Comments

  1. Jim Taylor says:

    #13, we know that this torture has been going on for some years from information given by watermelon soldiers. Many thousands of people have disappeared. The torture has been routine, such as Krisuda’s boyfriend who was tied up, arms and legs, and thrown into polluted water container. This torture has been conducted by royalist pro-yellow soldiers and their wives with carte blanche from the highest levels. Pro-democracy (red shirt) activists have been too traumatised to speak out after their ordeals; plus their lives turned upside down; sometimes bank accounts frozen, and their families threatened. My hat off to Krisuda who is now hospitalised in a safe country. My message to the illegal White Crow regime is that watch this space: others will be inspired to speak out. The ICJ and ICC are now alerted with more and more information coming forward…

  2. Franz says:

    Jim Taylor,

    Thank you for this article and the information it contains. Thank God there are avenues one can follow to address serious wrongs in society but I wonder how much the ruling junta care for civilized protest. Probably none.

  3. Franz says:

    R.N.England

    Thank you for your most original contribution to this discussion. Your idea of a constitutional drafting committee in exile is spendid to say the least.

  4. Monique says:

    The persecution and debasement of Kassim Ahmad is the defilement of Malaysia. One cannot separate the two. Kassim Ahmad is the heart and soul of Malaysia, and especially the Malay people. That the obsessive desire to destroy an innocent 81-year old man, because he believes the Quran and Aqidah do not require a knowledge of the Hadiths, or because he believes it is no a crime in Islam for Malay woman to go about bare-headed, when they have done so for 600 years, is beyond perversion, it is intellectual pornography, in the guise of religion. This is a man, who has given his life to his nation, asked nothing in return, never hurt so much as a fly, and was befriended by a former Prime Minister, and then subsequently stabbed in the back. Kassim was dragged from his home, in front of his family, with no summons, no writ, and ordered to Shari’a Court, to face charges of heresy, for the crime of thinking differently. All this, while corrupt politicians and judges move about, games are played by Malaysian extremists, cow heads thrown in front of people’s homes, planes downed or disappeared, freelance Malay Jihadists going off to Iraq and Syria, and the usual Sandiawara between the Government, the opposition, and the rakyat. You would think the Ulama would have better things to do with their time than crush a frail old man, certainly I would hope that the Government would find better things to do with its time.

    This is story not just about the defeat of reason, intellect and honour in Malaysia; it is a story of how a nation has lost its way, lost its principles, lost its decency, and is about to lose its soul. Kassim is not well, and the unbearable stress of his abuse hardly improves his condition. What would Tunku make of all this ? This sandbagging and torturing of a man, who is probably one of Malaysia’s finest writers and thinkers. Do you think Tunku would be pleased ? I think not. Remember this well, as Kassim goes, so goes the nation. Already, most young Malaysians have never even heard of him. This is a great loss. His abuse and persecution are evil incarnate and have about as much to do with Islam, as ISIS in Iraq, not very much. It is about ego, false male pride, and the Ulama, wanting to maintain power. It is not really about Aurat or about Fiqh or about Aqidah, the Qur’an, or even the Hadiths; it is about a man daring to think outside the square box, challenging Islamic orthodoxy, and having the courage to do so, without ever, at anytime in his life, saying one bad word about another man. It is about the defilement of Malaysia, and for that, as much as Kassim’s loss will hurt his family whom he loves very much, it is the nation that is far worse off, in every respect, with Kassim no longer allowed to be a part of it. On judgement day, for those who have participated in Kassim’s slow demise, they will have little time to amend the mistakes they have made; they should be glad that they have any time at all.

  5. Nick Nostitz says:

    “Mydear Sitachit”, thank you for your compassionate comment. Is that, by chance a reaction to this recent article: http://en.khaosod.co.th/detail.php?newsid=1407241687&section=
    in which i wonder about the lack of progress in the cases i filed against my attackers? If my attackers are so confident that i am the culprit in these incidents, and feel that they are innocent why do they not submit themselves to the Thai justice system, so we all can finally get clarity and justice?

  6. dok-ya says:

    j springfield, I read the junta-authored interim Thai constitution in Thai language. Here is the English version I found in google,

    Article 48: All acts related to the seizure of power on May 22, 2014 by the NCPO and those associated or ordered by the head [of NCPO] (…) regardless of its impact on the legislature, executive and judiciary (…) and regardless of the acts carried out on, before or after said day, should those acts are considered to be unlawful, all those associated with those acts are entirely free of fault or guilt.

