Don’t worry, Andrew, I’m sure it’s not only Reg & dukdeek who get the point of your posts.
Since the inception of this site, I think its been pretty clear where you are coming from, and which ‘side’ you are on when it comes to Thailand political matters.
Just want to add to k.Reg and khun Duddeek above. Here’s how the king made a statement during the current crises. This is part of his birthday speech on 4 December 2006 just a few months after the coup. Basically he characterised the “overthrow of [Thaksin] government” as “smooth” and “good” and those who opposed the junta-appointed gov as “jealous”.
Thanks Reg (and dukdeek) for getting the point of my post – which was to highlight the selectivity in the timing and content of the king’s statements on politics.
Robert, there seems a world of difference between making statements to support democratic processes (which the king has almost never made) and standing behind authoritarian regimes and being openly supportive of a coup.
Don, can you recall any expert inside or outside Burma predicting the Saffron Revolution? People make their own history from circumstances they find themselves in but not necessarily of their own making. And push comes to shove all too often in Burma these days.
Evolution has passed them by in Burma, and in Europe it took centuries, not within a person’s life time and not without violent struggle from time to time either. Westerners just take it for granted what their forefathers had fought for them, spilling their blood and guts literally at certain moments in history.
So it’s all very well to tell others to wait for civil society to spring up and move things forward bit by bit just because we abhor bloodshed and we are now in the 21st century, not that things are that much better elsewhere in the Third World. Nobody wants another massacre and defeat. We are flattering ourselves if we think we are so good at determining and timing of the course of events. One can only prepare to the best of one’s ability.
The only positive outcome of the 8888 Uprising was the existence of an above ground opposition – yes, it did take an insurrection with loss of thousands of life, and Aung San Suu Kyi and her party filled the leadership vacuum on the back of it – but just look at how it can barely breathe under the military boot, denied of its election victory and totally hamstrung, reduced to making statements in reaction to events unfolding only to fall on deaf ears, and at the beck and call of the generals to play the game on terms dictated by the generals. Has the NLD made any headway in any effective manner either in negotiating for national reconciliation or in organising mass action to achieve some semblence of political freedom and human rights?
I couldn’t agree more that the Burmese deserve better leaders both in the military and in the opposition. The only realistic positive scenarios at this juncture are a palace coup by a Burmese de Klerk in the army or a split in the army with some Young Turks starting a mutiny and adding a new dimension to the 60 year old civil war.
Would the generals allow civil society to develop to the extent that it can affect genuine reform or radical change let alone challenge its grip on power? Would mass boycotts and strikes gain concessions from let alone bring down the regime without bloodshed? Now that’s what I call idealism.
The tragedy of Burma is that people have been reduced to either waiting for the West to intervene or wooing the army to split and fight for the people against tyranny. Non-violent civil disobedience and protest or dialogue just ain’t working.
It does not justify untruths being peddled (by PAD), but there is no denying that the anti-monarchy camp are barracking for the Thaksin side, and are therefore seen as a subset of the pro-Thaksin camp.
Pundit, you should be aware of such matters, but for a quick example (in English) all one needs to do is a search of posts by ‘Republican’ on this site.
There are always risks in getting involved in these sorts of reviews. But I still think that it was worthwhile participating and highlighting the fundamental problems with the social development planning. I wouldn’t want to overstate the influence of my involvement but, if anything, I suspect the report’s clear highlighting of these social impact issues made Australian endorsement a little less likely that it otherwise would have been.
Moe Aung, you are an idealist. The military has all the arms, and the will to use them. If there is another uprising as in 8888 or September 2007 the results will most likely be the same. You can always hope for a split in the armed forces but it is just hope. There is no evidence that I know of to support this prospect. In my view another uprising would only result in another misfortune for the Burmese people, who deserve better from their leaders, both in the military and in the opposition. From my perspective the only way to promote positive change in Burma is through gradual evolution in which people learn to live democratically and develop the institutions to implement democracy effectively. Perhaps the civil society groups that have sprung up in response to the cyclone are a start in this direction. But I do not think a sudden “magic” solution is either likely or even possible given the existing conditions in Burma.
What was that all about? Cloak and dagger stuff? Or just play acting?
