Wrong, doctor J. Same difference during the Cold War contrary to your assertion:
The only difference is that Thai’s junta didn’t get much pressure from United States and other Westerns because of their enthusiastic participation in the anti-communism campaign in the cold war period.
Wrong because they had been very comfortable with Ne Win precisely on account of his staunch anti-communism until things blew up so dramatically in the Burmese cities in 1988. Remember the Berlin Wall fell the next year, and also Tianamen Square.
It’s the incidental collapse of the Communist Party of Burma in the same year when its ethnic Kokang and Wa troops mutinied and drove the leaders into exile over the border into Yunnan that has made the issue less relevant since. Not without consequences as we’ve seen of late. And the demise of the CPB may well have been greatly exaggerated.
Right wing anti-communist dictatorships have historically been happy bedfellows with the West unless it goes exceptionally sour as is the case with Burma.
Much ado about nothing, but thanks for the interesting scholarly piece that regrettably ends with a rather nasty fly in the ointment.
The Buddha certainly needed to be depicted as distinguishable from the rest of the shaven monks, and thankfully not quite the same as the Laughing Buddha. The popular version became the stump of hair after he had cut the length of it off by the river. It is natural and most likely he had it all shaved off afterwards.
I am however rather bemused by the scurrilous and groundless attack on the Buddha’s modern followers by this parting shot: it is fair to say that many modern followers of the Buddha know very little that came out of his head aside from his hair, and this very dubious hair (along with the worship of “hair relics”, and so on) is now more widely known than any philosophical discourse the Buddha ever recited.
Where has all that evidence-based scholarly approach gone? As if many of us only care about the hair relics, miracles and so forth. As if we’d be splitting hairs (if you’ll pardon the pun) wasting our time over this very dubious hair issue.
Admittedly the problem with all religions, not confined to Buddhism, is a superficial belief and religiosity focusing on cultural rituals rather than its essence. The Four Noble Truths and the Eightfold Path expounded by the Enlightened One however remain firmly rooted in basic Theravadin belief, teaching and practice.
Even though the author’s real agenda seems pretty questionable, and at best provocative, I’m bound to say please don’t be disappointed if a ‘fatwa’ isn’t forthcoming.
Thanks you sir, for such an informative analysis. I couldn’t help but comparing the burmese junta’s steps with the Thai’s. Looks like they’re following the Thai’s footseps some thirty years ago. The only difference is that Thai’s junta didn’t get much pressure from United States and other Westerns because of their enthusiastic participation in the anti-communism campaign in the cold war period.
IMO, the Burmese junta won’t hesitate to punch the ‘reset’ button, once the situation is deemed ‘unfavorable’. This means another coup is not too far from everyone’s expectation, when one takes the lessons from Burma’s neighbor seriously.
To sum it up, I’d say, ‘democracy’ is still too hard a word for the junta to genuinely appreciate.
Thanks, Nich, and also Jim, for we shall overcome , both our nations over the tyrants.
The generals rubbing their hands in glee congratulating themselves for the resounding success (in establishing ‘parliamentary rule’ in a ‘disciplined democracy’, another innovative form of semi-democracy, and in dividing the opposition further, both within the majority Burman and ethnic groups) is only marred by the fact that ASSK is out but still ‘not out’, and very much hogging the lime light.
Talking to foreigners in London, Seattle, not just students but various high profile statesmen, former First Lady etc. is something they don’t mind very much. As Nich has said, sanctions have been limited and symbolic, so they’d rather she led the life of one Madam Chiang Kai-shek and her China Lobby.
It’s when she talks to her people that can really rock the boat even though she’s been very tactful and circumspect so far. If this remains an irreconcilable issue, over the dreaded R word (no pun intended) and above all her unstinting stand for a fair and just society for all her peoples, 2011 promises to be an even more interesting year for Burma than the last one.
A good piece, though as I read through I was not sure if I were reading about neighbouring Thailand: At least in Burma there is a perverted sense of almost honesty about oppression; the generals do not try to hide their fascism; in Thailand it is in the mask and fiction of Parliamentary democracy. But ’tis funny how Thai democracy which is slipping into an irreversible dark hole by the day gets neutralised in academic discourse as though there is some kind of middle ground or reconciliatory terra firma still remaining (“men-in-black”?, or was that red shirts killing their own kin and compatriots on the streets? maybe Santa Claus’es). Another five red shirts targeted for Abhisit’s hit squad in the north. The 2011 New Year lyrical symbolism of the pro-democracy Red Shirt movement in Thailand using Pete Seeger’s lines sums it up:
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
I do believe
We shall overcome, some day.
