General Sonthi is a Shia Muslim with family roots that came to Thailand from Iran/Persia. The Muslims in Southern Thailand are Sunni, not exactly “blood brothers” with Shia.
[…] in Australia this New Mandala post caught the mood. A day later, Andrew Walker and I provided our more detailed reflections on the documentary and its implications. As we wrote at that time, “[i]nside Thailand, people may […]
Due to the sham elections, the Kachin, Karen, Shan and Mon Resistance Armies are in the process of activating their PLAN Bs.
Than Shwe and his cronies and their dirty corrupt business deals like the Myitsome Dam and the Dawei project acted as the catalyst for the resumption of a nation-wide civil war in Burma.
During the 2007 National Uprising, the Rangoon Regional Commander Major-General Hla Htay Win refused Than Shwe’s order to mass murder Buddhist Monks. The Light Infantry Division (LID) Commander (with a Shan wife) based near Pegu also refused this disgusting order. The LID Commander was demoted to Deputy Minister, but Than Shwe was unable to demote the Rangoon Commander to Minister. His faction protected him and Hla Htay Win was promoted to Lt. General and Chief of Armed Forces Training which had no control of combat troops.
Than Shwe’s choice was Commander-in-Chief was rejected and Hla Htay Win ended up in the very powerful position as Chief of Staff for Army,Navy and Air Force.
What we are witnessing is the nation-wide rejection of Than Shwe’s sham elections.
“I’ve heard Sonthi say this before but I personally didn’t think PT would hold hands with the very guy who toppled Thaksin. But who knows!
Given the placatory noises that PT/Yingluck are making in Prayuth’s direction (including promising to leave him in place), it wouldn’t surprise me if the calculated PT realpolitik also extends to a “nose-holding” entirely pragmatic view of Sonthi – bringing him on board as a kind of “reassurance” asset. He won’t control enough seats to really matter in a PT coalition (consortium) but he’d likely be a handy symbol. They could even give him a Minister for the South/Muslim/minorities kind of portfolio – something overseeing the Nakhon Pattani proposal being started?
If Yingluck’s current reception in the South is anything to go by, both sides might view it as win-win to look even more reconciled and in a more pronounced way before the voting.
For KA 7:
1. Again, depending how you frame the statistics — or what period you are looking at — you can make an argument for either the Thais or the Australians as being the third largest foreign force in South Vietnam. One page 1 of my book, I write “At that point [ early 1969], Thailand had the third largest contingent in South Vietnam…”
2. In the book I use the English terms “Queen’s Cobra Regiment” and “Black Panther Division” as part of each unit’s name; however, these terms are not necessarily part of the official Thai names of the units, nor are they always part of the official English translations. The official English translation of the first group, for example, is the Queen’s Cobra Volunteer Unit. But it was so frequently called the Queen’s Cobra Regiment in English that I used that term most often in the book. The initial offer of Thai troops in late 1966 and early 1967 was a force closer to what amounts to a reinforced brigade in the US Army. The doubling of that force part way through 1967 encouraged the use of the term “regiment” in the common English translation albeit not officially in the Thai. And as for the Black Panther Division, part way through the war the RTA asked that the new English translation be “Black Leopard Division” to avoid any confusion with the more famous militant Black Panther Party active in the United States.
3. I don’t argue that it was improper to put it there. But the monument’s location in the RTA camp at Latya in Kanchanaburi is hardly a prominent site for memorial honoring a force that received enormous national attention and praise during the war years. Unlike Bangkok’s Victory Monument — whose form it copies — it is hardly ever viewed by anyone not connected with the RTA. Of the veterans I talked with, many are pleased with its location — they agree that it is in a proper place; this is something I write about in the book. Others feel it could have been put somewhere more visible to the Thai public. These latter veterans wish the subsequent generations were more aware of their service. And I suspect we could argue for a long time about the various shades of meaning implied by “hidden” or “tucked away” to no good conclusion.
4. I look forward to reading your book. I’m glad you are pursuing it. It is a great topic, and one that deserves more attention in Thai historical studies. (Send me your name off list — [email protected] — and I’ll watch out for your book next year.)
Thanks for the comments.
Best regards.
