true, accurate and fair to the best of their knowledge.
7.2. sign a separate statement/paragraph that they are aware of possible legal consequences (civil and/or criminal) should the charge be unsupported or determined to be false, etc.
7.3. sign a statement/paragraph that they have no personal motivations or prejudices against the person charged and that the lese majesty complaint is made on the basis of full ethical consideration toward all concerned.
7.4. That local police registering the complaint also sign a statement that they feel the charge is warranted to pass on to central authorities for prosecution, and that a copy of this statement, with supporting documents, is provided to the accused at the time of filing.
7.5. The person accused of lese majesty should also have an early opportunity to make a statement to police before they send the complaint to Bangkok. Although the lese majesty complaint is a unique and serious matter here in Thailand, it has often been abused by those with vested interests, unfair bias and even criminal motives. The police are in a unique position to determine this, and should provide everyone involved at the early stages with an opportunity to respond to the local charge before it becomes an official charge.
I am, of course, interested in any comments.
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
Yeah, i read some critical remarks about the King and felt compelled to say something. It was the feeling of injustice of people making unfair criticism.
In any case, it seems there are people here who, once they read some positive comments made about the King, are just as quick to jump in and try to refute it.
While Kofi Annan clearly made a point to say that this was the first ever UNDP Lifetime Award being granted to anyone, obviously making a point that the King’s achievements was truly so exceptional that he deserved something new to be distinguished from others, the spin doctors here were quick to suggest otherwise.
Funnily enough, the spin doctors also want us to believe that Thailand has a very talented foreign service who could go around the world and manage to convince intelligent people in international organizations to believing Thai “myths”. You know what? There are people who look at the facts before believing things. But clearly, these are not the kind of people these spin doctors wish to associate themselves with in here.
I can understand people disagreeing with the idea of the monarchy as an institution but I find it rather disappointing that there are some people who seem to immediately dislike the King simply because of his status as a monarch. I am sure there are atheists who strongly disagree with the idea of religion, but that doesn’t mean it is right that they should go around and ,for example, try to convince others that the praises Mother Teresa receives is all due to myth-making and her legion of Christian priests, sisters and believers who travel everywhere spreading the “myths”.
Why are people afraid to say I disagree with the monarchy institution, but I do admit the King has done many things out of his compassion and love which benefits innumerable poor and needy people in Thailand.
Are these the same people who are afraid to admit that most of the democratically elected leaders in Thailand have, in sharp and utter contrast, brought about so much harm and grief to the Thais through their corruption, abuse of power and unlimited greed and selfishness.
Summary of discussion at ANU on Cyclone Nargis
[…] strangest, if not the most offensive, have been claims that journalists, diplomats and aid workers have exaggerated the death […]
The Devil’s Discus – in Thai
Dear Khun Paul,
Thanks a lot for sharing this interesting info with us all.
Given the fact that Prince SuphaSawat had ever since the incident in 1946 tried to defend Pridi, to reconcile Pridi with Bhumibol and, as you say, to find the way out for both Pridi and Bhumibol (and I may addd, to cite the Prince himself in that letter you mention, to ‘lift a great weight off [his] mind’ over the incident), your story makes perfect sense and sounds very true.
However, I wonder if you could perhaps give further info or speculate or comment on the following.
(to continue below. I try breaking up my post to see if it works, after trying to post the full text over 30 times since yesterday but never succeeded.)
What did Jakrapob say?
http://www.opm.go.th/opminter/translation/translate.html
This is the website Jakkrapob himself provided (before he left office, of course) containing
1. Thai transcripts of Jakkrapob’s speech, translated by Jakkrapob himself and his team.
2. English transcript of Jakkrapob’s speech.
3. Thai transcript of part of Jakkrapob’s speech done by the police officer who filed LM charge against Jakkrapob and Head.
4. Thai transcript of Jakkrapob’s speech, translated by the Democrat Party.
All in pdf.
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
Well done Teth. Excellent work. Most of these awards are given to the king because Thai diplomats are ordered to go out and find awards that he can receive. It is all a part of the myth-making.
Jop – read something, anything, critical of the king and stop being such a propagandist.
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
So I can expect that some here are gonna say all these respectable international organizations were all “fooled” into thinking that the King is worthy of receiving these awards?
No, but can you name anyone else have received these awards?
Its called international diplomacy. Just like how HMK probably has the most number of honorary degrees to his name.