We’ll walk hand in hand,
We’ll walk hand in hand,
We’ll walk hand in hand, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall live in peace,
We shall live in peace,
We shall live in peace, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall all be free,
We shall all be free,
We shall all be free, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We are not afraid,
We are not afraid,
We are not afraid, TODAY
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
I do believe
We shall overcome, some day.
Here, too, the perception of caste identity plays a role. The king remarks that the Buddha seems to be suitably born for the job, as a member of the warrior caste (vaс╣Зс╣З─Бrohena sampanno j─Бtim─Б viya khattiyo). Given that the Buddha is in his usual attire of robes, and the same passage describes him collecting alms with his begging bowl (and so on), the king seems to be responding directly to the Buddha’s physical appearance with these comments (there is nothing to suggest that he is a descendant of warriors in his regalia, and the king had never seen him before). This first impression would therefore be based on the Buddha’s facial features (or ethnic characteristics).
Your argument in section 5 seems to me to be a non sequitur. Wouldn’t one’s first impression on whether or not someone else would make a good solider be based on that person’s physique (i.e. muscular or not)?
Hi Sarinda, I was making research to a documentary project and found your really interesting article. I am researching about people from Camboja who fled to Laos to escape from the Khmer Rouge. Can you help me to know how i can find this histories? Can we maybe change some mais about the subject? Any kind of information or contact will be pleasent…
Thank a lot for your help
Thank you for this essay, it prompts some interesting questions, but I disagreed with you in a few places.
You write that, “The question of the Buddha’s baldness is an interesting example wherein Buddhist culture has become something quite separate from the religion, and, indeed, the culture has come to exalt a heresy.” This is making an implicit distinction between culture and religion that cannot hold.
Along the same lines, in a few moments of your piece it seemed like you were saying that the historical Buddha himself is a pure (non-heretical) nucleus of the Buddhist religion and that as we move further in time (and space; although this is almost absent in the above) from this center we encounter less religion and more culture.
A stronger and more compelling approach would trace the shifting images of the Buddha through time and space and show how those images were motivated by the historical (i.e., cultural, ecological, biological, economic, sociological, etc.) circumstances from which they emerged. You began to do this in a few places, but I wanted more.
On the whole, however, this was very interesting, I would just be careful to avoid essentializing religion. Thanks for posting.
[…] could be argued to be related to ‘national security,’ the diplomatic cables may contain very significant revelations. While the list of topics covered by the cables is now available, as mentioned by Bangkok Pundit, […]
Bouasone was a close to a critic of government policy as anyone can be in that country, and he made critical comments at party functions (etc.) that were (with all due approval) immortalized in the (government controlled) press.
This is, actually, a bunch of scandals rolled up into one, but you already need to know the 90% that goes unsaid. That’s as much social criticism as you can hope to find in a NA meeting.
I doubt that he was asked to resign for this reason specifically, but he has been a dissenting voice on a range of interesting issues over the years, including deforestation.
In response to the (somewhat jejune) comments above, guess what? It’s more likely that he’s resigning simply because he has the offer of a better paying job (a.k.a. “family issues”).
If he’s been offered an extremely minor position as a UN adjunct to an adjunct, he could still be pulling in many thousands of dollars per month (on that US-dollar payscale) and it is hard for the Communist Party to compete with that.
I believe that no one is “truly objective” we all have our personal orientations… But some points can still be made according to the information available and rationality…
Dave is in KhonKaen, a very “red” area, and he is in contact with the “reality” of Isan (both academic or rural…) He is legitimately influenced by these sources of information and touched by the fate of some Isan people, (inequality and lack of justice.)
Thaksin did take advantage of his position to make some profit, as a Prime Minister he did bind the law for the benefit of his family.