RR
@ SteveCM – thank you for the link. I’ve heard Sonthi say this before but I personally didn’t think PT would hold hands with the very guy who toppled Thaksin. But who knows!
Sonthi gave an interview on Channel 11 (Kui nok sapa) that he needed something to do after he retired and that he was asked by many politicians and people in the south to form a party and help improve the situation down there. There was a trip to Mecca that included Wadah guys (Wan M. Nor Matha as well) some 2 years back, which was a starting point of this party.
Yesterday Wan Nor came to see Yingluck while she was out campaigning in Narathiwat. Clearly he’s trying to maintain good relationships with both.
I think there is a parallel between the Thai provincial godfathers and the old style southern (USA) sheriffs during the early 20th century. These people ruled their little fiefdoms through a combination of economic and physical intimidation. It was only when the South began a period of remarkable economic growth in the late 1960’s that these fiefdoms were broken up. Hopefully the same thing will happen in Thailand and you can already see the beginnings of it in the voting patterns of the provincial urban areas.
This has always been my problem with the UDD. It just seems like the main backers and local leaders tend to be the minions of these godfathers who in fact have the most to lose if the professed goals of the UDD are ever realized.
An eye-opening work with a relevant message: “If neither state law nor the law of sacred centers is relevant to people who have been injured and are seeking redress, then where do these people go in search of justice?” Our protagonists choose 1) submission to karma and faith in the irrational, invisible justice system, and 2) adoption of straight vengeance through materialist compensation.
This book seems to illustrate the cultural dimension that’s largely missing from most press coverage of the political crisis. Calling the yellows “fascistic” and the reds “ignorant” misses the larger context: the yellows believe in the karmic system of bodhidarma kings and righteous wise leaders, while the reds have gone the opposite way and just want payment for their pains and their turn at the trough.
On this basis, the reds have the stronger argument simply because the yellow way has been tried and proven a failure. But unless their tenure in power prioritizes an overhaul/reconstruction of a working, transparent criminal/civil justice system, the result will probably be no better.
The only good that can be said about them is that, regardless their skeletons in the closet, they do in their localities and areas of influence have an important function. They do, and have to, make sure that their activities do also benefit their communities.
You are too forgiving Nick. With the big guys, the short term benefits they bring to a town or region are overshadowed by the damage done. The corruption and control of illegal activities cost far more. That the local police and civil servants also end up under their control means there is no easy way out of this pit. (No, I don’t know the answer either, but I suspect the heads of these families have got to end up in prison to solve the problem.)
The southern border provinces remind me of Judea according to Monty Python.
1. The People’s Front of Pattani wanted regional autonomy but to remain part of Thailand.
2. The Popular Front of Pattani wanted to separate from Thailand and become part of Malaysia.
3. The Popular People’s Front of Pattani wanted territorial separation and total independence.
Then the Popular People’s Front of Pattani split.
4. The People’s Popular Front of Pattani want to restore the Sultan and become an Islamic monarchy along Saudi Arabian lines.
5. The Popular People’s Progressive Front want to to establish a secular Islamic state along Turkish lines.
6. The Popular People’s Islamic Front want to establish a fundamentalist Islamic state along Iranian lines.
And the Monster Raving Loony Insurgent Front just want to keep the insurgency going because of the money to be made.
Given this situation, I would suggest that General Sonthi Bunyaratklin and his Matuphum (Motherland) Party have n0 chance. Nor does anyone else. The Thai Government should admit they made a mistake in 1904, move the border three and a half provinces north, and leave the Pattani Malay Muslims to sort things out for themselves. Maybe form a new country and call in Ragaan.
Rick Ruth 6: I have not yet read your book, only the review, but may I state the following:
1. At its peak (1968-1970) the Australian commitment to South Vietnam was an infantry brigade and supporting arms and services totalling around 8,000 men, somewhat less than the infantry division deployed by Thailand. Overall, however, more Australians served in South Vietnam than Thais. The claim that “after America and South Korea, Thailand’s military contribution was the third largest of the Free World nations” may have been true for a three-year period, but not overall.
2. I would prefer to say that the Black Panther Division replaced the Queen’s Cobra Regiment in 1968, rather than referring to them using imprecise terms like contingent or unit.
