This reminds me of a byline that ran with a story in the Bangkok Post’s Business section a few years ago: Subsidy Nosedive. I remember doing a double-take, reading it again, and realising that either someone was taking the mickey intentionally, or someone hadn’t meant for the joke to go all the way to print — and therefore was in BIG trouble that morning!
Here is significant information that I have seen reported by only one source, CNN, quoting Steve Finch and Philip Bader of the Phnom Penh Post, and not mentioned by any other reports I’ve seen:
The municipal police chief said that the stampede, which began around 10 p.m., likely occurred because a suspension bridge packed with people began to sway, creating panic, said Bader, who cited reports of people jumping from the bridge into the river below.
Finch said police began firing water cannon onto a bridge to an island in the center of a river in an effort to get them to continue moving across the bridge.
“That just caused complete and utter panic,” he told CNN in a telephone interview.
CNN also reported:
[The police chief] said a number of people lost consciousness and fell into the water; some may have been electrocuted, he said. Finch cited witnesses as saying that the bridge was festooned with electric lights, which may have played a role in the electrocutions.
The government denied anyone was electrocuted.
But a doctor who declined to be identified publicly said the main cause of death was suffocation and electrocution. Police were among the dead, Finch said.
There was a report in yesterday’s (23/11/10) Sydney Morning Herald, from London’s Telegraph by Ian MacKinnon that the AIDS patients and staff ASSK visited are being ejected from their shelter only hours after her visit, as punishment for their “rapturous welcome”.
The same report says her youngest son, Kim Aris, has been granted a visa to visit his mother.
Do these apparently contradictory moves reflect a split within the Tatmadaw – or some sort of very cynical maneouvre ?
Thank you Chris for calling attention to the concept ‘Pathet Lao’. I think the origin of this concept can be traced back to the 1940s and the emergence of Lao nationalism among a small political elite in Vientiane. S├╕ren Ivarsson in his book “Creating Laos” (pp. 152, 167-9) mentions a journal entitled Pathet Lao that was published in 1941 and discussed questions of Lao identity. Ivarsson (pp. 174-7) also writes about the different connotations of ‘pathet’, ‘sat’ and ‘pathet-sat’ (as ‘nation-state’).
Another useful reading is the article “Prince Phetsarath (1890–1959): Nationalism and Royalty in the Making of Modern Laos” by S├╕ren Ivarsson and Christopher E. Goscha (in Journal of Southeast Asian Studies, Vol. 38, No. 1, 2007, pp. 55–81). Here the authors state that in 1945 Prince Phetsarath – who still in 1940 had favoured a Thai-Lao confederation – pushed the idea of a ‘Greater’ Laos including Isan and parts of Northern Thailand. The authors quote from a report written by the Prince himself: “This country which has been amputated of two-thirds of its territory – the richest and most populous – is not viable and cannot exist as a state”.
ASSK is no saint, and heaven forbid, nor martyr. Without a doubt she’s still the peoples’ leader by consensus among the diverse populace of Burma.
You owe an apology to The Irrawaddy since they have given you, Myanmar Patriots and all the rest of your ilk a platform to air your ‘learned opinions’.
The military must return to their barracks where they belong. Stop turning up like a bad smell all the time. Stop calling themselves this, that and the other council. Stop growing and destroying like a cancer.
As for the apologist cap, wear it if it fits. And a gold medal from Naypyidaw to go with it. You’ve earned it and keep up with the good work.
By quoting Daw Aung San Suu Kyi discrediting SPDC as the power that be that has ended her incarceration: “I don’t think there were any other reasons,” she said …. My detention had come to an end, and there were no immediate means of extending it.”
You have inadvertently implied:
1) SPDC conceding to the “rule of law”.
Which by the way, is absolute DRIVEL PREPOSTEROUS outright dangerous!
2) Furthermore her own “no immediate means of extending it” statement fly in the face of SPDC well proven capability in Knavery.
No points off.
Please do not forget SPDC has proven ‘Beyond A Reasonable Doubt” to only allow situation that will benefit them.
First of let me mention the good things:
1) Trevor Wilson.
2) Trevor Wilson.
3) Trevor WIlson.
4) An open ended querying,
5) Not giving weigh to any other sources with sponsors such as DVB or any commercial Western media.
Now that the independent nature of New Mandala is ascertained.
A wishful suggestion:
The true pathos of any common citizenry, with an added query of ‘Why’. Let them answer in Burmese, Karen , Akha or any know dozens of dialects within Myanmar.
