Thanks James & Lleij, but having read the Wikipedia profiles of both Jack Lang and Huey Long, I think you both have been very generous to Thaksin.
Whilst I can see some similarities, I wonder what Thaksin would have thought of Long’s plan to use taxes to place a limit on personal fortunes & income in an attempt to redistribute to the needy.
I note that Lang’s party was heavily defeated at the election (called immediately after he was dismissed) – I doubt whether the Thai electorate would have done the same to Thaksin, but you never know – maybe the junta’s biggest mistake has been hanging around too long.
re: nganadeeleg> I don’t know about any Australian politicians like Thaksin, but I can name an American politician just like Thaksin: Huey “the Kingfish” Long. He was enormously popular, and might have been elected President had he not been assassinated in 1935.
““I mean, that is the goal of Buddhism.” > If this is the case, it needs to update itself by reading textbooks on social psychology.”
I’m intrigued. Tell me more. I’m always interested about where Buddhism and the mind sciences agree and where they don’t.
Re: Grasshopper>
I’m always glad when I inspire someone to adopt my evening ritual of relaxing music, comfortable clothing, and a mug of piping hot tea.
\”The reason he was deposed, however, is not because he was corrupt, nepotistic or had people killed. Just about every Thai political leader can be described that way.\” James Haughton #43
Just about every Thai political leader I agree can be described as corrupt and nepotistic. But I believe it was only Thaksin Shinawatra who had people killed.
And the reason Thaksin Shinawatra was deposed was because his belligerence and refusal to submit to public accountability was polarizing and divisive . . . potentially destabilizing the Kingdom.
Terrible.
Perhaps we could organise a letter signed by academics etc who have worked in Laos which urges the government to reconsider this project? If approaching the Lao government directly is too confrontational & hence counterproductive, perhaps an approach to/through the Thai media urging BANPU, EGAT and EGPO not to provide funding for this project?
“He was deposed because by raising the stakes of what it took to get electoral support from the poor, he changed the rules of the game in a way the conservative elite violently objected to.” >> Sounds impressive. But I wonder whether anybody will be able to verify, or falsify, such structural and reductionist causal claims.
I am glad that we can agree that East-West, and other sundry things, are constructs of the mind. But if so, why are you comfortable having “two” mindsets? Where I come from, we call that schizophrenia. I think it would be better into integrate the aspects of your mind into one working whole, without dissonance and without conflict. I mean, that is the goal of Buddhism.
I’m inspired to listen to Enya and drink Chai tea in floral pajama. Thankyou for enlightening me, dharma master! Ohm!
nganadeeleg: Aus politician who acted like Thaksin: Jack Lang, premier of NSW until 1932. He’s the one the New Guard organised against. The night before the coup was sheduled, he was dismissed by the governer general of NSW (the representative of the crown) – a parallel for Thailand perhaps? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Lang_(Australian_politician)
Vichai: In rural areas, no outright vote buying per-se but a lot of pork barreling: various special drought relief payments, government projects, etc which benefit rural areas disproportionately. THe difference is however that Australian agriculture is highly mechanised and capital intensive. Those living in rural areas and farming are a very small minority compared to the majority who are 80%+ urban dwellers. They only have political power because australia’s parliament is quite finely balanced between two parties and so small groups can sway the balance one way or the other, and because there is a lot of romanticisation of farmers, rural values, etc.
Dickie: I can’t make sense of most of what you’re saying. The only bit I can extract from the vague surfer-ese is that you disagree that Thaksin delivered on his policy promises. I disagree with you there. Thaksin went to the polls with policies of 30 baht health care, debt moratorium, etc. When elected, he delivered. That doesn’t excuse his extrajudicial killings, nepotism, corruption, etc. The reason he was deposed, however, is not because he was corrupt, nepotistic or had people killed. Just about every Thai political leader can be described that way. He was deposed because by raising the stakes of what it took to get electoral support from the poor, he changed the rules of the game in a way the conservative elite violently objected to.
Department of Special Investigation under the Justice Ministry is seeking a court order to block clips recently posted on video-sharing website YouTube that accuse Privy Council president Prem Tinsulanonda of masterminding the Sept 19 coup. “In the couple of days, we will seek a court order to block those links deemed to cause public confusion and threaten national security,” head of the unit Yanaphon Youngyuen said. “While awaiting the court order, we are seeking cooperation from internet service providers to block those links.” There are two parts of the postings, entitled The Crisis of Siam I and II. They were posted by iunknown79. The first part of the clips, posted six days ago, have been viewed by 6,469 people while the second part, posted two days ago, have been viewed by 2,498 as of 4.45pm of Friday. The first part runs 10.45 minutes while the second runs 6.06 minutes. Such allegations against Prem, now Privy Council chief, have been made by supporters of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra during demonstrations and denied repeatedly by the generals and the government they appointed. “Pa has been through such allegations many times and everyone knows what the truth is,” Prem’s spokesman, Vice Admiral Prajun Tampratheep, said of the 87-year-old former leader. YouTube had been blocked for five months by the government and the ban was lifted in August after its owner Google agreed to block clips deemed offensive to His Majesty the King.