  7. Mariner says:

    I have to disagree with all this. The reasons for conversion, in most cases, in my view are:
    1. wanting to marry a Muslim woman, the conversion being invariably nominal, 2. a need for protection in the prison system; I think I’m correct in saying that in Britain, at least, many of those detained convert, 3. As an anti-establishment gesture, Islam commonly associated with violence and abuse.

    The number of those who make a genuine conversion are, I suggest, very, very few indeed.

    Presumably the number of those following Islam, and religion generally, will decline with access to information allowing us to seek out truth for ourselves. There are, already, a massive number of websites exposing the absurdities and contradictions in the Koran as well those in other religious books.

    Agnosticism is surely the belief of the future.

  8. j springfield says:

    Prof. dok-ya: What does article 48 of the junta-authored interim Thai constitution say? And thanks if you respond grandpop.

  9. Greg Lopez says:

    Mohamed Sufi — two questions for you.

    1. What is your view on faith and reason.

    2. What is your view on free will.

    Thanks
    Greg

  10. Jim Taylor says:

    for the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights: Ravina Shamdasani
    Location: Geneva
    Date: 5 August 2014
    We have been very concerned by the methods of arrest and detention of politicians, activists, academics and journalists following the military coup in Thailand in May this year.

    Since 22 May 2014, more than 700 individuals have been summoned and arrested by the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO). While most of them were released within a week in accordance with martial law, an unverified number of people were detained for more than seven days without access to lawyers and their families. We have been concerned that incommunicado detention creates the environment for possible human rights abuses, including torture and ill-treatment.

    The case of Kritsuda Khunasen, a student activist who was working for a key member of the Red Shirts group, which supports the deposed Government, has given further cause for serious concern.

    In testimony shared with the media and human rights organizations on 2 August, Khunasen described her treatment and conditions of detention from 28 May to 24 June 2014 while she was military custody. She claims that she was blindfolded for 7 days, beaten several times and lost consciousness after a plastic bag was placed over her head.

    On 16 July, the High Commissioner raised her concerns with the Thai authorities on due process and transparency in the case, including the lack of information on Khunasen’s whereabouts and her well-being during the arbitrary detention. Prior to this, on 11 June, the High Commissioner communicated with the Thai authorities, emphasising that any emergency measures must comply with international human rights standards, including the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights to which Thailand is party. She stressed that the right to life and the prohibition against torture cannot be breached, regardless of the circumstances. Thus far, no substantive feedback from the authorities has been received on these concerns.

    Thai authorities should immediately conduct an independent and detailed investigation into the alleged torture of Kritsuda Khunasen, and – if verified – bring the perpetrators to justice. Under international law and under UN policy, amnesties are impermissible if they prevent prosecution of individuals who may be criminally responsible for gross violations of human rights, including torture.

    ENDS
    For more information or media requests, please contact Ravina Shamdasani (+41 22 917 9169 /[email protected]) or Cécile Pouilly (+41 22 917 93 10 / [email protected])

  11. SteveCM says:

    “I can not help to think like that because all his comment benefit only the Red shirt, same as few others within Amsterdam network.”

    Quite clear from that sentence that you’ve read very little (if any?) of Nick Nostitz’ articles or books – and maybe you’d like to identify just what involvement in or even connection with “Amsterdam network” you imagine he has had?

  12. Robin says:

    Check out the way the gentle military deal with criticism.
    Red-shirt activist Kritsuda Khunasen has revealed that when she was illegally detained by the junta, she was suffocated and physically assaulted. The torture was aimed at forcing her to link former Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra to hard core red-shirt groups, according to Kritsuda.

    In late June, Kritsuda was the focus of media and human rights organizations’ attention because during her detention, no one was able to contact her and it was not known where she was detained. After rumours that she was tortured, Kritsuda appeared on a special TV program with the military junta spokesman and said she was “happier than words can say”. On Saturday, a video clip of an interview between her and Jom Petchpradab, an independent journalist, was released. Kritsuda said she has fled Thailand to start a new life in Europe.

    In the interview via Skype, Krhttp://prachatai.org/english/node/4267
    itsuda said she was blindfolded and her hands were bound on the first seven days of the detention. During this period, a female officer would help her when eating, taking a bath, and when she wanted to go to the toilet. She said while she was naked during taking bath, she heard a male voice. “I consider this sexual harassment.”

  13. neptunian says:

    “Qu’ranic injunction forbidding intoxicants needs no further elucidation.”

    Looking at the “listen to me or be slaughter” behavior of the Islam practitioners in the Middle East, I would rather have them intoxicated and dancing. How can anyone with even an iota of intellect say all that Sufi said is quite beyond me. Just look at the facts – the behavior of followers of “beautiful” Islam

    Sorry, I have to take only one small bit, but the piece is too long of a preach. Would need to do a citation. Would also need to puke a bit too much….