Here’s the scenario:
Burmese politics has never been totally polarised as now, the rulers vs. the ruled. The junta is deemed beyond the pale post- September 2007, post-Nargis. They belong in Avici, the deepest of hells, as far as the populace is concerned.
The next uprising, even as we speak, is being talked about for 8808 or 8th August. The Burmese never have ruled out armed resistance to tyrants at any time in their history, foreign or domestic. The last time they tried, 8888, they only had swords and sling shots, and the outcome was predictable. Suu Kyi failed to split the army and at the same time managed to split the opposition by refusing to work with U Nu. Her commitment to non-violence and liberal politics was out of place in Burma and proved an abject failure after so much sacrifice.
So how are the people going to arm themselves this time? If the army
splits as hoped by many – otherwise the odds are no better than in 1988 – then there won’t be an insurmountable problem. They’ll have access to enough arms to begin with. If people fail to win over a significant number to start a mutiny as some experts predicted, help from outside becomes paramount. They are unlikely to wait for anyone when the whole thing explodes once again. Leaders will be found and those who can’t lead will simply be left by the wayside. The Burmese nation will find its own strength.
When is the West likely to come in flying the UN flag, probably not when they are needed, as usual, but when things start going the “wrong” way. The “moderate” faction is their choice – here read their own placemen ideally or at least friendly Western oriented leaders – to follow their own model of democracy and development. So watch this space.
If you have a google around for р╕гр╕▒р╕Кр╕Юр╕┤р╕У р╕Ир╕▒р╕Щр╕Чр╕гр╣Мр╣Ар╕Ир╕гр╕┤р╕Н (Rachapin Chancharoen) you will find a fair amount of Thai-language reporting (and blogging, etc) on her case. My understanding is that the story was broken, originally, by Khao Sod. Manager and others have also reported the story to one extent or another. They even have some pictures.
From my reading it is unclear how far this prosecution will go. I get the impression, although I may be mistaken, that this is not another Chotisak…of course, I may be wrong about that.
I just read in the international press that another person – a woman – has been charged/accused of lese majeste for failing to stand in a cinema. The date on the report was 18 June. Anyone know any more about this? Was it in the Thai press/media?
jonfernquest: I seldom agree with much of the stuff you write, often because it is underlain by a self-proclaimed buddhism that I find pathetic and sometimes pedantic. I should observe that I am happy to be accused of insulting (gratuitously or any other way) the religion (or any religion) – so I am 2-0 at the moment having also insulted the monarchy on NM. I don’t claim any expertise in any religion, so I will depart this line to find a point of agreement.
I don’t think these PAD leaders are monomaniacs; they have more than one obssession. However, I do agree that they are performing an essential task. I certainly don’t agree that these “maniacs” can be heroes (unless you see their task as getting rid of another government that was elected only a few months ago).
BTW, “power politics” is a term that is well used by political scientists. It is very often related to international relations, but is usually used to refer to desire and action to protect one’s own interests (especially by elites) by threatening others with aggression that may be military, economic or political. Power politics implies that it is in someone’s interests to be able to harm others. It also implies the strength of self-interest over other interests.
Robert Horn: “I think each side, when it comes to the monarchy, does things that are absolutely unacceptable.” I don’t think I get the point here. How do you define “unacceptable”? The monarchy got itself into this pickle and they reap what they sow.
23 June 2008
To illustrate –
A little while ago on ASTV Veera was on about Giles Ungpakorn making a quip to the effect that he was proud of his Chinese and English bloodlines. Veera, who had earlier hear Giles say ask whether the economy was gong to get any better by the PAD protesting Khao Preah Viharn. Disgruntled, Veera said “If Giles is so proud of being Chinese and English, why doesn’t he get the hell out of Thailand!”
I immediately called ASTV, though it won’t help much, and asked them to pass on a complaint that they keep making racist nationalist remarks and they will begin making a lot more enemies all over Thailand.
Let’s see, but this is one of those reasons I caution my wife and anyone else who will listen not to fall for anything 100%. Everyone leading a cause has an agenda.
BTW, does anyone know of any case in Thailand where anyone has taken the lese majeste charge to court to get it reformed or repealed? Did anyone ever come close?
Thanks.
