I think all the comments about Laos being a secret aide to Thaksin are overblown. Yes, there are sympathies for the red shirts but I have never seen any public statement which might suggest that the GoL is inclined towards the red shirts. I think Grant’s comments about the political culture have been true for a long time rather than a recent development. Lao have always regarded Thailand as a state run by unfair systems and riddled with contradictions – but that seems to the essence of SE Asian politics. Talk of secession in Isan is quite fanciful. The bureaucracy in Isan is loyal to BKK, having been brainwashed at a young age through institutions such as the teachers’ colleges, so there is no way power can be easily shifted from their control. The Lao just hope that migrant labour and border trade will continue as usual. The fleets of VIGOs from Vientiane would be most annoyed if visits to Udorn Thani and Nong Khai were disrupted.
It all goes to show that Thailand is in reality still a feudal state in spite of the facade of democracy, and Thai people of all walks of life are feudalistic at heart. Their political expressions, for example, are feudalistic, as we witness what happens in the Parliament, which by the way should be dissolved for lack of attendance, and not because the Red Shirts demand it. Our representatives have not quite grown up, for they have not outgrown their childish behavior. Such a mentality is fit for a feudal, not democratic, environment.
Patiwat – for me, the “due process” on this case is so weak, there is no rule of laws involve in here, no matter, they havn’t showed the “evidence” that referred to any corruption, its all about do did this he benefit, therefore, he must be corrupted and referred to some shady laws written by the military government, without even a single solid evidence and I still think the 101 cows logic still stand in this case.
Frank Lee- you havnt heard about it????? last month the yellow leader were ask to report to authority for assaulting the government house, and you know what they did?, then send their lawyer, who said, “They cannot come because they have some other business to attend somewhere else” I’m not kidding. What did the court do? postponed the hearing to 30th April, seriously, you know why they havnt fled?? because they know the court aint gona do jack to them.
I dont know why but people keep saying that the yellow closing down air-port were the cause of the last government demise, NO it is not!!, it was the court dissolution of PPP that causes the shift in power! got the point straight.
The King “poisoned” and “who cares” ! Thais do: that’s for sure and that is what counts not the “theory” of David Brown!!!!!!!!!
George Jetson: there might not be anywhere near the numbers the UDD claimed on the streets – well not yet anyway – but Mr/Dr/Prof Jetson sounds as though he was employed by the Ministry of Interior….what methodology did he utilize to count the numbers?????
[…] the author of our weekend post on “A red show of strength“, has provided this gallery of images. #gallery-1 { margin: auto; } #gallery-1 .gallery-item […]
Thanks for sharing these pics…Good one…nice enough to put back the nostalgic frames for those who have been a part of this wonderful place…wonderful even without those ‘mobile network’ signals( things have changed pretty much though now).
All you ever needed to know about Peua Thai is contained in the fact that Samak Sundaravej led them in government. If you can’t see the complete mismatch between that fascist and the communists he was only interested in murdering decades ago you are one sick puppy. It is we that have been waiting patiently, for Thai politics to improve itself. It seems that the disparate store-bought politicians in Peua Thai saw nothing wrong with a person who years ago encouraged criminal scum to murder people who wanted to improve this country. This is not reform. It’s just yet another flat-out greedy powergrab. Peua Thai has no moral integrity. It’s a party made up of people who sold out on their former principles because they (wrongly) believed that their fellow Thais weren’t paying them enough money and respect. They think the rest of us mere mortals owe them a rich life. we own them precisely zilch! It is just another lousy party of parasite flip-flops. Where the money is there to be corrupted, they are! And if you say they are just like the Democrats, I would agree. Dare to want much much more than a few weasel words and a few measly baht of charitable blackmail from yet another dead-end politician.
Marc – As you seem to have hardly talked to anyone who wasn’t a Red Shirt or supporter, your article could hardly be described as fair or balanced, so why bother?
In my neighbourhood (next to the 11th Army Barracks on Phaholyothin Road) which was full of well-behaved Red Shirts looking for lunch today, moderates (both Red Shirt sympathizers and their opposite numbers) all agreed with a proposal that Abhisit should compromise and hold elections before the end of this year.
But the poker game – she ain’t over just yet and it’s the extremists from the Red’s and their usual crass agit./prop. in the spotlight tonight.
Submarine: I forgot to add that I do agree with you that time (and history) is on the side of the red movement – and maybe even on Thaksin side too, if only he would learn some humilty and accept he too made mistakes (intentionally and unintentionally).
“Patience is sweet”
Its a great pity Thailand’s 27th Prime Minister did not have more integrity and decide to heed your advice!
btw, you should be asking the ‘Democrat’ led government whether they are capable of implmenting the reforms you suggested – judging by its performance so far (and in numerous previous governments), I would say the answer must be a resounding NO.