3. Craig described “the official monument to the country’s involvement in the Vietnam War” as “tucked away from public view”. To me that implies “hidden away”. My Thai Army friends describe it as a memorial to the Black Panther Division, erected (quite properly) at the entrance to the base of its successor, the 9th Infantry Division.
4. The Victory Monument in Bangkok commemorates the War to Recover the Lost Territories of December 1940 – January 1941, when Thailand took advantage of French weakness following the German invasion of May 1940 to invade French Indochina and regain the Cambodian provinces of Siem Reap and Battambang and the Lao provinces of Sayaboury and Champassak, which the French had forced Siam to cede in 1907. This transfer of territory was reversed after the Second World War ended. A distant echo of that border dispute can still be heard at Khao Phra Wihan.
I’ve ordered a copy of your book and I look forward to reading it. I hope that in due course you will read a copy of my history of the War to Recover the Lost Territories, which I hope to publish in 2012.
SteveCM 30,
This fine might accord with the judiciarys “SSS” (Sakdina Sliding Scale). I posit that it might represent the deppity’s low rating in the view of the judiciary. 1000 baht is not what it was. Though I should add I have little understanding of the mysteries and machinations of the thai judicial system. . .
It also probably depends if you price your eggs by weight instead of quantity, perhaps it was a large egg?
There are many godfather/mafia style politicians in all parties. The only good that can be said about them is that, regardless their skeletons in the closet, they do in their localities and areas of influence have an important function. They do, and have to, make sure that their activities do also benefit their communities. They often also function as a go-between a threatening state and its security forces (police, etc) and the people. They help solving conflicts. Their communities need them, and they need their communities.
All this cannot be said about Chuvit. In his activities the only community was his wallet, and whoever he paid off.
KA: I don’t think Craig’s review carries the errors you are suggesting it does. Rather, I think you are looking at different parameters for your statistics.
1. Over the full span of the Vietnam War, Australia ultimately sent more soldiers to fight there than did the Thais. But in 1968-1969, the peak of Australia’s involvement, there were more Thai troops in South Vietnam than Australian. Writing as I am from Thailand, I don’t have the exact numbers in front of me, but if I recall correctly Australia had about 7,000+ troops there to Thailand’s 11,000 in that period. The Thais were the third largest foreign army after the Americans and South Koreans when they put their division in (along with smaller units from the Royal Thai Navy and Royal Thai Air Force).
2. Yes. “Supplanted” is a better description of what happened than “supported.” The Black Panther contingent replaced the Queen’s Cobra unit midway through 1968 following an agreement between the Washington and Bangkok that was hammered out in late 1967.
3. I did characterize Thailand’s Vietnam War Memorial as being largely hidden from public view because was it built in an RTA camp outside of Kanchanaburi’s city district (not in Bangkok or even Lopburi). Few outside of the Royal Thai Army visit it, even though it is not far from a town that attracts many Thai and foreign tourists throughout the year. But I don’t suggest that it ended up there because Thailand’s leadership thought their involvement in the war was a mistake. I do not make that argument in the book, nor does Craig in his review.
4. I concur. When I first came to Thailand in 1988, I did ask many Thai friends what victory did Victory Monument commemorate. Most of my interlocutors were young Thais working in a refugee camp at Phanat Nikhom. Few of them knew for sure, and I never got precisely the same answer twice.
Thank you for the feedback and comments.
Rick Ruth
WLH “Wouldn’t it be a lot easier to hire some ex-Mossad agents to ‘disappear’ Thaksin? ”
This must be under consideration as highly cost effective solution. Thaksin seems to have developed a number of business disputes while abroad, including with the Emirati lawyer, to act as credible camouflage and there is always the possibly of a love triangle since he reverted to bachelor status. Without him PT would devour itself pretty quickly and Yingluck would soon look like a newly graduated teacher from a white middle class home trying to keep order in a classroom in a bad ass inner city black neighborhood.
Any compromise that gives Yingluck the premiership cannot be acceptable to the powerful forces against Thaksin. Even if she is obliged to agree not amnesty her brother to get the job, She only has to limp through about 9 months and then she can call a snap election for after 31 May 2012 so the TRT old guard can stand in it and hope to give PT an absolute majority
Does Sonthi really have that much bharami in the South? He’s a Muslim, but not Malay. The Far South saw the worst violence in its modern history while he was army commander.