All the malicious rumors and videos, including the birthday video of the CP’s wife, came out at about the same time of Thaksin Shinawatra disgraceful ouster . . .
It is the common belief that the source of the anti-monarchy rumours and malicious videos was Thaksin Shinawatra.
I’m not a close follower of the Australian political scene, but if John Howard presided over large scale extra-judicial killings, used tax havens & nominees to avoid tax and practiced obvious policy corruption to benefit his family etc etc, then I would hope that the Australian electorate would rise above natural self interest, and turf him out.
Andrew, in your anthropological studies have you ever come across any Australian politicians who acted like Thaksin (with similar characteristics), and if you have, can you please advise how successful they were and what was their ultimate fate?
I think it is incumbent on Sidh S to spell out the errors in Handley’s book. Here I don’t mean simply disagreeing with him or having a different interpretation, but telling us about the errors Sidh S. has found. Or is this being entirely too Western and rationalist?
The second video seems to add weight to the rumours that Prem and the crown prince are facing each other, daggers drawn. The link to the birthday video of the prince’s wife must have been leaked from within to (further) damage the prince, and this video would seem to provide some confirmation of that.
I am just interested to know from Andrew W. whether at Australia’s deep hinterlands . . . is the democracy practised thereat still ethical, or, as I suspect close more to Thailand’s vote-buying free-wheeling democracy?
Australia’s 20.4 million population is less than one-third of Thailand’s 64.6 million people but Australia’s huge 7,617,930 SqKm land size (versus Thailand’s 511,770 SqKm area) suggests to me that maybe at Australia’s deep rural regions, far away from central Canberra or Sydney, the politicians thereat could possibly be less virtuous?
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The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
Thanks James & Lleij, but having read the Wikipedia profiles of both Jack Lang and Huey Long, I think you both have been very generous to Thaksin.
Whilst I can see some similarities, I wonder what Thaksin would have thought of Long’s plan to use taxes to place a limit on personal fortunes & income in an attempt to redistribute to the needy.
I note that Lang’s party was heavily defeated at the election (called immediately after he was dismissed) – I doubt whether the Thai electorate would have done the same to Thaksin, but you never know – maybe the junta’s biggest mistake has been hanging around too long.
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
re: nganadeeleg> I don’t know about any Australian politicians like Thaksin, but I can name an American politician just like Thaksin: Huey “the Kingfish” Long. He was enormously popular, and might have been elected President had he not been assassinated in 1935.
Youtube’s privy politics
Andrew (#9) asks whether I believe vindictive Thaksin was capable of stooping so low purvey malicious anti-monarchy videos?
I believe Thaksin Shinawatra was capable of stooping much lower Andrew Walker.
Youtube’s privy politics
Re: Srithanonchai>
““I mean, that is the goal of Buddhism.” > If this is the case, it needs to update itself by reading textbooks on social psychology.”
I’m intrigued. Tell me more. I’m always interested about where Buddhism and the mind sciences agree and where they don’t.
Re: Grasshopper>
I’m always glad when I inspire someone to adopt my evening ritual of relaxing music, comfortable clothing, and a mug of piping hot tea.
I bow to the Budda within you. Nemaste!
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
\”The reason he was deposed, however, is not because he was corrupt, nepotistic or had people killed. Just about every Thai political leader can be described that way.\” James Haughton #43
Just about every Thai political leader I agree can be described as corrupt and nepotistic. But I believe it was only Thaksin Shinawatra who had people killed.
And the reason Thaksin Shinawatra was deposed was because his belligerence and refusal to submit to public accountability was polarizing and divisive . . . potentially destabilizing the Kingdom.
To hell with heffalumps
Terrible.
Perhaps we could organise a letter signed by academics etc who have worked in Laos which urges the government to reconsider this project? If approaching the Lao government directly is too confrontational & hence counterproductive, perhaps an approach to/through the Thai media urging BANPU, EGAT and EGPO not to provide funding for this project?
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
Srithanonchai: feel free to produce a poststructuralist, holistic, acausal account of the coup if you want to.
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
“He was deposed because by raising the stakes of what it took to get electoral support from the poor, he changed the rules of the game in a way the conservative elite violently objected to.” >> Sounds impressive. But I wonder whether anybody will be able to verify, or falsify, such structural and reductionist causal claims.
Youtube’s privy politics
I am glad that we can agree that East-West, and other sundry things, are constructs of the mind. But if so, why are you comfortable having “two” mindsets? Where I come from, we call that schizophrenia. I think it would be better into integrate the aspects of your mind into one working whole, without dissonance and without conflict. I mean, that is the goal of Buddhism.
I’m inspired to listen to Enya and drink Chai tea in floral pajama. Thankyou for enlightening me, dharma master! Ohm!
