Then under “HRH” tab. It is there. There are 4 planes listed including HS-CMV.
Portman: You do realise that problems faced by WB (and their predecessor’s problems regarding DMT) pre-date Thaksin and are listed thoroughly in the arbitration decision. The toll decision was one of the bigger problems for WB, but they had a litany of complaints before and after that over breaches of the contract which cost DMT money. There is a reason why The Nation and the Democrats haven’t jumped on the issue to lay it at solely at the feet of Thaksin.
jwj. Your conspiracy theory about Prem is off beam. The person who tipped off Werner Schneider about the royal plane was clearly Thaksin. His finger prints are all over this from ripping off the DMT consortium in 2003 by reducing the toll to B20 through to ingratiating himself with the CP by offering to pay the 20 million euros from an offshore account and later get reimbursed by his sister after she has had a chance to look good by solving the problem.
[…] 11 party-list candidates and won a sensational four-seat-mandate, mostly because of his unique straight-talking, no-nonsense, in-your-face style, but also partly thanks to protest votes – especially from the youth. Right from the onset, […]
It is unlikely the elevation of the daughter could imply good relations with the second ex-wife and the four boys. There were accusations of Yuwatida physically abusing the girl cited by Handley who had the CP personally flying to England to rescue his daughter. Rumours were current before the birth of the youngest that Thaksin was taking care of the educations of the four boys, in case they might be of use to him some day.
Think back to happier times for that earlier family iteration and the publicity photos of CP on pre-fufu birthdays wearing a Saville Row tweed suit smoking a pipe, cast as the loving paterfamilias surrounded by the royal consort with the four strapping boys and two girls and smiling telling reporters he was ready to settle down. Ah well. What the Lord giveth…..
“And you still can’t tell the difference between patriotism and chauvinism.”
“Physician first heal thyself”
I definitely will not call ANY available photo of IDP and refugees celebratory knowing well ALL have exchanged one kind of hell for another with NO end insight under the false mantra of popular struggle prevailing.
With the additions of names such as Vichit, Prasert and Isara for finance, energy and commerce respectively Thaksin is fixing to appoint a cabinet of technocrats in key economic ministries in the style of Prem in his heyday before he lost his marbles and picked the ineffectual Sarayud and his “ginger” Baan Bangkae cabinet. Plus ├зa change….. Have to tip my hat to him for reviving one of Pa Prem’s clever ideas for a seat warmer cabinet that will take pressure off his sister and fend off the ugly red shirt MPs until he is ready to come back himself along with the banned 111.
Are you serious ? Are you wasting your time on this stuff?
I have not read this one yet and I don’t think I will.
It is no creditable reference, it is such a tabloid.
“well inform source” what a joke? If it is something true why they are hiding?
You must be talking about the popular and affordable satellite based “Skynet┬о digital bundle”.
It was available for a very short while with ‘fast internet’ within the package.
Because of the popularity of this service, was terminated by the power that be (PTB) rather quickly.
Now only available without the internet.
Obviously alarmed by the potentials that might negatively impact there hold/control.
Nic
An internet system within Myanmar akin to China is not unimaginable.
Skynet┬о is licensed from China operated by a Chinese.
Some how if the Chinese see the need for an up to date (satellite) internet system, to help with their pillaging of Myanmar, it will be hard for the PTB not to acquiesce.
Words has it the Military is setting up an up to date Telecom system ├а la América├оn for its Myawaddy TV.
You can now imagine why and how SANCTION has set and condemned Myanmar from any potential for changes through conventional consumer technology and other economic activities.
As for the other side of this sanction coin, is the plight of the most vulnerable, especially in the delta area.
I have not read a Wikileaks report of the CP being in Florida. I know that he travelled to the Northeast USA when his daughter Princess Bajrakitiyabha received a doctorate of law.
In fact, I do not believe that the CP would visit them in Florida at all. I still remember what happened to Khun Yuvathida when the CP banished her from Thailand. She had been accused of adultery, and had her embarrassing private pictures leaked to the public. When a husband has done those things to his own wife, that does not really suggest that he would still be in good terms with her.