Thailand has a serious problem with the judicial system, the burden of proof, the equality before the law… Anyone can pick few cases to realize how effete the rule of law is. (E.g. The disparitions in South Thailand, two cases of the democrat party failed because of procedural matters (failure of police to follow it), the DSI still delays the report on their investigation, the procedure of nomination of judge after a coup is not completly above suspicions…)
Anyway, the Emergency decret allow the military to detain anyone with no judicial control…
The credibility of the whole institution is questioned for most of Thai citizens, who lost faith in it (if they ever had some…)
So, I can understand why some Thais are relunctant to wait for the State to judge the event of May/April…
Once these points made:
1) Thaksin could not be judged at the ICC for this alledged crimes. The jurisdiction of the ICC is to judge “genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes” according to the articles 6, 7, 8 of the Rome Statute. Corruption is not considered as a “sufficient” offense. However, the extra judicial killing of 2003 could be under the jurisdiction of the ICC. It is a “serious” violation of Human Rights, decided by the Prime Minister, involving the “legitimate coercion” of the state, made after 2002…
2) The problem is that Thailand did sign the Treaty that give legal existence to the ICC but Thailand have not ratified it yet… Therefore, only the security council can have the legitimacy to start a trial. The prosecutor can start an investigation considering the information provided by NGOs or lawyer of victims or a third party… But I am really skeptical about an eventual decision of the security council…
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Farrelly on Burma in Inside Story
Wrong, doctor J. Same difference during the Cold War contrary to your assertion:
The only difference is that Thai’s junta didn’t get much pressure from United States and other Westerns because of their enthusiastic participation in the anti-communism campaign in the cold war period.
Wrong because they had been very comfortable with Ne Win precisely on account of his staunch anti-communism until things blew up so dramatically in the Burmese cities in 1988. Remember the Berlin Wall fell the next year, and also Tianamen Square.
It’s the incidental collapse of the Communist Party of Burma in the same year when its ethnic Kokang and Wa troops mutinied and drove the leaders into exile over the border into Yunnan that has made the issue less relevant since. Not without consequences as we’ve seen of late. And the demise of the CPB may well have been greatly exaggerated.
Right wing anti-communist dictatorships have historically been happy bedfellows with the West unless it goes exceptionally sour as is the case with Burma.
The Buddha was bald
Much ado about nothing, but thanks for the interesting scholarly piece that regrettably ends with a rather nasty fly in the ointment.
The Buddha certainly needed to be depicted as distinguishable from the rest of the shaven monks, and thankfully not quite the same as the Laughing Buddha. The popular version became the stump of hair after he had cut the length of it off by the river. It is natural and most likely he had it all shaved off afterwards.
I am however rather bemused by the scurrilous and groundless attack on the Buddha’s modern followers by this parting shot:
it is fair to say that many modern followers of the Buddha know very little that came out of his head aside from his hair, and this very dubious hair (along with the worship of “hair relics”, and so on) is now more widely known than any philosophical discourse the Buddha ever recited.
Where has all that evidence-based scholarly approach gone? As if many of us only care about the hair relics, miracles and so forth. As if we’d be splitting hairs (if you’ll pardon the pun) wasting our time over this very dubious hair issue.
Admittedly the problem with all religions, not confined to Buddhism, is a superficial belief and religiosity focusing on cultural rituals rather than its essence. The Four Noble Truths and the Eightfold Path expounded by the Enlightened One however remain firmly rooted in basic Theravadin belief, teaching and practice.
Even though the author’s real agenda seems pretty questionable, and at best provocative, I’m bound to say please don’t be disappointed if a ‘fatwa’ isn’t forthcoming.
Farrelly on Burma in Inside Story
Thanks Nich,
What next by these spinners ?
Sanctions NEVER happened according to Nich of New Mandala?
Trivializing the effects of the compounded actions of 3 decades, I believe IS NOT what you intend to say on your description of west sanctions!
Remember G. Santayana first b/f singing Kum_Bah_Ya.
Farrelly on Burma in Inside Story
Thanks you sir, for such an informative analysis. I couldn’t help but comparing the burmese junta’s steps with the Thai’s. Looks like they’re following the Thai’s footseps some thirty years ago. The only difference is that Thai’s junta didn’t get much pressure from United States and other Westerns because of their enthusiastic participation in the anti-communism campaign in the cold war period.
IMO, the Burmese junta won’t hesitate to punch the ‘reset’ button, once the situation is deemed ‘unfavorable’. This means another coup is not too far from everyone’s expectation, when one takes the lessons from Burma’s neighbor seriously.
To sum it up, I’d say, ‘democracy’ is still too hard a word for the junta to genuinely appreciate.
Farrelly on Burma in Inside Story
Thanks, Nich, and also Jim, for we shall overcome , both our nations over the tyrants.
