That was the first I’d seen of your brief opinion piece, N.F., Kachin state: The war between China and India.
The article leaves me wondering what you have to say about Thai policy on Northern Burma (official policy, unofficial, or military improvisation) –given that there’s a newly elected government in office and so on.
While China and India are the most immediate foreign powers, they are also the least susceptible to change in their policy toward Burma. Kachin State could easily be the next South Ossetia; but, rightly or wrongly, there is no equivalent to Russian intervention in the equation. In that article, when you speak of an (unlikely) rapid end to the civil war through the intervention of Burma’s northern neighbors (China, India, or both) I could only imagine that it would resemble the independence/annexation of Ossetia; it is hard to imagine better, and easy to imagine worse, in such a scenario.
I am amused to note that the spell-checker does not yet recognize “Ossetia” as a correct spelling (it does seem to know “Kosovo”); I’m guessing that the South Ossets receive official recognition from the digital lexicon some time before the Kachin do.
Maratjp: Your first post @126 revealed your ignorance, your post @134 solidified it. Every accused is entitled to due process, not just the innocent ones.
Thanks Neptunian for that suggestion. Yes, I think Malaysians should have a zero tolerance policy on corruption.
Transparency International – Malaysia (TI-M) has called for reforms in political financing as a way to curb corruption. Malaysians perceive political parties as most corrupt.
This is definitely something that Mr. Najib Razak can easily implement if wants too. Will he?
A more detailed presentation of Malaysia’s CPI ranking for 2010 is available here and here.
….”If in fact this Joe Gordon did not actually do what he is accused of then he is of course entitled his due process of law”
You need to wake up Maratjp….there is no “Rule of Law” in Thailand, no “Impartial Justice System”, no “Rules of Evidence”, no “Due Process of Law”………….
Btw, I’ll be sure to get the word out to those tens of millions of U.S. citizens who are “dual citizens”, that as far as Maratjp is concerned they are not actually U.S. citizens and they are no longer entitled to the rights of a U.S. citizen to go about their business in the U.S. as if they have the rights of a U.S.. citizen. Such as posting links to Yale University Press books on their blogs or, god forbid, doing partial translations of Yale University Press books.
112 is a fact of life just as is the military in Burma.
It sure wasnt fact of like 30 years ago, hell, even 10 years ago there were fewer than 10 lese majeste cases annually, now we are looking at hundreds. If it wasnt fact of life 30 years ago sure it can be undone.
That’s not to say we shouldn’t look for change, but that there’s no point in naive idealism.
This is not even about idealism, this is simply about basic freedom of speech. If a country claimed to be democratic then at very least it should have the most fundamental right for its citizen so democracy can function properly.
Is burning a coffin the way forward? Maybe, but its a fairly blunt itstrument.
and someone got jail for that, how is it “Maybe” works is beyond me.
all I’m saying is that there are all kinds of imaginative ways of expressing dissent that may be better than what frankly I think is a pointless effort to get rid of 112
You seems not to get the point why I even mentioned the “burning coffin” and “Sombat’s talk show”. The thing is, no matter how much “imagination” you’ve got, they will find a way to jail you, dont you know why Da Torpido was sentence behind the close door?.
Yeah, I’m assuming that the charges are legit. If in fact this Joe Gordon did not actually do what he is accused of then he is of course entitled his due process of law.
What are the Reds doing about 112 and the 100+ prisoners?
I asked this question in Chiang Mai and was told they and the government are moving on the issue and there will be a meeting 18:00 on 19/9/2011 behind Wat Pra Sing here. Please go and cheer them on.
Seh Fah: “For foreigners under arrest for LM, the only approach that has ever succeeded in getting them released has been discretely negotiated royal amnesties.”
The one and only thing that Malaysians who do not agree to this state of affairs can do is to exercise their vote. Vote for a change and see what happens.
There nothing that can motivates a worker more than the fear of loosing his / her job. There’s nothing that motivates a politician more than the fear of losing his / her seat.
Show the current or the next govt that they can loose, and I am sure things will improve in Malaysia
One thing that Sondhi Limthongkul said that I rather agree with is, “р╕кр╕▒р╕Зр╕Др╕бр╣Др╕Чр╕вр╣Ар╕ор╕╡р╣Йр╕в.” This means that the problem is not with police or politicians, but with society as a whole where civics, civility, and civil rights are basically left off the “Let’s keep having fun.” menu.