We appreciate the feedback. We are very open to suggestions about formats. What do you all think will work best for potential viewers in Burma itself? Or is the podcast the only way to go given the country’s notoriously patchy ‘net?
@A. Wales: Good point about how the ideal Islamic state would be.
Malaysia is far from it and that is the argument made by PAS.
I had earlier noted that most Muslim majority nations are failed states. I do not suggest any causality but merely an observation (read here).
It could also be argued the same for many African countries or Latin American countries for different periods of time. (Read here on Political Islam). At the heart of the issue is the failure of Governance and/or Rule of Law.
The US and Australia, of course are putting their strategic interests ahead of what is best for Malaysia. (Read here and here)
I just hope Australians don’t live to regret decisions like these.
As usual:
1) Your assumptions are not only incorrect but misleading.
“The Myanmar citizenry want the West to support ASSK because they want her to succeed in leading the country out of limbo.”
This statement is bordering on fraud in the same vein as Turnell & Vicary.
CW and here in New Mandala clearly prove the desperation “just to survive” sentiment of everyday citizenry and yet you made the above statement, with a literal straight/poker face.
2) Paint anyone into an apologist, defective, or any undignified creatures of some sort if you deem fit without any notion or dignifying who or what they really stand for:
“You reckon they can just ignore whatever the regime gets up to and help.”
The very essence of New Mandala unlike The Irrawady is set up for “Exchange of ideas”. Not extinguish differences.
Knowing the camp “hate SPDC” that you are A life time member of, Please, and pretty please do us a favor,
DO NOT DRAG THE CITIZENRY TO ENDURE ANOTHER 2 DECADES of what they just went through 2╦Ъ to the failed premises!
Based on 1) Support DAw AUng San Suu Kyi, find her faultless at any cause.
2) SPDC must never be allowed to exist in any form at any cause.
Perhaps the rest of the world has finally awoken to the gap between what the Democrat Party under PM Abhisit says and what actually occurs on the ground in Thailand.
The Democrat Party is a membre if the Liberal International.
According to the website of the LI:
“Liberal International is the world federation of liberal political parties. Founded in 1947 it has become the pre-eminent network for promoting liberalism, strengthening liberal parties and for the promotion of liberal democracy around the world. There are a number of common principles which unite all liberal parties from Africa, the Americas, Asia, and Europe; human rights, free and fair elections and multiparty-democracy, social justice, tolerance, social market economy, free trade, environmental sustainability and a strong sense of international solidarity. Naturally in the application of these principles in different national circumstances there is diversity among liberal parties. All members adhere to the organisations Manifesto’s.”
Clearly the Polices indicated above no longer seem to be core values of the Democrat Party of Thailand nor of its current leader .
You cannot have a democracy where only 20% of the citizens get full rights to express themselves, vote, campaign freely, write editorials, publish newspapers, websites, op-eds while at the same time denying the leaders, writers, intellectuals,and supporters of the majority party the same rights to express, publish, air, discuss, debate, and campaign. While to throwing some of them in jail for meeting in small groups, selling novelty flip flops, or tying red ribbons in symbolic protests at sites where their members were gunned down in cold blood.
It is time for the Liberal International to throw out the Democart Party of Thailand.
My mistake for assuming she was from Isan, but her story still speaks of the vast majority of the silenced who live day to day struggling to put food on the table.
Anyone else here at NM who comes across any other such narratives I’d love to read them.
And Junya, if you are reading this you need to know that your little light matters…
The Myanmar citizenry want the West to support ASSK because they want her to succeed in leading the country out of limbo. They wanted the regime out so badly it got ‘elected’.
You want the West to drop ASSK and assist the regime ‘for’ the Myanmar citizenry. You reckon they can just ignore whatever the regime gets up to and help.
How does that square with the Myanmar citizenry? You reckon it’s too important to leave it to them, or do you fashionably pick a focus group?
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Prelude to the bridge tragedy
[…] New Mandala reader predicted days before the tragedy that a stampede would probably occur in the […]
Prelude to the bridge tragedy
[…] lezer van New Mandala voorspelde enkele dagen voor de ramp dat er waarschijnlijk een stormloop op de brug zou plaatsvinden: Toen ik […]
People’s Alliance against Democracy
Nice! “Subversive” is correct.
