i have read this kind of articles for several times. This people are called Bengali who live in Bangladesh. Especially there no Rohingya in Myanmar . Actually they are trying to pretend to be one of Myanmar citizen because of their birth exploding. they approached media like BBC, BOA and others in order to know the world them who are from Myanmar. i want to request please do not write ROHINGYA instead of Bengli. so what i want to mention is no Rohingya in Myanmar. thank you
Before the criminal Suthep took the cloth to hide behind he made a comment that the coup was in the making for 4 years and Prayuth was involved. Prayuth promptly told Suthep to SHUT UP!
Reports in the Bangkok Post much earlier stated that a “War Chest” had been operating for years for yet another coup. This was never denied.
Thaksin “the greediest Prime Minister ever”? What basis in fact is there for this extreme statement?
So many other Thai Prime Ministers spring to mind, from Sarit on down.
And not to be forgotten, the total greed of the Thai Royal Family – King, Queen, daughters, son – all billionaires.
Members of the Privy Council, a certain billionaire Buri Ram politician who made Abhisit Prime Minister.
Lek Nana who sucked billions out of Thailand’s industrial scale multi-billion $ sex business to finance the Thai “Democrat” Party and donate the land for its Headquarters building.
So let’s not attach all the greed in Thailand to Mr. Thaksin, who at least took the time and effort to help millions of folks in the North East in very material ways.
Mr. Giggacher’s latest post has little new information, thinking or analysis. He tries to overcome this lacking with attempt at clever writing, but this leads into mixed metaphors, confusing sentences, and malapropism. I normally would not dare to question educated native speaker on his or her use of English language, but I would like to point to some writings that seem to me to be incorrect, clumsy or confusing. However, I could be wrong and welcome explanations or corrections.
The opening sentence says that “rice and Thailand go tongue-in-cheek.” I thought “tongue-in-cheek” meant that a statement made was supposed to be funny and not serious. So, does Mr. Giggacher’s sentence mean that rice and Thailand are both humorous?
The second sentence (beginning oddly with the word “And”) says that the “glutinous grain” speaks volumes about the coup. So, I thought the article would go on to show how rice explained military takeover. Was the coup related to rice pledging program? To world rice prices? To the problems of Thai rice farmers? However, I found nothing in the post that showed how rice spoke volumes about the coup.
In the fifth paragraph, the author writes that democracy and economy were “main motivators” of the coup. This would, indeed be original analysis, but he provides no back up for this statement.
Further on in the post, Mr. Giggacher writes that “the latest coup is systematic of Thailand’s ongoing regression into a democratic dead end.” This seems an unusual use of the word “systematic.” Perhaps he meant to write “symptomatic.” Is that a malapropism?
The next paragraph combines the metaphors of a “handbrake” with “throwing good money after bad.” This confused me. What is the “good money” being thrown away by the handbrake? Perhaps others can explain.
Further on, he writes that the question is whether the trial of Yingluck “could” lead to unrest. There seems to be no question that it could. The question I think Mr. Giggacher meant to raise is whether or not it will.
A couple of paragraphs after this, he writes that military repression “may not have sparked.” Doesn’t the word sparked need an object, like “sparked unrest” or “sparked protests”?
He then writes, in a labored effort to extend his rice metaphor, “like the country’s rice, this potent mix is the glue that binds so much of its recent political turmoil.” How is the mixture of complicated political factors in Thailand “like the country’s rice”? How is rice like glue? How is the recent political turmoil bound or glued? Perhaps the author could explain.
Mr. Giggacher’s final paragraph again works to continue the rice metaphor, but his effort seems to obscure rather than enlighten. What does it mean if the people are no longer willing to swallow the “penchant for politics by bullets rather than ballots?” If new elections “may just drag the country back into a vicious cycle of chaos,” and the people refuse to swallow military takeovers, what choices do they have? Perhaps Mr. Giggacher could usefully offer a menu of political choices that involve neither bullets nor ballots.
Perhaps I am nitpicking in my criticism, but language should communicate clearly and metaphors should be used to illuminate rather than puzzle. This post seems to have been carelessly written, perhaps in the hope that clever humor would get readers to ignore the confusing writing. New Mandala readers deserve better, particularly from an editor and lecturer.