QUOTE The founding fathers of the United States were the first to devise a system in which people could, if they liked, largely free themselves from the power hierarchies of their European past. UNQUOTE
I guess what you really mean is that the founding fathers found a way to coerce people into accepting a more local power hierarchy. One could argue that American democracy has been stagnant ever since. It isn’t that hard to figure out that both sets of Tea Parties were largely self-serving.
In Thailand’s case, you can leave out the local bit. Cash subversion of the kamnans and pooyaibahns (and other local mafias) will continue to prevent any real freedom – regardless of which CEO spends his way to the PMship.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that Malaysia is a “failed” state. Maybe in 15 years time when its Petroleum resources are depleted and the Patronage system falls apart.
I am also not that worried about being a “matured democracy” – that requires a well educated (at least 90% of pop) and equal social treatment for all citizens.
The real worry in Malaysia is the endemic corruption that askews priorities and drains the country resources. The second big worry is the continuous demand of “affirmative” actions based on “Ketuanan Melayu” instead of a social means test.
With the current crop of BN leaders brought up on a “ketuanan” diet I do not see any hope of real structural changes in the Malaysian governing landscape. Of course PKR can always win at the next GE and all hell may break loose.
No, my logic is perfectly sound, thank you all the same. 112 is a fact of life just as is the military in Burma. Its the same as people who at the last Burmese elections wanted a change to ASSK and were outraged when this didn’t happen. You have to reckon with reality, whether its pretty, just, fair or whatever. That’s not to say we shouldn’t look for change, but that there’s no point in naive idealism. As I said, there is all kind of space to protest the ‘system’ in Thailand. Is burning a coffin the way forward? Maybe, but its a fairly blunt itstrument. Think of Thongchai’s parable which has been reported on this website last year, the ongoing Facebook lakhoon that A. Walker talks about… all I’m saying is that there are all kinds of imaginative ways of expressing dissent that may be better than what frankly I think is a pointless effort to get rid of 112. Its in no-one’s (with power, that is) interest to get rid of it, so lets find other ways of achieving the same goal – a more just and transparent society that circumvents 112…
As far I can see, there are two questions: What to do when a foreign national is charged with LM, and what to do about the LM legislation.
For foreigners under arrest for LM, the only approach that has ever succeeded in getting them released has been discretely negotiated royal amnesties. And yes, that includes the requirement to admit guilt and express contrition. I lack Ralph Kramden’s courage. If I were arrested, I’d put my faith in that approach.
The LM legislation is a much more difficult issue. Barring an anti-monarchist, pro-republican coup d’etat, which would seem unlikely, the Thai Parliament must either amend or repeal the LM legislation. Under the current government, that appears even less likely than an anti-monarchist, pro-republican coup d’etat. Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm has declared that the legislation should be rigorously applied. The two Red Shirt leaders most vociferous in their demands for LM reform, Surachai Danwathananusorn and Somyot Phruksakasemsuk, are both in gaol and likely to remain there. No Phuea Thai Party MPs, no core leaders of the UDD, not even the main stream Red Shirts, are urging their release. In mid-August the Thai press quoted the UDD acting chairman, a Hanoi-trained former member of the Communist Party of Thailand, Mrs. Thida Thawornset, thus: “Daeng mai ao jao nan mai chai NPCh”, which I would translate as “Those anti-monarchist Reds are not members of the UDD”. Not only is there no sign of any effective and widely supported local pressure for change, there is none from any foreign government, either.
This time around, Andrew, PLEASE don’t accuse me of supporting the LM legislation just because I have expressed the opinion that efforts to change it are a forlorn hope.
Let me also point out the meaning of the word “spoonerism”. According to my Macquarie dictionary (you really should invest in a copy), a spoonerism is a phrase in which the initial or other sounds in words are transposed e.g. “our queer old dean” for “our dear old queen”. Or the Kenny Everett character of 1980s TV fame, Cupid Stunt. By those standards, “rood giddance” hardly qualifies as a spoonerism. Even worse, it’s not even witty.
The red shirts’s imaginative, and successful, protest a couple of years ago at Privy Councillor and former Prime Minister General Surayud’s country house, illegally constructed on national forest land in Nakhon Ratchasima province, was a classic example of the lateral thinking suggested by billyd.