(unlike the government that was deposed by judicial/military/judicial coups in 2006, which despite its faults, did more genuine reforming in its few years than the ‘Democrats’ have ever done)
I took advantage of a three-day weekend declared by my employers to escape to the Noosa of Thailand, Hua Hin. One of my great Thai friends, from a subsistance rice-farming Isaan family (Nong Khai-Udon Thani area) accompanied me. We were pleasantly surprised to see the vast number of shop-keepers, not only convenience stores, but also big posh shops, glued to the Red channel in that town, the preferred residence of HMK. Of course they’re all pro-HMK (as is my friend, along with everyone in his family’s area), but they are Red. It seems the Yellows in H Hin are mainly people like bank & public sector staff, as well as retirees.
Important question – and I could write quite alot about it – but as mentioned, time is short, and this is not my major project. I guess if a short answer/crystallization can represent a mass of comments, they [red shirt supporters] simply want a system where an elected government is respected and rises or falls according to the ballot. Not surprisingly, as part of a social movement which is embroiled in contesting an existing power structure, their main focus is gaining proximate goals.
Further to my banging on about institutionalised corruption, here are two very recent ‘stories’ from the BP – yes, not my favourite newspaper, but where else do I get my (public) sources from?
Here’s another – this time, from a friend who told my wife that she has just bunged 100K Baht to a renowned ‘satit’ school to get her 5 year old son into there next year.
Apoplectic.
Corruption, cut it out like the cancer it is. Now.
Red shirt, yellow shirt – whatever colour you prefer – I don’t care – just do something about what is really killing this country.
This whole conflict – at least its’ current phase – may well be over and finished, if Parliamentary Speaker Chai Chidchob is able to
gather a quorum tomorrow (Tuesday, Thai time).
Submarine, you have said in just one post, what others like me, have been trying to say for quite some time, over many posts, on various blogs.
Thank you.
It’s very obvious by now what the Red Shirt strategy is – ie. close-down Bangkok :
see Thanong, Sunday 14th @
Permalink : http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/thanong
Chris, thanks for your comments.
I am well aware of your crusade to form a new Lao “nation”.
However, I was really hoping to hear from Marc, regarding the points I highlighted from his interesting report.
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Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
Title: Laos just an observer
I think all the comments about Laos being a secret aide to Thaksin are overblown. Yes, there are sympathies for the red shirts but I have never seen any public statement which might suggest that the GoL is inclined towards the red shirts. I think Grant’s comments about the political culture have been true for a long time rather than a recent development. Lao have always regarded Thailand as a state run by unfair systems and riddled with contradictions – but that seems to the essence of SE Asian politics. Talk of secession in Isan is quite fanciful. The bureaucracy in Isan is loyal to BKK, having been brainwashed at a young age through institutions such as the teachers’ colleges, so there is no way power can be easily shifted from their control. The Lao just hope that migrant labour and border trade will continue as usual. The fleets of VIGOs from Vientiane would be most annoyed if visits to Udorn Thani and Nong Khai were disrupted.
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
It all goes to show that Thailand is in reality still a feudal state in spite of the facade of democracy, and Thai people of all walks of life are feudalistic at heart. Their political expressions, for example, are feudalistic, as we witness what happens in the Parliament, which by the way should be dissolved for lack of attendance, and not because the Red Shirts demand it. Our representatives have not quite grown up, for they have not outgrown their childish behavior. Such a mentality is fit for a feudal, not democratic, environment.
Making sense of the verdict
Patiwat – for me, the “due process” on this case is so weak, there is no rule of laws involve in here, no matter, they havn’t showed the “evidence” that referred to any corruption, its all about do did this he benefit, therefore, he must be corrupted and referred to some shady laws written by the military government, without even a single solid evidence and I still think the 101 cows logic still stand in this case.
Thai style democracy?
Frank Lee- you havnt heard about it????? last month the yellow leader were ask to report to authority for assaulting the government house, and you know what they did?, then send their lawyer, who said, “They cannot come because they have some other business to attend somewhere else” I’m not kidding. What did the court do? postponed the hearing to 30th April, seriously, you know why they havnt fled?? because they know the court aint gona do jack to them.
A red show of strength, but then what?
I dont know why but people keep saying that the yellow closing down air-port were the cause of the last government demise, NO it is not!!, it was the court dissolution of PPP that causes the shift in power! got the point straight.
A red show of strength, but then what?
A few comment:
The King “poisoned” and “who cares” ! Thais do: that’s for sure and that is what counts not the “theory” of David Brown!!!!!!!!!
George Jetson: there might not be anywhere near the numbers the UDD claimed on the streets – well not yet anyway – but Mr/Dr/Prof Jetson sounds as though he was employed by the Ministry of Interior….what methodology did he utilize to count the numbers?????
Back to reality!!!!!!!!
A red show of strength, but then what?
[…] the author of our weekend post on “A red show of strength“, has provided this gallery of images. #gallery-1 { margin: auto; } #gallery-1 .gallery-item […]
Crossing a river in Arunachal Pradesh
Hi Nicholas,
Thanks for sharing these pics…Good one…nice enough to put back the nostalgic frames for those who have been a part of this wonderful place…wonderful even without those ‘mobile network’ signals( things have changed pretty much though now).
Please excuse me for having used your excerpts in one of my blog writtings…http://arunachalblog.blogspot.com/2008/07/inner-line-permit-does-arunachal-needs.html ( that was quite a long ago though).