Indonesia has demonstrated that no good deed goes unpunished. Perhaps even the cleaner election itself was a managed puppet show, and the foregone conclusion was a “Deus ex Indonesia”. There is still a very long way to go for this nation. People want a free and open society, but the tools necessary to achieve those goals, are kept hidden behind the curtain.
Let us think for the safety of Bangladeshi and Rohingya boat people. If they can choose the land route to Malaysia across Myanmar and Thailand, they don’t need to risk their lives at sea. Therefore let us try to give pressure to Myanmar Government to give the rights to Rohingyas, free travelling across Myanmar. New business opportunity of trafficking Bangladeshi and Rohingyas via land route will be interesting.
I wouldn’t want to, because I don’t subscribe to these racist notions.
The point I was making in my first post is that, indeed, the people of the region are mixture of people (and all people are creation of God); so, in a border region of now Myanmar (Burma) with now Bangladesh you will, of course, find people of ‘Bangladeshi’ origin, and in turn, in border region of Bangladesh you will find people of ‘Confucian civilization’ (a term I borrowed from Huntington’s the ‘clash of Civilization’ thesis). This further supported by ‘races’ such as ‘Nepalese’ – are they Indian, or Tibetans or Chinese? They are a mixture of all three and perhaps more. The truth is as are human beings are much closer than we think – but these rational arguments does not suit the racist agenda, especially during this era dominated by the ‘clash of the civilization’ agenda.
This supports the point Mr Galache made in a scholarly manner, which can not be said of many of the racist and Islamophobic posts here!
According to Buddhism, Burma’s problems stem from:
1. Greed and Materialism (“lawba”)
2. Anger and Hatred (“dawtha”)
3. Ignorance and Stupidity (“mawha”)
Most of the leading figures of the armed groups in Burma, including the Burmese Army, often act like juvenile gangster bosses fighting for turf (smuggling and trafficking are popular activities). Who is providing all of these “soldiers” in Burma with modern weapons?
Filipio. The students you describe, who want more development before independence, prefer the same approach as many of those with higher education in the East Timorese pro autonomy political/armed wings, before they were forced into making a choice in 1999. Gov Bram explains his position in much the same way – The Church and Development have been Papua’s stepping stones into modernity, so long as Jakarta protects and prioritises them the status quo stands. If not, Papuans may be forced to seek another sponsor.
Ethnic Papuans are probably now less than 50% of the population, so your students are unlikely to be pushed out of their comfort zone in the same manner as an earlier generation of like minded Timorese, any time soon.
Where the Australian media can help is by acknowledging their existence and explaining their reasons. For nearly 25 years the media pretended there were no supporters of Indonesia in E.Timor, and, when, forced to admit there were, dehumanised them. This was partially the fault of academics, who had always understood pro integration sentiment, personalities and their reasons since 1975 but were too craven to say so openly in the media for fear of being unpopular.
Can you rather would you enlighten us with the clear distinguishing characteristic of Rohingyas vs Bangali Kalar.
The Tayoke in MYanmar, has long abandon the idea of ancestry from China e.g Hunannese, Cantonese, Fukienese, Haka, WA, Chewchow etc all with distict dialect and characteristics.
Integrated well into Myanmar SOciety without much ado beyond special recognition.
ANy reason the Kalar in Yakhine deserve a special status?
If the Kalar can pay to get out then they can surly migrate to other Part of Myanmar w/o much ado.
Nothing going to changed in Laos. Until communist government fall and push VC back and then the Chinese. Corruption will killed all government and it people period. Laotion have to come and work together oversea and in the country.
The Rohingyas themselves have press-agentry down to a science and an art and if they ever fall short, there are plenty of Western crying towels flying under the cover as “human rights activists” ready to step in. They seek to equate the Myanmar military with nazis (with the “genocide” label), or to get western countries to take the Rohingya in, or to embarrass the ASEANs into doing so. We’ve danced to this tune before: in the 1980s, lots of Thai pretended to be Lao to get into the refugee camps and re-lo to the US. It often worked because the naifs doing the processing in the camps couldn’t tell a Thai from a Lao. A Bengali fleeing Bangladesh doesn’t make much of a splash in the sympathy sweepstakes, a Rohingya at risk for genocide does indeed.
Peter Cohen
I can’t agree with you more. The root of the problem is Bangladesh’s overpopulation fueled by lack of birth control.
Myanmar is only a scapegoat. Instead, the attention and international pressure should be directed to the Bangladeshi government.