Let me do a little critical analysis of your medal list.
1) UN Development Programme (UNDP)’s Human Development Lifetime Achievement Award – HMK was the first ever recipient of this award. They may not have created it for him, but its far from prestigious–yet.
2) Norman Borlaug Medallion
Again, HMK is first to receive this prize, which is itself a “second place” prize for people who not normally get a “World Food Prize”.
Basically is HMK second tier to these Laureates?
3) United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) awarded His Majesty the Philae Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions in rural development and quality of life promotion.
A search in Google for the Philae Medal shows only 4 pages of results (if you search “Philae Medal” with the parentheses). Most of these results are websites from Thailand, but the only non-Thai website mentioning the Philae Medal and UNESCO says that “UNESCO itself is selling a ‘Philae Medal.’ Struck in gold, silver and bronze, the medal commemorates a campaign that will not only save “The Pearl of Egypt” but, when the mammoth job is completed two years from now, provide it with a new setting worthy of the old.” Apparently the Philae Medal is part of a campaign to save Philae.
The link
You can buy a Philae medal from Unesco here
4) the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) awarded His Majesty the UNEP Gold Medal of Distinction in recognition of long dedicated, exemplary and eminent contributions to the improvement of the environment and nature conservation.
I cannot even find who else has received this award. The UNEP’s website only lists 2 awards it gives, the Sasakawa Prize and Champions of the Earth.
UNEP Awards
And so forth…. Most of these prizes are not on any main page of their respective agencies. Surprising, seeing that these prizes are supposed to publicly honor their recipients? Not good if most of the world doesn’t know the prize exists.
Google searches for these prizes will usually bring up Thai websites. Surprising again? So much for “international” recognition. As I said, they are acts of diplomacy.
The whole point of this is not to “smear” HMK as you claim. I merely want Thai people to take a step back and view the monarchy is a reasonable light. Or is it only acceptable to give the monarchy over-the-top praise?
BTW, these prizes don’t make him the “Father of Thai innovation”. Hopefully you can spot the ridiculousness of “Thai innovation”.
Samak’s talents!
Sidh: “Let PMSamak and the PPP government do the best job they could for the rest of their term and face another election.”
Yes, a cooling off period is in order, to stop the escalation of the conflict.
Sidh: “…it is up to PMThaksin really…”
Since Thaksin currently has the advantage, he might be able to concede something (a “concession” (sorry)) to end the dispute.
But can Chamlong Srimuang and Sondhi Limtangkul, who seem rather self-righteously and scarily bent on forcing a coup, really be stopped by a concession?
Some say the Ample Rich case is pretty solid and that the PPP side is going to do everything in its power to unfreeze those 8 billion in assets.
Article 297 was like a guaranteed street fight with the guilt of one party official implicating the whole party.
In short, it’s a mess and the economy continues to suffer, and it’s hard to see how this mess could be resolved amicably with a compromise from both sides, except of course, by His Majesty the King.
If article 297 was eliminated and Thaksin paid a penalty for his Ample Rich dealings, and Samak served out his term?
Samak’s talents!
I see your national hoping project is coming along nicely, Sidh.
When you’re ready to try and change yourself and things around you, give me a call. Otherwise, continue to write that piece of fiction, because what are the chances that PM Thaksin is willing to change if common Thais aren’t?
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
Would like to share with you all further the fact that the King is internationally renown for his development/humanitarian achievements:
1) UN Development Programme (UNDP)’s Human Development Lifetime Achievement Award
http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=18625&Cr=Thai&Cr1=
2) Norman Borlaug Medallion http://www.worldfoodprize.org/press_room/2006/october/thai-king-borlaug-medallion.htm
3) United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO) awarded His Majesty the Philae Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions in rural development and quality of life promotion.
4) the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) awarded His Majesty the UNEP Gold Medal of Distinction in recognition of long dedicated, exemplary and eminent contributions to the improvement of the environment and nature conservation.
5) the World Bank presented the Award of Recognition of technical and development accomplishment in the promotion of the vetiver technology international.
6) the United Nations International Drug Control Programme (UNDCP) presented the Award of Appreciation in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contributions to drug control efforts in Thailand.
7) the Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) awarded His Majesty the Agricola Medal in recognition of HisMajesty’s devotion to the well-being and happiness of all people in Thailand, particularly those who till the soil, lend the waters and nurture the forests.