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
nganadeeleg: Aus politician who acted like Thaksin: Jack Lang, premier of NSW until 1932. He’s the one the New Guard organised against. The night before the coup was sheduled, he was dismissed by the governer general of NSW (the representative of the crown) – a parallel for Thailand perhaps?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Lang_(Australian_politician)
Vichai: In rural areas, no outright vote buying per-se but a lot of pork barreling: various special drought relief payments, government projects, etc which benefit rural areas disproportionately. THe difference is however that Australian agriculture is highly mechanised and capital intensive. Those living in rural areas and farming are a very small minority compared to the majority who are 80%+ urban dwellers. They only have political power because australia’s parliament is quite finely balanced between two parties and so small groups can sway the balance one way or the other, and because there is a lot of romanticisation of farmers, rural values, etc.
Dickie: I can’t make sense of most of what you’re saying. The only bit I can extract from the vague surfer-ese is that you disagree that Thaksin delivered on his policy promises. I disagree with you there. Thaksin went to the polls with policies of 30 baht health care, debt moratorium, etc. When elected, he delivered. That doesn’t excuse his extrajudicial killings, nepotism, corruption, etc. The reason he was deposed, however, is not because he was corrupt, nepotistic or had people killed. Just about every Thai political leader can be described that way. He was deposed because by raising the stakes of what it took to get electoral support from the poor, he changed the rules of the game in a way the conservative elite violently objected to.
Security in the Deep South
How sad for the local residents, whose lives are so different from those in other provinces.
Youtube’s privy politics
“I mean, that is the goal of Buddhism.” > If this is the case, it needs to update itself by reading textbooks on social psychology.
Youtube’s privy politics
From the Bangkok Post:
DSI seeks to block YouTube videos
Department of Special Investigation under the Justice Ministry is seeking a court order to block clips recently posted on video-sharing website YouTube that accuse Privy Council president Prem Tinsulanonda of masterminding the Sept 19 coup. “In the couple of days, we will seek a court order to block those links deemed to cause public confusion and threaten national security,” head of the unit Yanaphon Youngyuen said. “While awaiting the court order, we are seeking cooperation from internet service providers to block those links.” There are two parts of the postings, entitled The Crisis of Siam I and II. They were posted by iunknown79. The first part of the clips, posted six days ago, have been viewed by 6,469 people while the second part, posted two days ago, have been viewed by 2,498 as of 4.45pm of Friday. The first part runs 10.45 minutes while the second runs 6.06 minutes. Such allegations against Prem, now Privy Council chief, have been made by supporters of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra during demonstrations and denied repeatedly by the generals and the government they appointed. “Pa has been through such allegations many times and everyone knows what the truth is,” Prem’s spokesman, Vice Admiral Prajun Tampratheep, said of the 87-year-old former leader. YouTube had been blocked for five months by the government and the ban was lifted in August after its owner Google agreed to block clips deemed offensive to His Majesty the King.
Youtube’s privy politics
Col JeruVichai: do you think Thaksin made the birthday video?
Youtube’s privy politics
All the malicious rumors and videos, including the birthday video of the CP’s wife, came out at about the same time of Thaksin Shinawatra disgraceful ouster . . .
It is the common belief that the source of the anti-monarchy rumours and malicious videos was Thaksin Shinawatra.
Youtube’s privy politics
“…this video would seem to provide some confirmation of that.”
Neither video provides confirmation of anything!
(except maybe the desperation of some Thaksin supporters)
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
I’m not a close follower of the Australian political scene, but if John Howard presided over large scale extra-judicial killings, used tax havens & nominees to avoid tax and practiced obvious policy corruption to benefit his family etc etc, then I would hope that the Australian electorate would rise above natural self interest, and turf him out.
Andrew, in your anthropological studies have you ever come across any Australian politicians who acted like Thaksin (with similar characteristics), and if you have, can you please advise how successful they were and what was their ultimate fate?
Interview with Paul Handley
I think it is incumbent on Sidh S to spell out the errors in Handley’s book. Here I don’t mean simply disagreeing with him or having a different interpretation, but telling us about the errors Sidh S. has found. Or is this being entirely too Western and rationalist?
Youtube’s privy politics
The second video seems to add weight to the rumours that Prem and the crown prince are facing each other, daggers drawn. The link to the birthday video of the prince’s wife must have been leaked from within to (further) damage the prince, and this video would seem to provide some confirmation of that.
The ethical poverty of sufficiency democracy
I am just interested to know from Andrew W. whether at Australia’s deep hinterlands . . . is the democracy practised thereat still ethical, or, as I suspect close more to Thailand’s vote-buying free-wheeling democracy?
Australia’s 20.4 million population is less than one-third of Thailand’s 64.6 million people but Australia’s huge 7,617,930 SqKm land size (versus Thailand’s 511,770 SqKm area) suggests to me that maybe at Australia’s deep rural regions, far away from central Canberra or Sydney, the politicians thereat could possibly be less virtuous?