Western, and perhaps other foreign, visitors to Jayapura in the months before Pepera in 1969 had similar experiences. When one had barely arrived in one’s hotel room, there would be a knock on the door or a tap on the window and two Papuans would ask to come in. They would be holding a ‘petition’ written in English that they hoped the foreigner would convey to the Bolivian diplomat, Ortiz Sanz, the UN special representative for Irian Jaya. The petitions invariably insisted that the people of the territory rejected the prospect of Indonesian sovereignty.
I don’t know whether foreigners visiting inland towns had the same experience.
There was a statement by the Indonesian authorities that 60-70% of the boat people have been identified a Bangladeshis going out to seek jobs. And are not classified as refugees.
She has done more damage, longer than the presence few months through her oppose at any cause for over 2 decades.
What she say/ stand for will affect the whole Myanmar,from within and without. Any avocation just for the Kalar in Yakhine problem will have consequences else where. CAn you even imagine the quagmire?
Call it dance if you must, the acknowledgement of “Freedom from Fear” and “Primum nOn NOcere” is wanting.
As for # 4.2.1 you haven’t provide a solution to your pot-shot against the Lady.
Thanpuying Noi Nuat Namman Na Toeng :What ONLY 423 times ??!! I’m sure Thailand’s warring elites have shot themselves – and others – in the foot, and elsewhere : many more times than that ! Please do not massage the facts, for the sake of mere lamyai.
Is he appearing before the courts or is he rendering advice? If he is appearing then surely it would be matter for the presiding judge to mot hear him. Why does this not happen? If as you say he has no right of appearance but still is able to appear surely that indicates the system does not function. However if he advises those who do appear then that is somewhat different. One can be a professor of law without having a practising certificate.
In any event whether he is or he isn’t doesn’t deal with my substantive allegation namely the Indonesian legal system is rife with corruption
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A missing boat and a missing voice
i have read this kind of articles for several times. This people are called Bengali who live in Bangladesh. Especially there no Rohingya in Myanmar . Actually they are trying to pretend to be one of Myanmar citizen because of their birth exploding. they approached media like BBC, BOA and others in order to know the world them who are from Myanmar. i want to request please do not write ROHINGYA instead of Bengli. so what i want to mention is no Rohingya in Myanmar. thank you
Rice, repression and rule by force
Before the criminal Suthep took the cloth to hide behind he made a comment that the coup was in the making for 4 years and Prayuth was involved. Prayuth promptly told Suthep to SHUT UP!
Reports in the Bangkok Post much earlier stated that a “War Chest” had been operating for years for yet another coup. This was never denied.
Rice, repression and rule by force
Thaksin “the greediest Prime Minister ever”? What basis in fact is there for this extreme statement?
So many other Thai Prime Ministers spring to mind, from Sarit on down.
And not to be forgotten, the total greed of the Thai Royal Family – King, Queen, daughters, son – all billionaires.
Members of the Privy Council, a certain billionaire Buri Ram politician who made Abhisit Prime Minister.
Lek Nana who sucked billions out of Thailand’s industrial scale multi-billion $ sex business to finance the Thai “Democrat” Party and donate the land for its Headquarters building.
So let’s not attach all the greed in Thailand to Mr. Thaksin, who at least took the time and effort to help millions of folks in the North East in very material ways.
Rice, repression and rule by force
Thanks Niphon for the feedback.
The use of systematic was indeed a typo, and has been corrected to symptomatic.
And please do get in touch if you’d like to write something for the site.
All the best,
James
Rice, repression and rule by force
Mr. Giggacher’s latest post has little new information, thinking or analysis. He tries to overcome this lacking with attempt at clever writing, but this leads into mixed metaphors, confusing sentences, and malapropism. I normally would not dare to question educated native speaker on his or her use of English language, but I would like to point to some writings that seem to me to be incorrect, clumsy or confusing. However, I could be wrong and welcome explanations or corrections.
The opening sentence says that “rice and Thailand go tongue-in-cheek.” I thought “tongue-in-cheek” meant that a statement made was supposed to be funny and not serious. So, does Mr. Giggacher’s sentence mean that rice and Thailand are both humorous?
The second sentence (beginning oddly with the word “And”) says that the “glutinous grain” speaks volumes about the coup. So, I thought the article would go on to show how rice explained military takeover. Was the coup related to rice pledging program? To world rice prices? To the problems of Thai rice farmers? However, I found nothing in the post that showed how rice spoke volumes about the coup.