This reminds me of a byline that ran with a story in the Bangkok Post’s Business section a few years ago: Subsidy Nosedive. I remember doing a double-take, reading it again, and realising that either someone was taking the mickey intentionally, or someone hadn’t meant for the joke to go all the way to print — and therefore was in BIG trouble that morning!
Prelude to the bridge tragedy
Here is significant information that I have seen reported by only one source, CNN, quoting Steve Finch and Philip Bader of the Phnom Penh Post, and not mentioned by any other reports I’ve seen:
CNN also reported:
Prelude to the bridge tragedy
[…] New Mandala reader predicted days before the tragedy that a stampede would probably occur in the bridge As I crossed the bridge, […]
Burma votes 2010 – Episode 3
There was a report in yesterday’s (23/11/10) Sydney Morning Herald, from London’s Telegraph by Ian MacKinnon that the AIDS patients and staff ASSK visited are being ejected from their shelter only hours after her visit, as punishment for their “rapturous welcome”.
The same report says her youngest son, Kim Aris, has been granted a visa to visit his mother.
Do these apparently contradictory moves reflect a split within the Tatmadaw – or some sort of very cynical maneouvre ?
People’s Alliance against Democracy
Among the Post staff members, whose Freudian Slip was it ?
Inflation and iconography: the new 100,000 Kip banknote in Laos
Thank you Chris for calling attention to the concept ‘Pathet Lao’. I think the origin of this concept can be traced back to the 1940s and the emergence of Lao nationalism among a small political elite in Vientiane. S├╕ren Ivarsson in his book “Creating Laos” (pp. 152, 167-9) mentions a journal entitled Pathet Lao that was published in 1941 and discussed questions of Lao identity. Ivarsson (pp. 174-7) also writes about the different connotations of ‘pathet’, ‘sat’ and ‘pathet-sat’ (as ‘nation-state’).
Another useful reading is the article “Prince Phetsarath (1890–1959): Nationalism and Royalty in the Making of Modern Laos” by S├╕ren Ivarsson and Christopher E. Goscha (in Journal of Southeast Asian Studies, Vol. 38, No. 1, 2007, pp. 55–81). Here the authors state that in 1945 Prince Phetsarath – who still in 1940 had favoured a Thai-Lao confederation – pushed the idea of a ‘Greater’ Laos including Isan and parts of Northern Thailand. The authors quote from a report written by the Prince himself: “This country which has been amputated of two-thirds of its territory – the richest and most populous – is not viable and cannot exist as a state”.
Burma commentary, with more to come
plan B,
ASSK is no saint, and heaven forbid, nor martyr. Without a doubt she’s still the peoples’ leader by consensus among the diverse populace of Burma.
You owe an apology to The Irrawaddy since they have given you, Myanmar Patriots and all the rest of your ilk a platform to air your ‘learned opinions’.
The military must return to their barracks where they belong. Stop turning up like a bad smell all the time. Stop calling themselves this, that and the other council. Stop growing and destroying like a cancer.
As for the apologist cap, wear it if it fits. And a gold medal from Naypyidaw to go with it. You’ve earned it and keep up with the good work.
People’s Alliance against Democracy
Shows that the subversive spirit at Bangkok Post still has some life left.
Ramos-Horta on Burma sanctions
BKK lawyer
Good try on having it both ways.
By quoting Daw Aung San Suu Kyi discrediting SPDC as the power that be that has ended her incarceration: “I don’t think there were any other reasons,” she said …. My detention had come to an end, and there were no immediate means of extending it.”
You have inadvertently implied:
1) SPDC conceding to the “rule of law”.
Which by the way, is absolute DRIVEL PREPOSTEROUS outright dangerous!
2) Furthermore her own “no immediate means of extending it” statement fly in the face of SPDC well proven capability in Knavery.
No points off.
Please do not forget SPDC has proven ‘Beyond A Reasonable Doubt” to only allow situation that will benefit them.
Burma votes 2010 – Episode 3
Nic
First of let me mention the good things:
1) Trevor Wilson.
2) Trevor Wilson.
3) Trevor WIlson.
4) An open ended querying,
5) Not giving weigh to any other sources with sponsors such as DVB or any commercial Western media.
Now that the independent nature of New Mandala is ascertained.
A wishful suggestion:
The true pathos of any common citizenry, with an added query of ‘Why’. Let them answer in Burmese, Karen , Akha or any know dozens of dialects within Myanmar.