  14. Sceptic says:

    That is a very sensible proposal which could form the basis of a valid strategy for opposition to the junta. It is important that it cannot be seen to be dominated purely by Red Shirts and Thaksinites. My sense is that over time broad-ranged opposition to the military will gather strength and this should provide the opportunity to recruit others to the cause. But it is clear that there can be no quick fix.

  15. Matthew Kosuta says:

    There was no misunderstanding. The post is a bit confusing but it directly implies that Leonidas and his 300 men fought for democracy.

    “The idea on democracy began in Greek and so did the story of Leonidas and his 300 men. I have never known any groups of mankind who have enjoyed democracy without sacrifices-lives, properties…”

    The movie “300” portrays Leonidas and his 300 men fighting for the cause of freedom, liberty, etc, but this movie is disconnected from reality, let alone history (it is also highly racist).

    Also, the reply to my post, uses the example of the lone man at Tienanmen Square, this again implies a fight for democracy, liberty etc.

    Mussolini and his Black Shirts, Hitler and his SS, and Stalin and his NKVD (to use well known, though somewhat extreme, examples) all showed courage and fought for their goals, two of leaders even scarified their lives for their causes. Do these 3 leaders and their men fit the spirit of the original post and “It means to assess individual’s courage and goal.”? If they do fit, then by all means use Leonidas and his 300 men as an example of the courage to fight for one’s goals. If they do not fit then the use of Leonidas and his 300 men is misplaced.

  16. Asia Pacific Editor says:

    Hi Agus

    No quotes or points were re-hashed from previous articles. This feature is based on an extensive interview with Marcus and Edward upon their recent return from Indonesia.

    Do get in touch if you are interested in writing something for New Mandala. We would welcome a submission.

    All the best to all

  17. R. N. England says:

    A constitutional drafting committee in exile would be accepted, protected, and endorsed outside Thailand much more readily than a government in exile. The committee should start with a flat rejection of any new constitution that comes from the usual sources. Thailand has well and truly had enough of them, churned out as they have been for decades, with no other purpose than to codify the immediate interests of the powerful. New constitutional proposals should be smuggled back into Thailand and circulated widely, encouraging as much feedback as possible.
    A new constitution for Thailand should, as much as possible, reflect the values of ordinary Thais. But it should also lead them slowly into a better world: one without the knee-jerk submission that allows them to fall into the power of arrogant scoundrels; and one which discourages people’s hard-wired desire for punitive control of others.

  18. dok-ya says:

    Prayuth Chan-ocha may be the head of the junta and seems to hold the power right now. However, judging from my limited knowledge he does not have the absolute power like Gen. Sarit and Thanom-Prapas in the past. Prayuth must still answer to some people above him. This may be a problem for any dictator.

  19. neptunian says:

    Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword, never had to face a gun.

    The Thais, unlike the Islamist in the Middle East are mild mannered. (relatively speaking anyway)