There is a letter from the Thai Ambassador to UK writing to these four guys personally that he acts on behalf of the CP, requesting them to return their diplomatic passports and change the surname. And that letter is indeed authentic, as it comes with the Royal Thai Embassy letterhead and the signature of the ambassador himself. This evidence alone suggests that CP would not be in good terms with his four boys.
I think the letter itself is carefully worded, and the writer took great caution not to offend the Monarchy, with a hope that they can still go back to Thailand to enjoy their royal status.
As for the CP elevating Bussaya Nambejra (aka Princess Sirivanvari) to the princess status, I believe that it has nothing to do with the CP being in good terms with Khun Yuvathida and his four boys. Thai succession law favours a male heir to succeed the throne. Princess Sirivanvari is a female; thus, she is not in a position to compete for her father’s throne, unlike those four guys-all of them very highly educated.
In my opinion (and I would welcome anyone to discuss this to see whether my belief is right or wrong-please do give reasons as well though :p), I believe that the reason these four boys are banished from Thailand is because the CP is afraid that they are potential rivals to his throne.
Their educational achievements alone make them sound like the princes from central casting. Reminds me of Britain in 1745, with Bonnie Prince Charlie (the Young Pretender) in exile in France and King George II on the throne in London. Time to re-write the Skye Boat Song. “Speed, bonny jet, like a bird on the wing. Onward, the pilots cry. Carry the lad who was born to be king, back to the land of the Thai”.
Khun Tarrin, in preparing to respond to your comment, I felt it would be easy to ‘prove’ that the Thai Civil Aviation reference was ‘pre-existing’ (see below as posted by the Bangkok Pundit) and so not a ‘forgery’ as you suggested it could be.
The awesomely though Bangkok Pundit included a link to an English version of the Registry, so I went there to check out if there was a — sequential case number for the plane’s ownership listing in the registry. The date of this number, if consistent with a sequence of surrounding dates, should show whether or not the CP’s ownership listing is, in fact, pre-dating the present controversy.
I found two surprising ‘facts’.
First, there are many ‘blank’ spaces in the case numbering sequence. So into any of these blanks any listing could be inserted ‘out of any dated sequential order.’ Therefore, finding a ‘pre-existing’ listing’s in the case number sequence would prove nothing as such a listing could, indeed, be a later introduced ‘forgery’ or not. So nothing was ‘provable’ by this method, either way.
The second finding is more disturbing. I could not find ANY listing whatsoever for any CP plane!
This raises many questions:
1. Was the listing there when the BP looked and now it has been removed?
2. Did the BP accidentally put in an incorrect link?
3. What is the ‘Official’ standing of an English spreadsheet, anyway?
4. Is there an ‘Official’ Thai spreadsheet that shows the listing?
5. Would an examination of the ‘case number sequencing placement’ in an Official Thai spreadsheet support the ‘pre-existing’ ownership contention or not?
(BP) According to the Thai Department of Civil Aviation, “HS-CMV” is a Boeing 737-400 with a CFM56-3C1 engine which was first registered on October 11, 2005. The owner is listed as “H.R.H. THE CROWN PRINCE MAHA VAJIRALONGKORN” (this information can be seen in this spreadsheet in English available from here. )
How do we know that what you said was not a total fabrication?
1. If the Crown Prince and his wife (I guess your mean Mom Srirat) travelled to Florida often to visit his ex and their sons, why have we not heard this news in Thailand? What is more realistic is that the pair, the Crown Prince and his ex (Sucharinee/Yuwathida/Benz) went through a bitter divorce. She was kicked out of the Crown Prince’s palace. Indeed, it was because of Srirat who plotted to get rid of Sucharinee so that she could become number-one wife. On top of this, the Crown Prince and Srirat came out with a number of allegations against Sucharinee so as to justify their separation (adultery and drug trafficking). Therefore, the three do not have the best relationship.
2. If your side of the story is not fabricated, then why have we not seen photos of them together in Orlando? Com’on, you claimed that many Thais residing in Orlando have seen them together openly, and I assume, amicably. I do not believe that they will keep their mouth shut, as many in Thailand do not know about the Prince’s regular visit to Florida, as you claimed. I am not even sure if Thai diplomats in Washington would know about these so-called visits to the United States.