[…] many New Mandala readers who are following the ongoing discussion of foreign fighters in eastern Burma will want to check out the new website of Dave Everett. The […]
On the one hand, Thailand is criticized for the immaturity of its political development, and in some quarters HM and the neo-feudal “patronage system” are blamed for retarding this development.
On the other hand, now you want Big Daddy to come in and yell at the kids to play nice instead of learning for themselves how to act like grown ups.
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Any chance of a word from on high?
Don’t worry, Andrew, I’m sure it’s not only Reg & dukdeek who get the point of your posts.
Since the inception of this site, I think its been pretty clear where you are coming from, and which ‘side’ you are on when it comes to Thailand political matters.
Any chance of a word from on high?
Just want to add to k.Reg and khun Duddeek above. Here’s how the king made a statement during the current crises. This is part of his birthday speech on 4 December 2006 just a few months after the coup. Basically he characterised the “overthrow of [Thaksin] government” as “smooth” and “good” and those who opposed the junta-appointed gov as “jealous”.
р╕Йр╕░р╕Щр╕▒р╣Йр╕Щр╕Вр╕нр╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╣Ар╕Вр╕▓р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Бр╕Бр╣Ир╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕бр╕╡р╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╕кр╕Ър╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Ур╣Мр╣Бр╕ер╣Йр╕зр╕бр╕╡р╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╕кр╕Ър╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Ур╣Мр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Фр╕╡ р╕Чр╕│р╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╕Ър╣Йр╕▓р╕Щр╣Ар╕бр╕╖р╕нр╕Зр╕Фр╕│р╣Ар╕Щр╕┤р╕Щр╕Зр╕▓р╕Щр╣Др╕Ыр╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╕Вр╕нр╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╕Юр╕зр╕Бр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╣Бр╕Бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╕кр╕│р╣Ар╕гр╣Зр╕И р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╕кр╕│р╣Ар╕гр╣Зр╕Ир╣Гр╕Щр╕Зр╕▓р╕Щр╕Бр╕▓р╕г р╕Бр╣Зр╣Ар╕Кр╕╖р╣Ир╕нр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕кр╕┤р╣Ир╕Зр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕кр╕│р╕Др╕▒р╕Н р╕Юр╕╣р╕Фр╕Цр╕╢р╕Зр╣Бр╕Бр╣И р╕Щр╕╢р╕Бр╣Бр╕Бр╣И р╕нр╕▓р╕вр╕╕р╕бр╕▓р╕Бр╕нр╕▓р╕вр╕╕р╕Щр╣Йр╕нр╕вр╕Юр╕╣р╕Ф р╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕Фр╕╣р╕Ър╣Йр╕▓р╕З р╕Хр╕нр╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕вр╕╕р╕Ър╕гр╕▒р╕Рр╕Ър╕▓р╕ер╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Хр╕▒р╣Йр╕Зр╕гр╕▒р╕Рр╕Ър╕▓р╕е р╕Бр╣Зр╕Хр╕▒р╣Йр╕Зр╕бр╕▓р╕Фр╣Йр╕зр╕вр╕Фр╕╡р╣Вр╕Фр╕вр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Др╕Щр╕Хр╕▒р╣Йр╕Зр╣Гр╕Ир╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Ир╕░р╕Чр╕│р╕Зр╕▓р╕Щ р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Ир╕░ р╕Бр╣Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╕Чр╕гр╕▓р╕Ър╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕Хр╕▒р╣Йр╕Зр╣Гр╕Ир╕Ир╕гр╕┤р╕Зр╣Ж р╕лр╕гр╕╖р╕нр╣Др╕бр╣И р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Др╕Щр╣Бр╕Бр╣Ир╕Вр╕╢р╣Йр╕Щр╕бр╕▓р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Ьр╕╣р╣Йр╣Гр╕лр╕Нр╣И р╕лр╕гр╕╖р╕нр╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕Зр╣Гр╕лр╕Нр╣Ир╕Бр╣Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕нр╕░р╣Др╕г