The protest also highlighted the red shirt’s “double standards” campaign, as a restaurant located further down the same hill had been closed down and its owner jailed. No such punishment for the general, of course, but at least the house was demolished and a point made.
I would not be surprised at more such activities by the red shirts if the government drags its feet on issues they hold dear.
The red shirts’ imaginitive, and successful, protest at Privy Councillor and former PM General Surayud’s country house illegally constructed on forest land in Nakhon Ratchasima province a couple of years ago was a classic example of the lateral thinking suggested by billyd.
The protest also highlighted the red shirts’ “double standards” campaign, as a restaurant further down the same hill had been closed down and the owner jailed. No such punishment for the General, of course, but at least the house was demolished, and a point made.
I wouldn’t rule out more such activities by the red shirts if the government drags its feet on issues which they hold dear.
Maratjp: you mean you assume Joe has actually done what he is accused of, right? I believe he is (so far) claiming innocence, despite the usual pressure to admit guilt and take reduced sentences.
This is an interesting article arguing why Singapore is a better place to invest compared to Malaysia.
Choosing the right business destination will directly impact the success of a business. Assessing a country’s performance in various international rankings, surveys and studies is often a good way of researching a particular economy. In this regard, a comparison of country rankings between Singapore and Malaysia shows that Singapore is a more business-friendly location. Summarized below are the contrasting factors between both the economies:
Are these assertions correct?
Can Malaysia regain its former glory. Can it catch-up with South Korea, Taiwan and Singapore, who were once Malaysia’s peers?
Can Malaysia stave off the newcomers, China, India, Indonesia and Vietnam?
Will Malaysia become the new sick man of Asia, following in the footpath of the Philippines?
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War continues in Kachin State
That was the first I’d seen of your brief opinion piece, N.F., Kachin state: The war between China and India.
The article leaves me wondering what you have to say about Thai policy on Northern Burma (official policy, unofficial, or military improvisation) –given that there’s a newly elected government in office and so on.
While China and India are the most immediate foreign powers, they are also the least susceptible to change in their policy toward Burma. Kachin State could easily be the next South Ossetia; but, rightly or wrongly, there is no equivalent to Russian intervention in the equation. In that article, when you speak of an (unlikely) rapid end to the civil war through the intervention of Burma’s northern neighbors (China, India, or both) I could only imagine that it would resemble the independence/annexation of Ossetia; it is hard to imagine better, and easy to imagine worse, in such a scenario.
I am amused to note that the spell-checker does not yet recognize “Ossetia” as a correct spelling (it does seem to know “Kosovo”); I’m guessing that the South Ossets receive official recognition from the digital lexicon some time before the Kachin do.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Maratjp: Your first post @126 revealed your ignorance, your post @134 solidified it. Every accused is entitled to due process, not just the innocent ones.
Corruption in Malaysia and Singapore
Thanks Neptunian for that suggestion. Yes, I think Malaysians should have a zero tolerance policy on corruption.
Transparency International – Malaysia (TI-M) has called for reforms in political financing as a way to curb corruption. Malaysians perceive political parties as most corrupt.
This is definitely something that Mr. Najib Razak can easily implement if wants too. Will he?
A more detailed presentation of Malaysia’s CPI ranking for 2010 is available here and here.
Thai royal and the Magic Castle
Another of those at the Magic Castle is also worthy of greater scrutiny: DSI official Yanaphon Yongyuen who was immortalised in this astounding interview with Anasuya Sayal: http://blogs.channelnewsasia.com/anasuya-sanyal/2010/08/17/transcript-of-interview-with-yanaphon-youngyuen-deputy-director-general-department-of-special-investigation-dsi/
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
….”If in fact this Joe Gordon did not actually do what he is accused of then he is of course entitled his due process of law”
You need to wake up Maratjp….there is no “Rule of Law” in Thailand, no “Impartial Justice System”, no “Rules of Evidence”, no “Due Process of Law”………….
Btw, I’ll be sure to get the word out to those tens of millions of U.S. citizens who are “dual citizens”, that as far as Maratjp is concerned they are not actually U.S. citizens and they are no longer entitled to the rights of a U.S. citizen to go about their business in the U.S. as if they have the rights of a U.S.. citizen. Such as posting links to Yale University Press books on their blogs or, god forbid, doing partial translations of Yale University Press books.