3. If they have not been abandoned, and again, I assume that they have maintained their good relationship with their father, then why are they not allowed back in Thailand?
4. The issue of their youngest sisters being elevated to the HRH status has nothing to do with them being on “good terms” with their father as you claimed. In fact, it was because the relationship between them was so bad that the Prince decided to elevate Siriwanwalee to become HRH.
5. I assume that you, Jesse, are Thai, since you wanted to “enlighten all foreign academic scholars”. I don’t think your contribution on NM here is part of enlightening those foreign academic.
I’m not in florida, do you Jesse? I’ve read some of cable leaks and it was totally different story. Also their youngest sis been elevated up why woundn’t the others? Check out your comment “dislike” growing 🙂
I agree with Tarrin that it’s not the CP’s fault that the Thai government did not pay its international debts (but it’s funny to watch the ex PM Abhisit and ex FM Kasit’s bumbling in trying to deal with the situation:)
It’s very hard to understand why the government didn’t just reach a settlement to quietly end the matter, and I suspect there is more at play than just money and face.
“Tony”, my view is that the authenticity, or otherwise, of a significant document like this is a matter for legitimate public discussion. As your own work amply demonstrates, the general public is the best judge of nonsense. AW
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Plane audacity in Thai dispute
Sam:
http://www.aviation.go.th/AviationNews/Thai%20Aircraft%20List_18%20Apr%202011%20EX.xls
Then under “HRH” tab. It is there. There are 4 planes listed including HS-CMV.
Portman: You do realise that problems faced by WB (and their predecessor’s problems regarding DMT) pre-date Thaksin and are listed thoroughly in the arbitration decision. The toll decision was one of the bigger problems for WB, but they had a litany of complaints before and after that over breaches of the contract which cost DMT money. There is a reason why The Nation and the Democrats haven’t jumped on the issue to lay it at solely at the feet of Thaksin.
Plane audacity in Thai dispute
jwj. Your conspiracy theory about Prem is off beam. The person who tipped off Werner Schneider about the royal plane was clearly Thaksin. His finger prints are all over this from ripping off the DMT consortium in 2003 by reducing the toll to B20 through to ingratiating himself with the CP by offering to pay the 20 million euros from an offshore account and later get reimbursed by his sister after she has had a chance to look good by solving the problem.
Chuvit on the streets
[…] 11 party-list candidates and won a sensational four-seat-mandate, mostly because of his unique straight-talking, no-nonsense, in-your-face style, but also partly thanks to protest votes – especially from the youth. Right from the onset, […]
Crown Prince’s family update?
It is unlikely the elevation of the daughter could imply good relations with the second ex-wife and the four boys. There were accusations of Yuwatida physically abusing the girl cited by Handley who had the CP personally flying to England to rescue his daughter. Rumours were current before the birth of the youngest that Thaksin was taking care of the educations of the four boys, in case they might be of use to him some day.
Think back to happier times for that earlier family iteration and the publicity photos of CP on pre-fufu birthdays wearing a Saville Row tweed suit smoking a pipe, cast as the loving paterfamilias surrounded by the royal consort with the four strapping boys and two girls and smiling telling reporters he was ready to settle down. Ah well. What the Lord giveth…..
Crown Prince’s family update?
Simon,
Please have some respect when referring to a senior air force officer.
Taking photos in Burma
@#9
“And you still can’t tell the difference between patriotism and chauvinism.”
“Physician first heal thyself”
I definitely will not call ANY available photo of IDP and refugees celebratory knowing well ALL have exchanged one kind of hell for another with NO end insight under the false mantra of popular struggle prevailing.
Yingluck’s Foreign Minister
With the additions of names such as Vichit, Prasert and Isara for finance, energy and commerce respectively Thaksin is fixing to appoint a cabinet of technocrats in key economic ministries in the style of Prem in his heyday before he lost his marbles and picked the ineffectual Sarayud and his “ginger” Baan Bangkae cabinet. Plus ├зa change….. Have to tip my hat to him for reviving one of Pa Prem’s clever ideas for a seat warmer cabinet that will take pressure off his sister and fend off the ugly red shirt MPs until he is ready to come back himself along with the banned 111.