In the fifth paragraph, the author writes that democracy and economy were “main motivators” of the coup. This would, indeed be original analysis, but he provides no back up for this statement.
Further on in the post, Mr. Giggacher writes that “the latest coup is systematic of Thailand’s ongoing regression into a democratic dead end.” This seems an unusual use of the word “systematic.” Perhaps he meant to write “symptomatic.” Is that a malapropism?
The next paragraph combines the metaphors of a “handbrake” with “throwing good money after bad.” This confused me. What is the “good money” being thrown away by the handbrake? Perhaps others can explain.
Further on, he writes that the question is whether the trial of Yingluck “could” lead to unrest. There seems to be no question that it could. The question I think Mr. Giggacher meant to raise is whether or not it will.
A couple of paragraphs after this, he writes that military repression “may not have sparked.” Doesn’t the word sparked need an object, like “sparked unrest” or “sparked protests”?
He then writes, in a labored effort to extend his rice metaphor, “like the country’s rice, this potent mix is the glue that binds so much of its recent political turmoil.” How is the mixture of complicated political factors in Thailand “like the country’s rice”? How is rice like glue? How is the recent political turmoil bound or glued? Perhaps the author could explain.
Mr. Giggacher’s final paragraph again works to continue the rice metaphor, but his effort seems to obscure rather than enlighten. What does it mean if the people are no longer willing to swallow the “penchant for politics by bullets rather than ballots?” If new elections “may just drag the country back into a vicious cycle of chaos,” and the people refuse to swallow military takeovers, what choices do they have? Perhaps Mr. Giggacher could usefully offer a menu of political choices that involve neither bullets nor ballots.
Perhaps I am nitpicking in my criticism, but language should communicate clearly and metaphors should be used to illuminate rather than puzzle. This post seems to have been carelessly written, perhaps in the hope that clever humor would get readers to ignore the confusing writing. New Mandala readers deserve better, particularly from an editor and lecturer.
The empire strikes back
Indonesia has demonstrated that no good deed goes unpunished. Perhaps even the cleaner election itself was a managed puppet show, and the foregone conclusion was a “Deus ex Indonesia”. There is still a very long way to go for this nation. People want a free and open society, but the tools necessary to achieve those goals, are kept hidden behind the curtain.
The Rohingya and regional failure
Let us think for the safety of Bangladeshi and Rohingya boat people. If they can choose the land route to Malaysia across Myanmar and Thailand, they don’t need to risk their lives at sea. Therefore let us try to give pressure to Myanmar Government to give the rights to Rohingyas, free travelling across Myanmar. New business opportunity of trafficking Bangladeshi and Rohingyas via land route will be interesting.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
I wouldn’t want to, because I don’t subscribe to these racist notions.
The point I was making in my first post is that, indeed, the people of the region are mixture of people (and all people are creation of God); so, in a border region of now Myanmar (Burma) with now Bangladesh you will, of course, find people of ‘Bangladeshi’ origin, and in turn, in border region of Bangladesh you will find people of ‘Confucian civilization’ (a term I borrowed from Huntington’s the ‘clash of Civilization’ thesis). This further supported by ‘races’ such as ‘Nepalese’ – are they Indian, or Tibetans or Chinese? They are a mixture of all three and perhaps more. The truth is as are human beings are much closer than we think – but these rational arguments does not suit the racist agenda, especially during this era dominated by the ‘clash of the civilization’ agenda.
This supports the point Mr Galache made in a scholarly manner, which can not be said of many of the racist and Islamophobic posts here!
Re-shooting the elephant
According to Buddhism, Burma’s problems stem from:
1. Greed and Materialism (“lawba”)
2. Anger and Hatred (“dawtha”)
3. Ignorance and Stupidity (“mawha”)
Most of the leading figures of the armed groups in Burma, including the Burmese Army, often act like juvenile gangster bosses fighting for turf (smuggling and trafficking are popular activities). Who is providing all of these “soldiers” in Burma with modern weapons?
Flying the flag of reform?
Filipio. The students you describe, who want more development before independence, prefer the same approach as many of those with higher education in the East Timorese pro autonomy political/armed wings, before they were forced into making a choice in 1999. Gov Bram explains his position in much the same way – The Church and Development have been Papua’s stepping stones into modernity, so long as Jakarta protects and prioritises them the status quo stands. If not, Papuans may be forced to seek another sponsor.