Matubhum’s thabuang policy for the Far South is hardly going to be a massive vote winner. Given the very weak party allegiance among Muslims in the Far South, the party seems more likely to sink or swim on the quality of candidates chosen to stand rather than Sonthi’s leadership.
Also, does anyone know how this party came about? How did Sonthi end up leading a group made up of old Wadah guys and henchmen of Wattana Asavahame? Seems an odd match.
It is interesting that Aripen Uttarasin. the holder of their pre-house dissolution party list seat, has now been bumped down to third on the party list behind Sonthi and Man Patanothai. Would have thought that would not have gone down too well with the Southern group of MPs seen as that is probably where all their party list votes will come from. Ariphen now seems sure to lose his seat. Den Tohmeena, another ageing Wadah big shot, is also well down the party list.
BTW, worth noting that the egg-thrower (who missed) was fined 1,000 baht – while the Khunying who actually slapped a PT supporter was fined just 500 baht…..
A story on television news today has it that vandalising election posters is likely to earn 4 years in jail and a 60,000 baht fine (I hope my memory on the figures is okay). Maybe the establishment can just have political vandalism subsumed under terrorism and that would do the trick for them.
Suthep was the target of an egg thrown yesterday. The media gave it considerable attention. My view was that he walked in front of a thrown egg, so it was his fault.
Nick (c20) and Foster (c22) – thanks for providing more background on Chuwit (particularly the link to the reports of what was done in Sukhumvit Square).
Not unnaturally, reading that information revises my opinion of Chuwit as being something akin to a “lovable old rogue” – even if there are many others in the Thai Parliament with similar skeletons in their closets.
Saying so at least enables Vichai_N to now go back to the endless repetition of his other customary mantras.
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Small is beautiful?
General Sonthi is a Shia Muslim with family roots that came to Thailand from Iran/Persia. The Muslims in Southern Thailand are Sunni, not exactly “blood brothers” with Shia.
Reflections on Eric Campbell’s royal report
[…] in Australia this New Mandala post caught the mood. A day later, Andrew Walker and I provided our more detailed reflections on the documentary and its implications. As we wrote at that time, “[i]nside Thailand, people may […]
War in Kachin State
Due to the sham elections, the Kachin, Karen, Shan and Mon Resistance Armies are in the process of activating their PLAN Bs.
Than Shwe and his cronies and their dirty corrupt business deals like the Myitsome Dam and the Dawei project acted as the catalyst for the resumption of a nation-wide civil war in Burma.
During the 2007 National Uprising, the Rangoon Regional Commander Major-General Hla Htay Win refused Than Shwe’s order to mass murder Buddhist Monks. The Light Infantry Division (LID) Commander (with a Shan wife) based near Pegu also refused this disgusting order. The LID Commander was demoted to Deputy Minister, but Than Shwe was unable to demote the Rangoon Commander to Minister. His faction protected him and Hla Htay Win was promoted to Lt. General and Chief of Armed Forces Training which had no control of combat troops.
Than Shwe’s choice was Commander-in-Chief was rejected and Hla Htay Win ended up in the very powerful position as Chief of Staff for Army,Navy and Air Force.
What we are witnessing is the nation-wide rejection of Than Shwe’s sham elections.
Small is beautiful?
c5
“I’ve heard Sonthi say this before but I personally didn’t think PT would hold hands with the very guy who toppled Thaksin. But who knows!
Given the placatory noises that PT/Yingluck are making in Prayuth’s direction (including promising to leave him in place), it wouldn’t surprise me if the calculated PT realpolitik also extends to a “nose-holding” entirely pragmatic view of Sonthi – bringing him on board as a kind of “reassurance” asset. He won’t control enough seats to really matter in a PT coalition (consortium) but he’d likely be a handy symbol. They could even give him a Minister for the South/Muslim/minorities kind of portfolio – something overseeing the Nakhon Pattani proposal being started?
If Yingluck’s current reception in the South is anything to go by, both sides might view it as win-win to look even more reconciled and in a more pronounced way before the voting.