Crown Prince’s family update?
Are you serious ? Are you wasting your time on this stuff?
I have not read this one yet and I don’t think I will.
It is no creditable reference, it is such a tabloid.
“well inform source” what a joke? If it is something true why they are hiding?
Mobile telephony in Burma
@#5
Tom
You must be talking about the popular and affordable satellite based “Skynet┬о digital bundle”.
It was available for a very short while with ‘fast internet’ within the package.
Because of the popularity of this service, was terminated by the power that be (PTB) rather quickly.
Now only available without the internet.
Obviously alarmed by the potentials that might negatively impact there hold/control.
Nic
An internet system within Myanmar akin to China is not unimaginable.
Skynet┬о is licensed from China operated by a Chinese.
Some how if the Chinese see the need for an up to date (satellite) internet system, to help with their pillaging of Myanmar, it will be hard for the PTB not to acquiesce.
Words has it the Military is setting up an up to date Telecom system ├а la América├оn for its Myawaddy TV.
You can now imagine why and how SANCTION has set and condemned Myanmar from any potential for changes through conventional consumer technology and other economic activities.
As for the other side of this sanction coin, is the plight of the most vulnerable, especially in the delta area.
Crown Prince’s family update?
Was this written originally in Thai? Anyone have a link to the Thai version?
Thanks.
Crown Prince’s family update?
I have not read a Wikileaks report of the CP being in Florida. I know that he travelled to the Northeast USA when his daughter Princess Bajrakitiyabha received a doctorate of law.
In fact, I do not believe that the CP would visit them in Florida at all. I still remember what happened to Khun Yuvathida when the CP banished her from Thailand. She had been accused of adultery, and had her embarrassing private pictures leaked to the public. When a husband has done those things to his own wife, that does not really suggest that he would still be in good terms with her.
There is a letter from the Thai Ambassador to UK writing to these four guys personally that he acts on behalf of the CP, requesting them to return their diplomatic passports and change the surname. And that letter is indeed authentic, as it comes with the Royal Thai Embassy letterhead and the signature of the ambassador himself. This evidence alone suggests that CP would not be in good terms with his four boys.
I think the letter itself is carefully worded, and the writer took great caution not to offend the Monarchy, with a hope that they can still go back to Thailand to enjoy their royal status.
As for the CP elevating Bussaya Nambejra (aka Princess Sirivanvari) to the princess status, I believe that it has nothing to do with the CP being in good terms with Khun Yuvathida and his four boys. Thai succession law favours a male heir to succeed the throne. Princess Sirivanvari is a female; thus, she is not in a position to compete for her father’s throne, unlike those four guys-all of them very highly educated.
In my opinion (and I would welcome anyone to discuss this to see whether my belief is right or wrong-please do give reasons as well though :p), I believe that the reason these four boys are banished from Thailand is because the CP is afraid that they are potential rivals to his throne.
But again, this is just my assumption 🙂
Crown Prince’s family update?
Their educational achievements alone make them sound like the princes from central casting. Reminds me of Britain in 1745, with Bonnie Prince Charlie (the Young Pretender) in exile in France and King George II on the throne in London. Time to re-write the Skye Boat Song. “Speed, bonny jet, like a bird on the wing. Onward, the pilots cry. Carry the lad who was born to be king, back to the land of the Thai”.
Crown Prince’s family update?
If it is not authentic, the fact that it has been released as such is worthy of discussion.
Plane audacity in Thai dispute
Re: Tarrin@232
Khun Tarrin, in preparing to respond to your comment, I felt it would be easy to ‘prove’ that the Thai Civil Aviation reference was ‘pre-existing’ (see below as posted by the Bangkok Pundit) and so not a ‘forgery’ as you suggested it could be.
The awesomely though Bangkok Pundit included a link to an English version of the Registry, so I went there to check out if there was a — sequential case number for the plane’s ownership listing in the registry. The date of this number, if consistent with a sequence of surrounding dates, should show whether or not the CP’s ownership listing is, in fact, pre-dating the present controversy.