Ethnic Papuans are probably now less than 50% of the population, so your students are unlikely to be pushed out of their comfort zone in the same manner as an earlier generation of like minded Timorese, any time soon.
Where the Australian media can help is by acknowledging their existence and explaining their reasons. For nearly 25 years the media pretended there were no supporters of Indonesia in E.Timor, and, when, forced to admit there were, dehumanised them. This was partially the fault of academics, who had always understood pro integration sentiment, personalities and their reasons since 1975 but were too craven to say so openly in the media for fear of being unpopular.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
#30
Can you rather would you enlighten us with the clear distinguishing characteristic of Rohingyas vs Bangali Kalar.
The Tayoke in MYanmar, has long abandon the idea of ancestry from China e.g Hunannese, Cantonese, Fukienese, Haka, WA, Chewchow etc all with distict dialect and characteristics.
Integrated well into Myanmar SOciety without much ado beyond special recognition.
ANy reason the Kalar in Yakhine deserve a special status?
If the Kalar can pay to get out then they can surly migrate to other Part of Myanmar w/o much ado.
Corruption and media exposure in Laos
Nothing going to changed in Laos. Until communist government fall and push VC back and then the Chinese. Corruption will killed all government and it people period. Laotion have to come and work together oversea and in the country.
A missing boat and a missing voice
The Rohingyas themselves have press-agentry down to a science and an art and if they ever fall short, there are plenty of Western crying towels flying under the cover as “human rights activists” ready to step in. They seek to equate the Myanmar military with nazis (with the “genocide” label), or to get western countries to take the Rohingya in, or to embarrass the ASEANs into doing so. We’ve danced to this tune before: in the 1980s, lots of Thai pretended to be Lao to get into the refugee camps and re-lo to the US. It often worked because the naifs doing the processing in the camps couldn’t tell a Thai from a Lao. A Bengali fleeing Bangladesh doesn’t make much of a splash in the sympathy sweepstakes, a Rohingya at risk for genocide does indeed.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
This former British official and co. have clear agenda, which has nothing to do with the truth or realty.
Keep repeating your own propaganda and reality will catch up with with sooner or later!
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
Peter Cohen
I can’t agree with you more. The root of the problem is Bangladesh’s overpopulation fueled by lack of birth control.
Myanmar is only a scapegoat. Instead, the attention and international pressure should be directed to the Bangladeshi government.
Flying the flag of reform?
Western, and perhaps other foreign, visitors to Jayapura in the months before Pepera in 1969 had similar experiences. When one had barely arrived in one’s hotel room, there would be a knock on the door or a tap on the window and two Papuans would ask to come in. They would be holding a ‘petition’ written in English that they hoped the foreigner would convey to the Bolivian diplomat, Ortiz Sanz, the UN special representative for Irian Jaya. The petitions invariably insisted that the people of the territory rejected the prospect of Indonesian sovereignty.
I don’t know whether foreigners visiting inland towns had the same experience.
A missing boat and a missing voice
There was a statement by the Indonesian authorities that 60-70% of the boat people have been identified a Bangladeshis going out to seek jobs. And are not classified as refugees.
A missing boat and a missing voice
She has done more damage, longer than the presence few months through her oppose at any cause for over 2 decades.
What she say/ stand for will affect the whole Myanmar,from within and without. Any avocation just for the Kalar in Yakhine problem will have consequences else where. CAn you even imagine the quagmire?
Call it dance if you must, the acknowledgement of “Freedom from Fear” and “Primum nOn NOcere” is wanting.
As for # 4.2.1 you haven’t provide a solution to your pot-shot against the Lady.
A happy end for Abhisit
Thanpuying Noi Nuat Namman Na Toeng :What ONLY 423 times ??!! I’m sure Thailand’s warring elites have shot themselves – and others – in the foot, and elsewhere : many more times than that ! Please do not massage the facts, for the sake of mere lamyai.
Australia-Indonesia: the view from Jakarta
Is he appearing before the courts or is he rendering advice? If he is appearing then surely it would be matter for the presiding judge to mot hear him. Why does this not happen? If as you say he has no right of appearance but still is able to appear surely that indicates the system does not function. However if he advises those who do appear then that is somewhat different. One can be a professor of law without having a practising certificate.
In any event whether he is or he isn’t doesn’t deal with my substantive allegation namely the Indonesian legal system is rife with corruption