Review of Ruth
For KA 7:
1. Again, depending how you frame the statistics — or what period you are looking at — you can make an argument for either the Thais or the Australians as being the third largest foreign force in South Vietnam. One page 1 of my book, I write “At that point [ early 1969], Thailand had the third largest contingent in South Vietnam…”
2. In the book I use the English terms “Queen’s Cobra Regiment” and “Black Panther Division” as part of each unit’s name; however, these terms are not necessarily part of the official Thai names of the units, nor are they always part of the official English translations. The official English translation of the first group, for example, is the Queen’s Cobra Volunteer Unit. But it was so frequently called the Queen’s Cobra Regiment in English that I used that term most often in the book. The initial offer of Thai troops in late 1966 and early 1967 was a force closer to what amounts to a reinforced brigade in the US Army. The doubling of that force part way through 1967 encouraged the use of the term “regiment” in the common English translation albeit not officially in the Thai. And as for the Black Panther Division, part way through the war the RTA asked that the new English translation be “Black Leopard Division” to avoid any confusion with the more famous militant Black Panther Party active in the United States.
3. I don’t argue that it was improper to put it there. But the monument’s location in the RTA camp at Latya in Kanchanaburi is hardly a prominent site for memorial honoring a force that received enormous national attention and praise during the war years. Unlike Bangkok’s Victory Monument — whose form it copies — it is hardly ever viewed by anyone not connected with the RTA. Of the veterans I talked with, many are pleased with its location — they agree that it is in a proper place; this is something I write about in the book. Others feel it could have been put somewhere more visible to the Thai public. These latter veterans wish the subsequent generations were more aware of their service. And I suspect we could argue for a long time about the various shades of meaning implied by “hidden” or “tucked away” to no good conclusion.
4. I look forward to reading your book. I’m glad you are pursuing it. It is a great topic, and one that deserves more attention in Thai historical studies. (Send me your name off list — [email protected] — and I’ll watch out for your book next year.)
Thanks for the comments.
Best regards.
RR
Small is beautiful?
@ SteveCM – thank you for the link. I’ve heard Sonthi say this before but I personally didn’t think PT would hold hands with the very guy who toppled Thaksin. But who knows!
Sonthi gave an interview on Channel 11 (Kui nok sapa) that he needed something to do after he retired and that he was asked by many politicians and people in the south to form a party and help improve the situation down there. There was a trip to Mecca that included Wadah guys (Wan M. Nor Matha as well) some 2 years back, which was a starting point of this party.
Yesterday Wan Nor came to see Yingluck while she was out campaigning in Narathiwat. Clearly he’s trying to maintain good relationships with both.
Chuvit on the streets
I think there is a parallel between the Thai provincial godfathers and the old style southern (USA) sheriffs during the early 20th century. These people ruled their little fiefdoms through a combination of economic and physical intimidation. It was only when the South began a period of remarkable economic growth in the late 1960’s that these fiefdoms were broken up. Hopefully the same thing will happen in Thailand and you can already see the beginnings of it in the voting patterns of the provincial urban areas.
This has always been my problem with the UDD. It just seems like the main backers and local leaders tend to be the minions of these godfathers who in fact have the most to lose if the professed goals of the UDD are ever realized.
Review of Tort, Custom and Karma
An eye-opening work with a relevant message: “If neither state law nor the law of sacred centers is relevant to people who have been injured and are seeking redress, then where do these people go in search of justice?” Our protagonists choose 1) submission to karma and faith in the irrational, invisible justice system, and 2) adoption of straight vengeance through materialist compensation.
This book seems to illustrate the cultural dimension that’s largely missing from most press coverage of the political crisis. Calling the yellows “fascistic” and the reds “ignorant” misses the larger context: the yellows believe in the karmic system of bodhidarma kings and righteous wise leaders, while the reds have gone the opposite way and just want payment for their pains and their turn at the trough.
On this basis, the reds have the stronger argument simply because the yellow way has been tried and proven a failure. But unless their tenure in power prioritizes an overhaul/reconstruction of a working, transparent criminal/civil justice system, the result will probably be no better.
Here’s to hoping.
Chuvit on the streets
Nick Nostitz – 28
The only good that can be said about them is that, regardless their skeletons in the closet, they do in their localities and areas of influence have an important function. They do, and have to, make sure that their activities do also benefit their communities.