  20. Muhammad Sufi says:

    What is the part of Islam, in your opinion, which attracts some Europeans to convert to Islam?
    Every human being, including every European, has a heart. The human heart is the seat of belief and the organ capable of acquiring knowledge of Allah. Because of this every human being is potentially able to become a believer and when Allah wishes to guide someone, wherever in the world they come from, He fills their heart with belief in Him and this leads them to become Muslim. There are as many ways of this happening as there are people who become Muslim but it is certainly true that there are certain more spiritual aspects of Islam which directly affect the heart, particularly all the various forms of dhikrullah, and in the case of Europeans, as well as others, these aspects are frequently a significant element in their conversion to Islam.
    In the case of Europeans, however, the head often takes precedence over the heart and so intellectual considerations also play a dominant role in the conversion of people from this continent to Islam. All intelligent Europeans are aware that there is a great deal wrong with the society in which they live and so another important factor in the decision to become Muslim is the fact that Islam offers cogent solutions to many of the ills which afflict the post-modern, secular, consumer world they inhabit.
    Let us take a few examples. A vast proportion of the crime both violent and otherwise which has reached such epidemic proportions in our time is closely related to the consumption of alcohol and drugs. I know this to be true because I used to spend some time every week visiting prisons and in nine out of ten cases of the inmates I saw, alcohol or drugs proved to have been a large part of the reason they found themselves incarcerated. If you add to this the vast percentage of alcohol induced accidents, the growing incidence of alcoholism with its attendant social problems and the unprecedented number of people dependant on drugs of all kinds, the Qu’ranic injunction forbidding intoxicants needs no further elucidation.
    The effect of usury, particularly in its most prevalent form of lending money at interest is felt by every single inhabitant of the world. In Britain alone the staggering sum of more than twenty billion pounds – that is twenty thousand million pounds – is owed by private individuals to credit companies, banks, stores, building societies and money lenders for consumer goods bought on credit and I am sure that this must increasingly be the case throughout the Balkans as well. The human cost of this is increasing distress and discord in a great number of families and for many absolute despair at not being able to make ends meet, leading to a growing number of suicides.
    On the international scene, the situation is the same or even worse. In some countries the gross national product is not sufficient to pay even the interest on the money that has been borrowed, which means that every one in those countries is working for foreign banks. The situation is apalling and this is just the tip of the iceberg. The underlying effects of usury have corroded every aspect of human life in subtle ways that are not immediately obvious but which can be traced directly back to the introduction and practice of usury. Suffice it to say that usury is a poison which pollutes all it touches. It was forbidden to the Jews and Christians but they got round their law. Its prohibition in the Qur’an leaves no room for manoeuvre.
    It cannot be denied that the spread of the scourge of AIDS which now threatens so many millions of lives has been almost exclusively due to sexual promiscuity on a scale never before witnessed by the human race and more particularly by homosexual practices which were until very recently recognised as unnatural and illegal by every society in the world. The way that this abhorrent deviance has turned from being anathema to being almost universally accepted and approved of is one of the wonders of the modern world. Apart from this there are the terrible crimes of rape and incest whose regular and increasing occurence has made them seen almost commonplace.
    Again, in this vital area of life Islam holds the key. Far from being suppressed, sexuality is explicitly encouraged within Islam and ample space is given for its expression. However its limits have been made clear and the penalties for overstepping them extremely severe. At the same time opportunities for sex outside the prescribed limits are kept at a minimum. Because extended families and the giving of hospitality are part and parcel of Islamic life, Muslim family life is full and open and the dangerous emotional currents which frequently lead to crime in the nuclear family situation are harmlessly dissipated in the general melee.
    Much has been said about the barbarism of criminal law in Islam, but there are two points that are rarely pointed out. One is that it can only ever be applied in a situation where Islam is dominant and those who are subject to it accept it. The second is that it is overwhelmingly effective. In Saudi Arabia where Islamic law is probably applied more than anywhere else – even if extremely unevenly – I have seen someone leave a large pile of money unattended for fifteen minutes while they were off seeing to something else, without any fear of it being taken, and it is quite routine for shopkeepers to leave shops full of valuable goods completely unattended while they go off to pray. The relief of living in this atmosphere after the smash and grab climate we are used to has to be experienced to be understood. It generates a completely different attitude to life and property. And the fact is you do not see hundreds of people walking about with no hands.
    The last and perhaps most important aspect of Islam I want to mention is the incalculable effect of the physical act of prayer which punctuates the day of every Muslim. This act puts the worship of God back where it belongs at the centre of human life and ensures the health of society as a whole. It gives people a correct perspective on existence so that they do not become totally engrossed in the life of this world. It is a continual reminder of the insubstantial nature of this life, that death is inevitable and that what follows it depends on the way we live and goes on forever. The acceptance of accountability implicit in this attitude makes people prone to live within Allah’s limits rather than to wantonly trangress them. It creates a situation where people see that immediate self-gratification is not necessarily in their best interests and that generosity and patience and good character really do have benefits in them.
    These are a few of the aspects which attract Europeans to Islam although I would like to emphasise again that guidance is in Allah’s hands alone, that there is no general rule, and that everyone’s story of their individual journey to Islam is entirely unique.
    Would you explain in a general way the spiritual situation of a man from a Western country?