Burma votes 2010 – Episode 3
Thanks everyone,
We appreciate the feedback. We are very open to suggestions about formats. What do you all think will work best for potential viewers in Burma itself? Or is the podcast the only way to go given the country’s notoriously patchy ‘net?
Happy to hear your thoughts.
Best wishes to all,
Nich
Anwar Ibrahim at Univerity of Sydney & ANU
@A. Wales: Good point about how the ideal Islamic state would be.
Malaysia is far from it and that is the argument made by PAS.
I had earlier noted that most Muslim majority nations are failed states. I do not suggest any causality but merely an observation (read here).
It could also be argued the same for many African countries or Latin American countries for different periods of time. (Read here on Political Islam). At the heart of the issue is the failure of Governance and/or Rule of Law.
The US and Australia, of course are putting their strategic interests ahead of what is best for Malaysia. (Read here and here)
I just hope Australians don’t live to regret decisions like these.
How hardline have the redshirts become?
Your little light matters too, Maratjp… really, it does!
Burma commentary, with more to come
Ko Moe Aung
As usual:
1) Your assumptions are not only incorrect but misleading.
“The Myanmar citizenry want the West to support ASSK because they want her to succeed in leading the country out of limbo.”
This statement is bordering on fraud in the same vein as Turnell & Vicary.
CW and here in New Mandala clearly prove the desperation “just to survive” sentiment of everyday citizenry and yet you made the above statement, with a literal straight/poker face.
2) Paint anyone into an apologist, defective, or any undignified creatures of some sort if you deem fit without any notion or dignifying who or what they really stand for:
“You reckon they can just ignore whatever the regime gets up to and help.”
The very essence of New Mandala unlike The Irrawady is set up for “Exchange of ideas”. Not extinguish differences.
Knowing the camp “hate SPDC” that you are A life time member of, Please, and pretty please do us a favor,
DO NOT DRAG THE CITIZENRY TO ENDURE ANOTHER 2 DECADES of what they just went through 2╦Ъ to the failed premises!
Based on 1) Support DAw AUng San Suu Kyi, find her faultless at any cause.
2) SPDC must never be allowed to exist in any form at any cause.
Robert Amsterdam’s preliminary submission to the International Criminal Court
Perhaps the rest of the world has finally awoken to the gap between what the Democrat Party under PM Abhisit says and what actually occurs on the ground in Thailand.
The Democrat Party is a membre if the Liberal International.
According to the website of the LI:
“Liberal International is the world federation of liberal political parties. Founded in 1947 it has become the pre-eminent network for promoting liberalism, strengthening liberal parties and for the promotion of liberal democracy around the world. There are a number of common principles which unite all liberal parties from Africa, the Americas, Asia, and Europe; human rights, free and fair elections and multiparty-democracy, social justice, tolerance, social market economy, free trade, environmental sustainability and a strong sense of international solidarity. Naturally in the application of these principles in different national circumstances there is diversity among liberal parties. All members adhere to the organisations Manifesto’s.”
Clearly the Polices indicated above no longer seem to be core values of the Democrat Party of Thailand nor of its current leader .
You cannot have a democracy where only 20% of the citizens get full rights to express themselves, vote, campaign freely, write editorials, publish newspapers, websites, op-eds while at the same time denying the leaders, writers, intellectuals,and supporters of the majority party the same rights to express, publish, air, discuss, debate, and campaign. While to throwing some of them in jail for meeting in small groups, selling novelty flip flops, or tying red ribbons in symbolic protests at sites where their members were gunned down in cold blood.
It is time for the Liberal International to throw out the Democart Party of Thailand.
How hardline have the redshirts become?
John Francis Lee,
My mistake for assuming she was from Isan, but her story still speaks of the vast majority of the silenced who live day to day struggling to put food on the table.
Anyone else here at NM who comes across any other such narratives I’d love to read them.
And Junya, if you are reading this you need to know that your little light matters…
Burma commentary, with more to come
plan B,
The Myanmar citizenry want the West to support ASSK because they want her to succeed in leading the country out of limbo. They wanted the regime out so badly it got ‘elected’.
You want the West to drop ASSK and assist the regime ‘for’ the Myanmar citizenry. You reckon they can just ignore whatever the regime gets up to and help.
How does that square with the Myanmar citizenry? You reckon it’s too important to leave it to them, or do you fashionably pick a focus group?
How hardline have the redshirts become?
#33
In the latest issue of Mahaprachachon (a key UDD paper, also on sale at the protest), an article about Jit Phumisak was given page 3.