Thai royal and the Magic Castle
Times like these I wish I was studying Law instead PoliSci:
http://www.humanrightsusa.org/images/stories/chai_complaint.pdf
Regardless though, the “demand for jury” file makes for easy reading and is very persuasive. I am very interested to see how Netfirms.com replies.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
billyd – 132
112 is a fact of life just as is the military in Burma.
It sure wasnt fact of like 30 years ago, hell, even 10 years ago there were fewer than 10 lese majeste cases annually, now we are looking at hundreds. If it wasnt fact of life 30 years ago sure it can be undone.
That’s not to say we shouldn’t look for change, but that there’s no point in naive idealism.
This is not even about idealism, this is simply about basic freedom of speech. If a country claimed to be democratic then at very least it should have the most fundamental right for its citizen so democracy can function properly.
Is burning a coffin the way forward? Maybe, but its a fairly blunt itstrument.
and someone got jail for that, how is it “Maybe” works is beyond me.
all I’m saying is that there are all kinds of imaginative ways of expressing dissent that may be better than what frankly I think is a pointless effort to get rid of 112
You seems not to get the point why I even mentioned the “burning coffin” and “Sombat’s talk show”. The thing is, no matter how much “imagination” you’ve got, they will find a way to jail you, dont you know why Da Torpido was sentence behind the close door?.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Ralph Kramden @127
Yeah, I’m assuming that the charges are legit. If in fact this Joe Gordon did not actually do what he is accused of then he is of course entitled his due process of law.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
What are the Reds doing about 112 and the 100+ prisoners?
I asked this question in Chiang Mai and was told they and the government are moving on the issue and there will be a meeting 18:00 on 19/9/2011 behind Wat Pra Sing here. Please go and cheer them on.
For details tune in to their radio station FM 92.5
http://www.fm925cm.ob.tc/webpage1/index.html
(Apologies I will be in China that day)
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Seh Fah: “For foreigners under arrest for LM, the only approach that has ever succeeded in getting them released has been discretely negotiated royal amnesties.”
Has any other approach ever been tried?
Corruption in Malaysia and Singapore
The one and only thing that Malaysians who do not agree to this state of affairs can do is to exercise their vote. Vote for a change and see what happens.
There nothing that can motivates a worker more than the fear of loosing his / her job. There’s nothing that motivates a politician more than the fear of losing his / her seat.
Show the current or the next govt that they can loose, and I am sure things will improve in Malaysia
Amsterdam on Thailand’s dual state
One thing that Sondhi Limthongkul said that I rather agree with is, “р╕кр╕▒р╕Зр╕Др╕бр╣Др╕Чр╕вр╣Ар╕ор╕╡р╣Йр╕в.” This means that the problem is not with police or politicians, but with society as a whole where civics, civility, and civil rights are basically left off the “Let’s keep having fun.” menu.
Amsterdam on Thailand’s dual state
QUOTE The founding fathers of the United States were the first to devise a system in which people could, if they liked, largely free themselves from the power hierarchies of their European past. UNQUOTE
I guess what you really mean is that the founding fathers found a way to coerce people into accepting a more local power hierarchy. One could argue that American democracy has been stagnant ever since. It isn’t that hard to figure out that both sets of Tea Parties were largely self-serving.
In Thailand’s case, you can leave out the local bit. Cash subversion of the kamnans and pooyaibahns (and other local mafias) will continue to prevent any real freedom – regardless of which CEO spends his way to the PMship.
Reforms in Malaysia – has Najib got it right?
Hai Greg,
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that Malaysia is a “failed” state. Maybe in 15 years time when its Petroleum resources are depleted and the Patronage system falls apart.
I am also not that worried about being a “matured democracy” – that requires a well educated (at least 90% of pop) and equal social treatment for all citizens.
The real worry in Malaysia is the endemic corruption that askews priorities and drains the country resources. The second big worry is the continuous demand of “affirmative” actions based on “Ketuanan Melayu” instead of a social means test.