    To answer this question in a satisfactory way it is necessary to go back in history to the beginning of the 17th century. At that time a new wind was blowing up which was shortly to reach gale force and wreak havoc with the traditional and true God-centred view of existence, which had until that time been accepted by the vast majority of people, leaving a very barren landscape in its place. This wind was known as the “new philosophy” and the English poet John Donne poetically expressed its effect in a very eloquent way. He wrote:
    “And new philosophy calls all in doubt, The element of fire is quite put out;
    The sun is lost, and the earth, and no man’s wit
    Can well direct him where to look for it.
    ‘Tis all in pieces, all coherence gone;
    All just supply and all relation.”
    In the “new philosophy” the spiritual gave way to the material. Men became concerned with quantity rather than quality. Human consciousness became more and more confined within the limits of the material universe. The “new philosophy”, which was scientific materialism in its germinal stages, penetrated and impermeated the mind set of ordinary people. The pervasive nature of the scientific world view had a profound and far reaching effect on human consciousness. In fact for the human being the result was devastating. It was as if an impenetrable barrier became erected between the spiritual and material worlds and as the scientific world view inexorably imposed itself on and pervaded human consciousness, human beings became, in real terms, cut off from a true view of existence.
    Up until this time people had been living at the centre of the universe with the sun and moon and stars revolving around them, above which were the celestial spheres of angelic activity all encompassed by the Throne of God, whose unseen Hand moved and directed the whole affair. From that time on, people lived on an insignificant mineral mass, a mere part of a minor planetary system, one of countless others lost in the unimaginable vastness of limitless space.
    For the ordinary person it was just like being suddenly uprooted from a small social environment where everyone is known to each other, the hierarchy clear and unquestioned, all the relationships tried, tested and trusted, the atmosphere benign, all the paths well-trodden, every corner familiar, every livelihood assured, and off-loaded into the alienation and impersonality of a giant modern megapolis whose barren streets seem to go on forever, where every quarter is the same yet unfamiliar, where the dominant energy is fear and mistrust, where even near neighbours are strangers.
    Belief in God, which had been an inextricable part, a given, of the human situation, became at best an optional extra and increasingly frequently not an option at all. And, of course, as this happened belief in the other foundational realities of existence, the angelic worlds and Divine revelation and human accountability, all of which, of course, depend on belief in God, were themselves eroded and all but washed away. How beautifully though despairingly Matthew Arnold expresses what happened in those famous lines of his poem Dover Beach:
    “The Ocean of Faith Was once, too, at the full, and round earth’s shore
    Lay like the folds of a bright girdle furl’d.
    But now I only hear
    Its melancholy, long, withdrawing roar,
    Retreating to the breath
    Of the night wind, down the vast edges drear
    And naked shingles of the world.”
    And the tide has gone a long way further out since then.
    The fact is that inner fabric of Christendom, on which all Western society is based, having been severely frayed by the storms of the reformation, was then completely ripped apart by the onslaught of the “new philosophy”. I want to say here that I am not talking of Christian beliefs or personal piety. What I am referring to is the legal and moral structure of European society. Christianity progressively lost its ability to impinge in any real way on society so that it is now obvious in so many ways that in social terms Christianity has disintegrated beyond the possiblity of restoration and that it is demonstrably no longer capable of furnishing that clear guidance which is so necessary for there to be a healthy and just human situation.
    The scientific world view has now intruded into every aspect of life and every corner of the earth and our education merely serves to reinforce it and articulate it. All of us have been immersed in it since our childhood and none of us has escaped its influence. Nearly all of us view existence through a Galilean telescope and see a Newtonian mechanistic universe with a mind permeated by Cartesian dualism.
    It is, however, now clear that this “scientific” view of existence has now been scientifically discredited by the scientists themselves. Rutherford and Bohr showed conclusively that the atom, the supposedly basic building block of existence, was mostly empty space. Max Planck showed that some of the basic premises of classical physics were mistaken. When Werner Heisenberg formulated his famous uncertainty principle, the cat was really among the pigeons. Determinacy, the singular connection of cause and effect, was rightly regarded as the rock on which natural philosophy was built and now with Heisenberg this safe basis, this basic premise, had been taken away. Matter, rather than being the lifeless substance posited by Newton, mechanistically determined by being acted on by outside forces, turns out, at its very heart, to be composed of energy itself. Rather than being inert and predictable it is in fact highly dynamic and very mysterious. So the position reached by scientists at the leading edge of research is that the door to understanding the unity of existence is once again open. The history of Being, to use Hegel’s expression, has reached a point where the prevailing climate of opinion has made tawhid, unitary knowledge, the true description of reality, once more accessible to human consciousness in a real way. Scientific truth no longer stands in opposition to metaphysical truth barring the way to a deeper understanding of the nature of existence. While the full implications of the quantum change in perspective have yet to filter down to the level of general consciousness the forest has been cleared and the path is open.
    Thus it can be seen that the european tradition has arrived at the thresh-hold of Islam and it is also clear that Islam and only Islam can provide the necessary spiritual, intellectual and social framework to free us from the strangle-hold of the New World Order and the system which sustains it. The other religious traditions are nothing but archaelogical fragments, incomplete or altered teachings, intended for other peoples and former times. The philosophical tradition has worn itself out and become lost in details and abstractions. The scientific tradition is inhuman and appears bent on self-destruction. It is only in the final dispensation of divine guidance expressed in the Qur’an and demonstrated by the last of God’s Messengers, Muhammad SAW, that the key to the future can be found.