Please do visit again…Inner Line Permit Snarls can be better than those traffic snarls …and you might want to relook at this fact again.
Regards
Rome
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
[…] 15 р╕бр╕╡.р╕Д. 2010 New Mandala […]
A red show of strength, but then what?
All you ever needed to know about Peua Thai is contained in the fact that Samak Sundaravej led them in government. If you can’t see the complete mismatch between that fascist and the communists he was only interested in murdering decades ago you are one sick puppy. It is we that have been waiting patiently, for Thai politics to improve itself. It seems that the disparate store-bought politicians in Peua Thai saw nothing wrong with a person who years ago encouraged criminal scum to murder people who wanted to improve this country. This is not reform. It’s just yet another flat-out greedy powergrab. Peua Thai has no moral integrity. It’s a party made up of people who sold out on their former principles because they (wrongly) believed that their fellow Thais weren’t paying them enough money and respect. They think the rest of us mere mortals owe them a rich life. we own them precisely zilch! It is just another lousy party of parasite flip-flops. Where the money is there to be corrupted, they are! And if you say they are just like the Democrats, I would agree. Dare to want much much more than a few weasel words and a few measly baht of charitable blackmail from yet another dead-end politician.
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
Marc – As you seem to have hardly talked to anyone who wasn’t a Red Shirt or supporter, your article could hardly be described as fair or balanced, so why bother?
In my neighbourhood (next to the 11th Army Barracks on Phaholyothin Road) which was full of well-behaved Red Shirts looking for lunch today, moderates (both Red Shirt sympathizers and their opposite numbers) all agreed with a proposal that Abhisit should compromise and hold elections before the end of this year.
But the poker game – she ain’t over just yet and it’s the extremists from the Red’s and their usual crass agit./prop. in the spotlight tonight.
BTW: Where the hell in Cambodia is Montenegro?
A red show of strength, but then what?
Submarine: I forgot to add that I do agree with you that time (and history) is on the side of the red movement – and maybe even on Thaksin side too, if only he would learn some humilty and accept he too made mistakes (intentionally and unintentionally).
A red show of strength, but then what?
“Patience is sweet”
Its a great pity Thailand’s 27th Prime Minister did not have more integrity and decide to heed your advice!
btw, you should be asking the ‘Democrat’ led government whether they are capable of implmenting the reforms you suggested – judging by its performance so far (and in numerous previous governments), I would say the answer must be a resounding NO.
(unlike the government that was deposed by judicial/military/judicial coups in 2006, which despite its faults, did more genuine reforming in its few years than the ‘Democrats’ have ever done)
Open thread on red protests
I took advantage of a three-day weekend declared by my employers to escape to the Noosa of Thailand, Hua Hin. One of my great Thai friends, from a subsistance rice-farming Isaan family (Nong Khai-Udon Thani area) accompanied me. We were pleasantly surprised to see the vast number of shop-keepers, not only convenience stores, but also big posh shops, glued to the Red channel in that town, the preferred residence of HMK. Of course they’re all pro-HMK (as is my friend, along with everyone in his family’s area), but they are Red. It seems the Yellows in H Hin are mainly people like bank & public sector staff, as well as retirees.
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
RESPONSE TO GEGEE
Important question – and I could write quite alot about it – but as mentioned, time is short, and this is not my major project. I guess if a short answer/crystallization can represent a mass of comments, they [red shirt supporters] simply want a system where an elected government is respected and rises or falls according to the ballot. Not surprisingly, as part of a social movement which is embroiled in contesting an existing power structure, their main focus is gaining proximate goals.
Open thread on red protests
Further to my banging on about institutionalised corruption, here are two very recent ‘stories’ from the BP – yes, not my favourite newspaper, but where else do I get my (public) sources from?
http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion/34462/deadly-graft-in-police-force
Unbelievable.
http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/34451/sso-book-a-waste-of-money
I am frothing at the mouth on this one.
Here’s another – this time, from a friend who told my wife that she has just bunged 100K Baht to a renowned ‘satit’ school to get her 5 year old son into there next year.
Apoplectic.
Corruption, cut it out like the cancer it is. Now.
Red shirt, yellow shirt – whatever colour you prefer – I don’t care – just do something about what is really killing this country.
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
This whole conflict – at least its’ current phase – may well be over and finished, if Parliamentary Speaker Chai Chidchob is able to
gather a quorum tomorrow (Tuesday, Thai time).
A red show of strength, but then what?
Submarine, you have said in just one post, what others like me, have been trying to say for quite some time, over many posts, on various blogs.
Thank you.
A red show of strength, but then what?
It’s very obvious by now what the Red Shirt strategy is – ie. close-down Bangkok :
see Thanong, Sunday 14th @
Permalink : http://blog.nationmultimedia.com/thanong
Red soi, Red city: A brief commentary from the streets
Chris, thanks for your comments.
I am well aware of your crusade to form a new Lao “nation”.
However, I was really hoping to hear from Marc, regarding the points I highlighted from his interesting report.