р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕╡р╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╣Вр╕ер╕ар╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Ир╕░р╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕З р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╣Ар╕лр╣Зр╕Щр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕бр╕╡р╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕нр╕вр╕╣р╣Ир╣Гр╕Щр╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕Зр╕кр╕╣р╕З р╕Ьр╕╣р╣Йр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕нр╕▓р╕вр╕╕р╕бр╕▓р╕Бр╕Бр╣Зр╕вр╕нр╕бр╕гр╕▒р╕Ъ р╣Ар╕Вр╕▓р╕Ир╕╢р╕Зр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Бр╕Бр╣Ир╕Щр╕│р╕Бр╣Зр╣Др╕бр╣Ир╕бр╕╡р╣Гр╕Др╕гр╕зр╣Ир╕▓ р╕Ьр╕╣р╣Йр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕бр╕▓р╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕Зр╕гр╕▒р╕Рр╕Ър╕▓р╕е р╕лр╕гр╕╖р╕нр╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕Зр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕кр╕│р╕Др╕▒р╕Нр╣Ж р╣Ар╕Юр╕гр╕▓р╕░р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕Чр╕│р╕бр╕▓р╕бр╕▓р╕Бр╣Бр╕ер╣Йр╕з р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╣Ар╕Вр╕▓р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Бр╕Бр╣И р╕Хр╕гр╕Зр╕Вр╣Йр╕▓р╕бр╕Бр╣Зр╕Др╕Зр╕Хр╣Йр╕нр╕Зр╕Цр╕╖р╕нр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Др╕│р╕Кр╕бр╣Ар╕Кр╕вр╕зр╣Ир╕▓ р╕нр╕╕р╕Хр╕кр╕▓р╕лр╕░р╣Бр╕Бр╣Ир╣Бр╕ер╣Йр╕зр╕Ир╕░р╕Юр╕▒р╕Бр╕Ьр╣Ир╕нр╕Щр╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Ар╕нр╕▓ р╣Ар╕Вр╕▓р╕Вр╕нр╣Гр╕лр╣Йр╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Бр╣Зр╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щ р╕Щр╕╡р╣Ир╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕кр╕┤р╣Ир╕Зр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Щр╣Ир╕▓р╕Кр╕бр╣Ар╕Кр╕в р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕нр╕▓р╕Ир╕Ир╕░р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щ р╕бр╕▓р╕Ир╕▓р╕Бр╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╕нр╕┤р╕Ир╕Йр╕▓р╕Бр╣Зр╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╕нр╕┤р╕Ир╕Йр╕▓р╕Бр╣Зр╕Кр╣Ир╕▓р╕Зр╣Ар╕Вр╕▓ р╕лр╕бр╕▓р╕вр╕Др╕зр╕▓р╕бр╣Ар╕Вр╕▓р╕Чр╕│р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕зр╣Ир╕▓ р╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щ р╣Ар╕Вр╣Йр╕▓р╣Гр╕И р╣Ар╕Фр╕▓р╣Гр╕Ир╕зр╣Ир╕▓ р╕Цр╣Йр╕▓р╕кр╕бр╕бр╕╕р╕Хр╕┤р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Чр╕│р╣Бр╕ер╣Йр╕зр╕Чр╕│р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Йр╕Бр╣Зр╕Ър╕нр╕Бр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Чр╕│р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╣Ар╕Юр╕гр╕▓р╕░р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Ар╕Др╕вр╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щ р╣Др╕бр╣Ир╣Ар╕Др╕вр╕Чр╕│ р╕лр╕Щр╣Йр╕▓р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕нр╕вр╣Ир╕▓р╕Зр╕Щр╕╡р╣Й р╕Чр╕│р╣Ар╕Чр╣Ир╕▓р╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕Чр╕│р╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╣Бр╕Хр╣Ир╣Ар╕Кр╕╖р╣Ир╕нр╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╕Чр╕│р╣Др╕Фр╣Й р╣Ар╕Юр╕гр╕▓р╕░р╕зр╣Ир╕▓р╣Ар╕Ыр╣Зр╕Щр╕Др╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕бр╕╡р╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╕кр╕Ър╕Бр╕▓р╕гр╕Ур╣М р╣Гр╕Щр╕зр╕▒р╕Щр╕Чр╕╡р╣Ир╕бр╕▓р╕гр╕▒р╕Ър╕Хр╕│р╣Бр╕лр╕Щр╣Ир╕З
Any chance of a word from on high?