The generals rubbing their hands in glee congratulating themselves for the resounding success (in establishing ‘parliamentary rule’ in a ‘disciplined democracy’, another innovative form of semi-democracy, and in dividing the opposition further, both within the majority Burman and ethnic groups) is only marred by the fact that ASSK is out but still ‘not out’, and very much hogging the lime light.
Talking to foreigners in London, Seattle, not just students but various high profile statesmen, former First Lady etc. is something they don’t mind very much. As Nich has said, sanctions have been limited and symbolic, so they’d rather she led the life of one Madam Chiang Kai-shek and her China Lobby.
It’s when she talks to her people that can really rock the boat even though she’s been very tactful and circumspect so far. If this remains an irreconcilable issue, over the dreaded R word (no pun intended) and above all her unstinting stand for a fair and just society for all her peoples, 2011 promises to be an even more interesting year for Burma than the last one.
Happy New Year Everyone!
Farrelly on Burma in Inside Story
A good piece, though as I read through I was not sure if I were reading about neighbouring Thailand: At least in Burma there is a perverted sense of almost honesty about oppression; the generals do not try to hide their fascism; in Thailand it is in the mask and fiction of Parliamentary democracy. But ’tis funny how Thai democracy which is slipping into an irreversible dark hole by the day gets neutralised in academic discourse as though there is some kind of middle ground or reconciliatory terra firma still remaining (“men-in-black”?, or was that red shirts killing their own kin and compatriots on the streets? maybe Santa Claus’es). Another five red shirts targeted for Abhisit’s hit squad in the north. The 2011 New Year lyrical symbolism of the pro-democracy Red Shirt movement in Thailand using Pete Seeger’s lines sums it up:
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
I do believe
We shall overcome, some day.
We’ll walk hand in hand,
We’ll walk hand in hand,
We’ll walk hand in hand, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall live in peace,
We shall live in peace,
We shall live in peace, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall all be free,
We shall all be free,
We shall all be free, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
We are not afraid,
We are not afraid,
We are not afraid, TODAY
Oh, deep in my heart,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome,
We shall overcome, some day.
Oh, deep in my heart,
I do believe
We shall overcome, some day.
Samak, the Queen and the Bangkok Post
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/15/samak-the-queen-and-the-bangkok-post/ […]
Thai media coverage of Wikileaks
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/17/thai-media-coverage-of-wikileaks/ […]
Wikileaks and Crown Prince Vajiralongkorn
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/16/wikileaks-and-crown-prince-vajiralongkorn/ […]
The Buddha was bald
Here, too, the perception of caste identity plays a role. The king remarks that the Buddha seems to be suitably born for the job, as a member of the warrior caste (vaс╣Зс╣З─Бrohena sampanno j─Бtim─Б viya khattiyo). Given that the Buddha is in his usual attire of robes, and the same passage describes him collecting alms with his begging bowl (and so on), the king seems to be responding directly to the Buddha’s physical appearance with these comments (there is nothing to suggest that he is a descendant of warriors in his regalia, and the king had never seen him before). This first impression would therefore be based on the Buddha’s facial features (or ethnic characteristics).
Your argument in section 5 seems to me to be a non sequitur. Wouldn’t one’s first impression on whether or not someone else would make a good solider be based on that person’s physique (i.e. muscular or not)?
Making states in the Cambodian-Lao borderlands
Hi Sarinda, I was making research to a documentary project and found your really interesting article. I am researching about people from Camboja who fled to Laos to escape from the Khmer Rouge. Can you help me to know how i can find this histories? Can we maybe change some mais about the subject? Any kind of information or contact will be pleasent…
Thank a lot for your help
Thiago
The Buddha was bald
Thank you for this essay, it prompts some interesting questions, but I disagreed with you in a few places.
You write that, “The question of the Buddha’s baldness is an interesting example wherein Buddhist culture has become something quite separate from the religion, and, indeed, the culture has come to exalt a heresy.” This is making an implicit distinction between culture and religion that cannot hold.
Along the same lines, in a few moments of your piece it seemed like you were saying that the historical Buddha himself is a pure (non-heretical) nucleus of the Buddhist religion and that as we move further in time (and space; although this is almost absent in the above) from this center we encounter less religion and more culture.
A stronger and more compelling approach would trace the shifting images of the Buddha through time and space and show how those images were motivated by the historical (i.e., cultural, ecological, biological, economic, sociological, etc.) circumstances from which they emerged. You began to do this in a few places, but I wanted more.