I found two surprising ‘facts’.
First, there are many ‘blank’ spaces in the case numbering sequence. So into any of these blanks any listing could be inserted ‘out of any dated sequential order.’ Therefore, finding a ‘pre-existing’ listing’s in the case number sequence would prove nothing as such a listing could, indeed, be a later introduced ‘forgery’ or not. So nothing was ‘provable’ by this method, either way.
The second finding is more disturbing. I could not find ANY listing whatsoever for any CP plane!
This raises many questions:
1. Was the listing there when the BP looked and now it has been removed?
2. Did the BP accidentally put in an incorrect link?
3. What is the ‘Official’ standing of an English spreadsheet, anyway?
4. Is there an ‘Official’ Thai spreadsheet that shows the listing?
5. Would an examination of the ‘case number sequencing placement’ in an Official Thai spreadsheet support the ‘pre-existing’ ownership contention or not?
Ugh!
Following is the full BP comment as well as the registry link.
http://asiancorrespondent.com/59962/liquidator-seizes-royal-thai-air-force-plane-in-munich-an-update/ [quote is found under point 2.]
(BP) According to the Thai Department of Civil Aviation, “HS-CMV” is a Boeing 737-400 with a CFM56-3C1 engine which was first registered on October 11, 2005. The owner is listed as “H.R.H. THE CROWN PRINCE MAHA VAJIRALONGKORN” (this information can be seen in this spreadsheet in English available from here. )
Crown Prince’s family update?
Jesse (5)
How do we know that what you said was not a total fabrication?
1. If the Crown Prince and his wife (I guess your mean Mom Srirat) travelled to Florida often to visit his ex and their sons, why have we not heard this news in Thailand? What is more realistic is that the pair, the Crown Prince and his ex (Sucharinee/Yuwathida/Benz) went through a bitter divorce. She was kicked out of the Crown Prince’s palace. Indeed, it was because of Srirat who plotted to get rid of Sucharinee so that she could become number-one wife. On top of this, the Crown Prince and Srirat came out with a number of allegations against Sucharinee so as to justify their separation (adultery and drug trafficking). Therefore, the three do not have the best relationship.
2. If your side of the story is not fabricated, then why have we not seen photos of them together in Orlando? Com’on, you claimed that many Thais residing in Orlando have seen them together openly, and I assume, amicably. I do not believe that they will keep their mouth shut, as many in Thailand do not know about the Prince’s regular visit to Florida, as you claimed. I am not even sure if Thai diplomats in Washington would know about these so-called visits to the United States.
3. If they have not been abandoned, and again, I assume that they have maintained their good relationship with their father, then why are they not allowed back in Thailand?
4. The issue of their youngest sisters being elevated to the HRH status has nothing to do with them being on “good terms” with their father as you claimed. In fact, it was because the relationship between them was so bad that the Prince decided to elevate Siriwanwalee to become HRH.
5. I assume that you, Jesse, are Thai, since you wanted to “enlighten all foreign academic scholars”. I don’t think your contribution on NM here is part of enlightening those foreign academic.
Crown Prince’s family update?
Looks like a concerted attempt is underway to discredit someone.
Crown Prince’s family update?
I’m not in florida, do you Jesse? I’ve read some of cable leaks and it was totally different story. Also their youngest sis been elevated up why woundn’t the others? Check out your comment “dislike” growing 🙂
Plane audacity in Thai dispute
I agree with Tarrin that it’s not the CP’s fault that the Thai government did not pay its international debts (but it’s funny to watch the ex PM Abhisit and ex FM Kasit’s bumbling in trying to deal with the situation:)
It’s very hard to understand why the government didn’t just reach a settlement to quietly end the matter, and I suspect there is more at play than just money and face.
Crown Prince’s family update?
“Tony”, my view is that the authenticity, or otherwise, of a significant document like this is a matter for legitimate public discussion. As your own work amply demonstrates, the general public is the best judge of nonsense. AW
Crown Prince’s family update?
“I cannot vouch for its authenticity…” VERY academic “Dr.” Walker. I guess tabloid-style gossip now passes as ‘academia’ in Australia now?