You are too forgiving Nick. With the big guys, the short term benefits they bring to a town or region are overshadowed by the damage done. The corruption and control of illegal activities cost far more. That the local police and civil servants also end up under their control means there is no easy way out of this pit. (No, I don’t know the answer either, but I suspect the heads of these families have got to end up in prison to solve the problem.)
Small is beautiful?
The southern border provinces remind me of Judea according to Monty Python.
1. The People’s Front of Pattani wanted regional autonomy but to remain part of Thailand.
2. The Popular Front of Pattani wanted to separate from Thailand and become part of Malaysia.
3. The Popular People’s Front of Pattani wanted territorial separation and total independence.
Then the Popular People’s Front of Pattani split.
4. The People’s Popular Front of Pattani want to restore the Sultan and become an Islamic monarchy along Saudi Arabian lines.
5. The Popular People’s Progressive Front want to to establish a secular Islamic state along Turkish lines.
6. The Popular People’s Islamic Front want to establish a fundamentalist Islamic state along Iranian lines.
And the Monster Raving Loony Insurgent Front just want to keep the insurgency going because of the money to be made.
Given this situation, I would suggest that General Sonthi Bunyaratklin and his Matuphum (Motherland) Party have n0 chance. Nor does anyone else. The Thai Government should admit they made a mistake in 1904, move the border three and a half provinces north, and leave the Pattani Malay Muslims to sort things out for themselves. Maybe form a new country and call in Ragaan.
Review of Ruth
Rick Ruth 6: I have not yet read your book, only the review, but may I state the following:
1. At its peak (1968-1970) the Australian commitment to South Vietnam was an infantry brigade and supporting arms and services totalling around 8,000 men, somewhat less than the infantry division deployed by Thailand. Overall, however, more Australians served in South Vietnam than Thais. The claim that “after America and South Korea, Thailand’s military contribution was the third largest of the Free World nations” may have been true for a three-year period, but not overall.
2. I would prefer to say that the Black Panther Division replaced the Queen’s Cobra Regiment in 1968, rather than referring to them using imprecise terms like contingent or unit.
3. Craig described “the official monument to the country’s involvement in the Vietnam War” as “tucked away from public view”. To me that implies “hidden away”. My Thai Army friends describe it as a memorial to the Black Panther Division, erected (quite properly) at the entrance to the base of its successor, the 9th Infantry Division.
4. The Victory Monument in Bangkok commemorates the War to Recover the Lost Territories of December 1940 – January 1941, when Thailand took advantage of French weakness following the German invasion of May 1940 to invade French Indochina and regain the Cambodian provinces of Siem Reap and Battambang and the Lao provinces of Sayaboury and Champassak, which the French had forced Siam to cede in 1907. This transfer of territory was reversed after the Second World War ended. A distant echo of that border dispute can still be heard at Khao Phra Wihan.
I’ve ordered a copy of your book and I look forward to reading it. I hope that in due course you will read a copy of my history of the War to Recover the Lost Territories, which I hope to publish in 2012.
Vandalism and democracy
SteveCM 30,
This fine might accord with the judiciarys “SSS” (Sakdina Sliding Scale). I posit that it might represent the deppity’s low rating in the view of the judiciary. 1000 baht is not what it was. Though I should add I have little understanding of the mysteries and machinations of the thai judicial system. . .
It also probably depends if you price your eggs by weight instead of quantity, perhaps it was a large egg?
Chuvit on the streets
“SteveCM”:
There are many godfather/mafia style politicians in all parties. The only good that can be said about them is that, regardless their skeletons in the closet, they do in their localities and areas of influence have an important function. They do, and have to, make sure that their activities do also benefit their communities. They often also function as a go-between a threatening state and its security forces (police, etc) and the people. They help solving conflicts. Their communities need them, and they need their communities.
All this cannot be said about Chuvit. In his activities the only community was his wallet, and whoever he paid off.
Review of Ruth
KA: I don’t think Craig’s review carries the errors you are suggesting it does. Rather, I think you are looking at different parameters for your statistics.
1. Over the full span of the Vietnam War, Australia ultimately sent more soldiers to fight there than did the Thais. But in 1968-1969, the peak of Australia’s involvement, there were more Thai troops in South Vietnam than Australian. Writing as I am from Thailand, I don’t have the exact numbers in front of me, but if I recall correctly Australia had about 7,000+ troops there to Thailand’s 11,000 in that period. The Thais were the third largest foreign army after the Americans and South Koreans when they put their division in (along with smaller units from the Royal Thai Navy and Royal Thai Air Force).