On the whole, however, this was very interesting, I would just be careful to avoid essentializing religion. Thanks for posting.
Thai media coverage of Wikileaks
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/17/thai-media-coverage-of-wikileaks/ […]
Wikileaks and Crown Prince Vajiralongkorn
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/16/wikileaks-and-crown-prince-vajiralongkorn/ […]
Samak, the Queen and the Bangkok Post
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/15/samak-the-queen-and-the-bangkok-post/ […]
From Village Scouts to Cyber Scouts
[…] the program was unveiled a few months ago, Nicholas Farrelly wrote about the impact of the program on the credibility of Thailand’s political […]
Thai institutions: Archives
[…] could be argued to be related to ‘national security,’ the diplomatic cables may contain very significant revelations. While the list of topics covered by the cables is now available, as mentioned by Bangkok Pundit, […]
Leaking evidence of violence and machinations in Thailand
[…] http://www.newmandala.org/2010/12/02/leaking-evidence-of-violence-and-machinations-in… […]
New PM in Laos
P.M. is not a leadership position in Laos.
Bouasone was a close to a critic of government policy as anyone can be in that country, and he made critical comments at party functions (etc.) that were (with all due approval) immortalized in the (government controlled) press.
His most recent, I note, cut close to the issue of where money comes from and where it goes:
http://www.vientianetimes.org.la/FreeContent/Free_PM%20clarifies.htm
This is, actually, a bunch of scandals rolled up into one, but you already need to know the 90% that goes unsaid. That’s as much social criticism as you can hope to find in a NA meeting.
I doubt that he was asked to resign for this reason specifically, but he has been a dissenting voice on a range of interesting issues over the years, including deforestation.
You can get a listing of his recent official statements just through the magic of google, but, again, most of what is worth knowing is implicit in articles of this kind:
http://www.google.com/custom?sa=Search&sitesearch=vientianetimes.org.la&cx=003031834068682903670%3AVientiane+Times&domains=vientianetimes.org.la&cof=FORID%3A5&ie=UTF-8&q=bouasone
In response to the (somewhat jejune) comments above, guess what? It’s more likely that he’s resigning simply because he has the offer of a better paying job (a.k.a. “family issues”).
If he’s been offered an extremely minor position as a UN adjunct to an adjunct, he could still be pulling in many thousands of dollars per month (on that US-dollar payscale) and it is hard for the Communist Party to compete with that.
Why is a case with the ICC so frightening?
I believe that no one is “truly objective” we all have our personal orientations… But some points can still be made according to the information available and rationality…
Dave is in KhonKaen, a very “red” area, and he is in contact with the “reality” of Isan (both academic or rural…) He is legitimately influenced by these sources of information and touched by the fate of some Isan people, (inequality and lack of justice.)
Thaksin did take advantage of his position to make some profit, as a Prime Minister he did bind the law for the benefit of his family.
Thailand has a serious problem with the judicial system, the burden of proof, the equality before the law… Anyone can pick few cases to realize how effete the rule of law is. (E.g. The disparitions in South Thailand, two cases of the democrat party failed because of procedural matters (failure of police to follow it), the DSI still delays the report on their investigation, the procedure of nomination of judge after a coup is not completly above suspicions…)
Anyway, the Emergency decret allow the military to detain anyone with no judicial control…
The credibility of the whole institution is questioned for most of Thai citizens, who lost faith in it (if they ever had some…)
So, I can understand why some Thais are relunctant to wait for the State to judge the event of May/April…
Once these points made:
1) Thaksin could not be judged at the ICC for this alledged crimes. The jurisdiction of the ICC is to judge “genocide, crimes against humanity and war crimes” according to the articles 6, 7, 8 of the Rome Statute. Corruption is not considered as a “sufficient” offense. However, the extra judicial killing of 2003 could be under the jurisdiction of the ICC. It is a “serious” violation of Human Rights, decided by the Prime Minister, involving the “legitimate coercion” of the state, made after 2002…
2) The problem is that Thailand did sign the Treaty that give legal existence to the ICC but Thailand have not ratified it yet… Therefore, only the security council can have the legitimacy to start a trial. The prosecutor can start an investigation considering the information provided by NGOs or lawyer of victims or a third party… But I am really skeptical about an eventual decision of the security council…
http://treaties.un.org/Pages/ViewDetails.aspx?src=TREATY&mtdsg_no=XVIII-10&chapter=18&lang=en