With the current crop of BN leaders brought up on a “ketuanan” diet I do not see any hope of real structural changes in the Malaysian governing landscape. Of course PKR can always win at the next GE and all hell may break loose.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Tarrin 125
No, my logic is perfectly sound, thank you all the same. 112 is a fact of life just as is the military in Burma. Its the same as people who at the last Burmese elections wanted a change to ASSK and were outraged when this didn’t happen. You have to reckon with reality, whether its pretty, just, fair or whatever. That’s not to say we shouldn’t look for change, but that there’s no point in naive idealism. As I said, there is all kind of space to protest the ‘system’ in Thailand. Is burning a coffin the way forward? Maybe, but its a fairly blunt itstrument. Think of Thongchai’s parable which has been reported on this website last year, the ongoing Facebook lakhoon that A. Walker talks about… all I’m saying is that there are all kinds of imaginative ways of expressing dissent that may be better than what frankly I think is a pointless effort to get rid of 112. Its in no-one’s (with power, that is) interest to get rid of it, so lets find other ways of achieving the same goal – a more just and transparent society that circumvents 112…
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
As far I can see, there are two questions: What to do when a foreign national is charged with LM, and what to do about the LM legislation.
For foreigners under arrest for LM, the only approach that has ever succeeded in getting them released has been discretely negotiated royal amnesties. And yes, that includes the requirement to admit guilt and express contrition. I lack Ralph Kramden’s courage. If I were arrested, I’d put my faith in that approach.
The LM legislation is a much more difficult issue. Barring an anti-monarchist, pro-republican coup d’etat, which would seem unlikely, the Thai Parliament must either amend or repeal the LM legislation. Under the current government, that appears even less likely than an anti-monarchist, pro-republican coup d’etat. Deputy Prime Minister Chalerm has declared that the legislation should be rigorously applied. The two Red Shirt leaders most vociferous in their demands for LM reform, Surachai Danwathananusorn and Somyot Phruksakasemsuk, are both in gaol and likely to remain there. No Phuea Thai Party MPs, no core leaders of the UDD, not even the main stream Red Shirts, are urging their release. In mid-August the Thai press quoted the UDD acting chairman, a Hanoi-trained former member of the Communist Party of Thailand, Mrs. Thida Thawornset, thus: “Daeng mai ao jao nan mai chai NPCh”, which I would translate as “Those anti-monarchist Reds are not members of the UDD”. Not only is there no sign of any effective and widely supported local pressure for change, there is none from any foreign government, either.
This time around, Andrew, PLEASE don’t accuse me of supporting the LM legislation just because I have expressed the opinion that efforts to change it are a forlorn hope.
Let me also point out the meaning of the word “spoonerism”. According to my Macquarie dictionary (you really should invest in a copy), a spoonerism is a phrase in which the initial or other sounds in words are transposed e.g. “our queer old dean” for “our dear old queen”. Or the Kenny Everett character of 1980s TV fame, Cupid Stunt. By those standards, “rood giddance” hardly qualifies as a spoonerism. Even worse, it’s not even witty.
Goold luck with the PhD. You’re going to need it.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
billyd – 122 and Tarrin – 125
The red shirts’s imaginative, and successful, protest a couple of years ago at Privy Councillor and former Prime Minister General Surayud’s country house, illegally constructed on national forest land in Nakhon Ratchasima province, was a classic example of the lateral thinking suggested by billyd.
The protest also highlighted the red shirt’s “double standards” campaign, as a restaurant located further down the same hill had been closed down and its owner jailed. No such punishment for the general, of course, but at least the house was demolished and a point made.
I would not be surprised at more such activities by the red shirts if the government drags its feet on issues they hold dear.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Billyd – 122 and Tarrin – 125
The red shirts’ imaginitive, and successful, protest at Privy Councillor and former PM General Surayud’s country house illegally constructed on forest land in Nakhon Ratchasima province a couple of years ago was a classic example of the lateral thinking suggested by billyd.
The protest also highlighted the red shirts’ “double standards” campaign, as a restaurant further down the same hill had been closed down and the owner jailed. No such punishment for the General, of course, but at least the house was demolished, and a point made.
I wouldn’t rule out more such activities by the red shirts if the government drags its feet on issues which they hold dear.
FACT’s plea for Joe Gordon
Maratjp: you mean you assume Joe has actually done what he is accused of, right? I believe he is (so far) claiming innocence, despite the usual pressure to admit guilt and take reduced sentences.
Reforms in Malaysia – has Najib got it right?
This is an interesting article arguing why Singapore is a better place to invest compared to Malaysia.
Are these assertions correct?
Can Malaysia regain its former glory. Can it catch-up with South Korea, Taiwan and Singapore, who were once Malaysia’s peers?
Can Malaysia stave off the newcomers, China, India, Indonesia and Vietnam?
Will Malaysia become the new sick man of Asia, following in the footpath of the Philippines?