2. Yes. “Supplanted” is a better description of what happened than “supported.” The Black Panther contingent replaced the Queen’s Cobra unit midway through 1968 following an agreement between the Washington and Bangkok that was hammered out in late 1967.
3. I did characterize Thailand’s Vietnam War Memorial as being largely hidden from public view because was it built in an RTA camp outside of Kanchanaburi’s city district (not in Bangkok or even Lopburi). Few outside of the Royal Thai Army visit it, even though it is not far from a town that attracts many Thai and foreign tourists throughout the year. But I don’t suggest that it ended up there because Thailand’s leadership thought their involvement in the war was a mistake. I do not make that argument in the book, nor does Craig in his review.
4. I concur. When I first came to Thailand in 1988, I did ask many Thai friends what victory did Victory Monument commemorate. Most of my interlocutors were young Thais working in a refugee camp at Phanat Nikhom. Few of them knew for sure, and I never got precisely the same answer twice.
Thank you for the feedback and comments.
Rick Ruth
A Pheua Thai win? But then what?
WLH “Wouldn’t it be a lot easier to hire some ex-Mossad agents to ‘disappear’ Thaksin? ”
This must be under consideration as highly cost effective solution. Thaksin seems to have developed a number of business disputes while abroad, including with the Emirati lawyer, to act as credible camouflage and there is always the possibly of a love triangle since he reverted to bachelor status. Without him PT would devour itself pretty quickly and Yingluck would soon look like a newly graduated teacher from a white middle class home trying to keep order in a classroom in a bad ass inner city black neighborhood.
Any compromise that gives Yingluck the premiership cannot be acceptable to the powerful forces against Thaksin. Even if she is obliged to agree not amnesty her brother to get the job, She only has to limp through about 9 months and then she can call a snap election for after 31 May 2012 so the TRT old guard can stand in it and hope to give PT an absolute majority
Small is beautiful?
Does Sonthi really have that much bharami in the South? He’s a Muslim, but not Malay. The Far South saw the worst violence in its modern history while he was army commander.
Matubhum’s thabuang policy for the Far South is hardly going to be a massive vote winner. Given the very weak party allegiance among Muslims in the Far South, the party seems more likely to sink or swim on the quality of candidates chosen to stand rather than Sonthi’s leadership.
Also, does anyone know how this party came about? How did Sonthi end up leading a group made up of old Wadah guys and henchmen of Wattana Asavahame? Seems an odd match.
It is interesting that Aripen Uttarasin. the holder of their pre-house dissolution party list seat, has now been bumped down to third on the party list behind Sonthi and Man Patanothai. Would have thought that would not have gone down too well with the Southern group of MPs seen as that is probably where all their party list votes will come from. Ariphen now seems sure to lose his seat. Den Tohmeena, another ageing Wadah big shot, is also well down the party list.
Vandalism and democracy
BTW, worth noting that the egg-thrower (who missed) was fined 1,000 baht – while the Khunying who actually slapped a PT supporter was fined just 500 baht…..
Vandalism and democracy
c27
“My view was that he walked in front of a thrown egg, so it was his fault.”
Ralph – you’ve surpassed yourself. 10/10
Vandalism and democracy
A story on television news today has it that vandalising election posters is likely to earn 4 years in jail and a 60,000 baht fine (I hope my memory on the figures is okay). Maybe the establishment can just have political vandalism subsumed under terrorism and that would do the trick for them.
Suthep was the target of an egg thrown yesterday. The media gave it considerable attention. My view was that he walked in front of a thrown egg, so it was his fault.
Chuvit on the streets
Nick (c20) and Foster (c22) – thanks for providing more background on Chuwit (particularly the link to the reports of what was done in Sukhumvit Square).
Not unnaturally, reading that information revises my opinion of Chuwit as being something akin to a “lovable old rogue” – even if there are many others in the Thai Parliament with similar skeletons in their closets.
Saying so at least enables Vichai_N to now go back to the endless repetition of his other customary mantras.