Thanks Reg (and dukdeek) for getting the point of my post – which was to highlight the selectivity in the timing and content of the king’s statements on politics.
Any chance of a word from on high?
Robert, there seems a world of difference between making statements to support democratic processes (which the king has almost never made) and standing behind authoritarian regimes and being openly supportive of a coup.
Taking a stand against lèse majesté
Thanks Nich. In the meantime, I did find more information and appreciate the links.
JSEAS special issue on Burma is out now
Don, can you recall any expert inside or outside Burma predicting the Saffron Revolution? People make their own history from circumstances they find themselves in but not necessarily of their own making. And push comes to shove all too often in Burma these days.
Evolution has passed them by in Burma, and in Europe it took centuries, not within a person’s life time and not without violent struggle from time to time either. Westerners just take it for granted what their forefathers had fought for them, spilling their blood and guts literally at certain moments in history.
So it’s all very well to tell others to wait for civil society to spring up and move things forward bit by bit just because we abhor bloodshed and we are now in the 21st century, not that things are that much better elsewhere in the Third World. Nobody wants another massacre and defeat. We are flattering ourselves if we think we are so good at determining and timing of the course of events. One can only prepare to the best of one’s ability.
The only positive outcome of the 8888 Uprising was the existence of an above ground opposition – yes, it did take an insurrection with loss of thousands of life, and Aung San Suu Kyi and her party filled the leadership vacuum on the back of it – but just look at how it can barely breathe under the military boot, denied of its election victory and totally hamstrung, reduced to making statements in reaction to events unfolding only to fall on deaf ears, and at the beck and call of the generals to play the game on terms dictated by the generals. Has the NLD made any headway in any effective manner either in negotiating for national reconciliation or in organising mass action to achieve some semblence of political freedom and human rights?
I couldn’t agree more that the Burmese deserve better leaders both in the military and in the opposition. The only realistic positive scenarios at this juncture are a palace coup by a Burmese de Klerk in the army or a split in the army with some Young Turks starting a mutiny and adding a new dimension to the 60 year old civil war.
Would the generals allow civil society to develop to the extent that it can affect genuine reform or radical change let alone challenge its grip on power? Would mass boycotts and strikes gain concessions from let alone bring down the regime without bloodshed? Now that’s what I call idealism.
The tragedy of Burma is that people have been reduced to either waiting for the West to intervene or wooing the army to split and fight for the people against tyranny. Non-violent civil disobedience and protest or dialogue just ain’t working.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
It does not justify untruths being peddled (by PAD), but there is no denying that the anti-monarchy camp are barracking for the Thaksin side, and are therefore seen as a subset of the pro-Thaksin camp.
Pundit, you should be aware of such matters, but for a quick example (in English) all one needs to do is a search of posts by ‘Republican’ on this site.
Nam Theun resettlement – an entirely predictable stuff-up
There are always risks in getting involved in these sorts of reviews. But I still think that it was worthwhile participating and highlighting the fundamental problems with the social development planning. I wouldn’t want to overstate the influence of my involvement but, if anything, I suspect the report’s clear highlighting of these social impact issues made Australian endorsement a little less likely that it otherwise would have been.
JSEAS special issue on Burma is out now
Moe Aung, you are an idealist. The military has all the arms, and the will to use them. If there is another uprising as in 8888 or September 2007 the results will most likely be the same. You can always hope for a split in the armed forces but it is just hope. There is no evidence that I know of to support this prospect. In my view another uprising would only result in another misfortune for the Burmese people, who deserve better from their leaders, both in the military and in the opposition. From my perspective the only way to promote positive change in Burma is through gradual evolution in which people learn to live democratically and develop the institutions to implement democracy effectively. Perhaps the civil society groups that have sprung up in response to the cyclone are a start in this direction. But I do not think a sudden “magic” solution is either likely or even possible given the existing conditions in Burma.
JSEAS special issue on Burma is out now
What was that all about? Cloak and dagger stuff? Or just play acting?
Here’s the scenario:
Burmese politics has never been totally polarised as now, the rulers vs. the ruled. The junta is deemed beyond the pale post- September 2007, post-Nargis. They belong in Avici, the deepest of hells, as far as the populace is concerned.