8) the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) presented the Award of Recognition of His Majesty’s strong support for meteorology and operational hydrology.
9) the Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) presented the Tele Food Medal in recognition of His Majesty’s dedication to Thailand’s agriculture development, with the aim of raising the farmers’ standard of living and establishing food security.
10) the World Health Organization (WHO) presented theWHO Plaque in recognition of His Majesty’s unstinting and powerful moral leadership and example in public health.
11) International Merit Award, in recognition of His Majesty’s contribution to the use of vetiver for soil conservation and environmental improvement, presented by the International Erosion Control Association
12) ICCIDD Gold Medal, in recognition of His Majesty’s leadership, guidance and direction to the National IDD Control Project, presented by International Council for the Control of Iodine Deficiency Disorders (ICCIDD)
13) Lions Humanitarian Award, in recognition of His Majesty’s passionate and personal interest in, and devotion to, improving the quality of life and well-being of the Thai people, especially in the areas of health and education, presented by the International Association of Lions Clubs
14) UN-Habitat Scroll of Honour Award (special citation) in recognition of His Majesty’s outstanding contribution to sustaining habitats and improving the quality of the Thai people’s lives, presented by United Nations Human Settlements Programme
Ok, I am gonna stop now because to list any more would be pointless as i don’t think any more proof is needed to make my case. I had also not bothered to provide all links to prove the truth of the above as anyone who wants to check can just do an online search for themselves.
So I can expect that some here are gonna say all these respectable international organizations were all “fooled” into thinking that the King is worthy of receiving these awards?
Are some gonna argue that the King got them because of his status? Because that is certainly not true. Show me a monarch of any other country that has received even half the amount of awards the Thai king has.
So it’ clearly not about status. It is about achievements. Worthy achievements.
Exhibition: The King – “Father of Thai Innovation”
I saw some saying the doi tung project was a failure. But in fact The Doi Tung Development Project was awarded permission by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC) to affix the UNODC label on Doi Tung products.
The UNODC label reads: “United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime. The sale of this product contributes to the achievement of drug free world. Through alternative sustainable development, villagers who once depended on opium production and use can now earn secure legitimate incomes by making these products.”
See the following news article just to prove how successful the program is considered:
http://www.unodc.un.or.th/photo-news/2006/05-doitung.html
It is a shame that people smear others with lies. I hope none of those guilty of this are Thai because the King has done so much for Thailand.
Shame on you.
Samak’s talents!
“The trouble is, I would gather that the much vaunted poor rural electorate really has no really idea of what debate actually is, not that it’s their fault. Didn’t all the “intellectuals” sort of guide them in public hearings for the 1997 People’s constitution?”
A highly valid point jonfernquest – maybe this explains the ‘we already represent them, no need to ask them attitude’ amongst PPP MPs. According to them, the Democrats can do the Bangkok middle-class’ bidding.
However, if we are to avoid the street fight followed by coup scenario you outlined, opening up the constitution modification process is one of the few ways. It must be done with ‘sincerity’ though – which is increasingly difficult in an atmosphere where no one seems to trust anyone anymore. It has to be concurrently a participatory and educative process for Thais of all walks of life. It needs lots of time and patience…
Otherwise, just don’t change the constitution. Let PMSamak and the PPP government do the best job they could for the rest of their term and face another election. If PMThaksin truly believe in his innocence, or that he can manipulate the court process anyway, or simply decides to be ‘sincere’ to the country, just let the alleged corruption cases be deliberated in the courts of law. Sacrifice himself and set a new precedent where a former PM is convicted for the first time in Thai political/judicial history. Follow in the footsteps of South Korea where a former president as been jailed. With that precedent, there’s a greater possibility that cases against politician, bureucrat, businessmen, high-ranking soldiers can be tried…
Society can, then, just move closer to Teth’s ideal. I think we need that evolution and, at this point, it is up to PMThaksin really. He can just whisper into Newin’s and Chai Chidchob’s ears and say “enough boys, you’ve more than proven your loyalty. I will not use electoral politics to whitewash my wrongdoings and will fight the cases (transparently it is hoped) in the courts”… “why don’t you work hard for the people and PMSamak… don’t corrupt too much – 25% of project costs is too much – let’s practice some ‘sufficiency’ with 5%”…
If only…
An update on Jakrapob Penkair and alleged insults to the king
Jakrapob just resigned at about noon, BKK time.