The next uprising, even as we speak, is being talked about for 8808 or 8th August. The Burmese never have ruled out armed resistance to tyrants at any time in their history, foreign or domestic. The last time they tried, 8888, they only had swords and sling shots, and the outcome was predictable. Suu Kyi failed to split the army and at the same time managed to split the opposition by refusing to work with U Nu. Her commitment to non-violence and liberal politics was out of place in Burma and proved an abject failure after so much sacrifice.
So how are the people going to arm themselves this time? If the army
splits as hoped by many – otherwise the odds are no better than in 1988 – then there won’t be an insurmountable problem. They’ll have access to enough arms to begin with. If people fail to win over a significant number to start a mutiny as some experts predicted, help from outside becomes paramount. They are unlikely to wait for anyone when the whole thing explodes once again. Leaders will be found and those who can’t lead will simply be left by the wayside. The Burmese nation will find its own strength.
When is the West likely to come in flying the UN flag, probably not when they are needed, as usual, but when things start going the “wrong” way. The “moderate” faction is their choice – here read their own placemen ideally or at least friendly Western oriented leaders – to follow their own model of democracy and development. So watch this space.
Taking a stand against lèse majesté
Reg,
If you have a google around for р╕гр╕▒р╕Кр╕Юр╕┤р╕У р╕Ир╕▒р╕Щр╕Чр╕гр╣Мр╣Ар╕Ир╕гр╕┤р╕Н (Rachapin Chancharoen) you will find a fair amount of Thai-language reporting (and blogging, etc) on her case. My understanding is that the story was broken, originally, by Khao Sod. Manager and others have also reported the story to one extent or another. They even have some pictures.
From my reading it is unclear how far this prosecution will go. I get the impression, although I may be mistaken, that this is not another Chotisak…of course, I may be wrong about that.
Best wishes to all,
Nich
Taking a stand against lèse majesté
I just read in the international press that another person – a woman – has been charged/accused of lese majeste for failing to stand in a cinema. The date on the report was 18 June. Anyone know any more about this? Was it in the Thai press/media?
Thai politics quote of the day
jonfernquest: I seldom agree with much of the stuff you write, often because it is underlain by a self-proclaimed buddhism that I find pathetic and sometimes pedantic. I should observe that I am happy to be accused of insulting (gratuitously or any other way) the religion (or any religion) – so I am 2-0 at the moment having also insulted the monarchy on NM. I don’t claim any expertise in any religion, so I will depart this line to find a point of agreement.
I don’t think these PAD leaders are monomaniacs; they have more than one obssession. However, I do agree that they are performing an essential task. I certainly don’t agree that these “maniacs” can be heroes (unless you see their task as getting rid of another government that was elected only a few months ago).
BTW, “power politics” is a term that is well used by political scientists. It is very often related to international relations, but is usually used to refer to desire and action to protect one’s own interests (especially by elites) by threatening others with aggression that may be military, economic or political. Power politics implies that it is in someone’s interests to be able to harm others. It also implies the strength of self-interest over other interests.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
Robert Horn: “I think each side, when it comes to the monarchy, does things that are absolutely unacceptable.” I don’t think I get the point here. How do you define “unacceptable”? The monarchy got itself into this pickle and they reap what they sow.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
23 June 2008
To illustrate –
A little while ago on ASTV Veera was on about Giles Ungpakorn making a quip to the effect that he was proud of his Chinese and English bloodlines. Veera, who had earlier hear Giles say ask whether the economy was gong to get any better by the PAD protesting Khao Preah Viharn. Disgruntled, Veera said “If Giles is so proud of being Chinese and English, why doesn’t he get the hell out of Thailand!”
I immediately called ASTV, though it won’t help much, and asked them to pass on a complaint that they keep making racist nationalist remarks and they will begin making a lot more enemies all over Thailand.
Let’s see, but this is one of those reasons I caution my wife and anyone else who will listen not to fall for anything 100%. Everyone leading a cause has an agenda.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
23 June 2008
Bob – Very salient point!
BTW, does anyone know of any case in Thailand where anyone has taken the lese majeste charge to court to get it reformed or repealed? Did anyone ever come close?
Thanks.
Rambo and the real war in Burma
[…] many New Mandala readers who are following the ongoing discussion of foreign fighters in eastern Burma will want to check out the new website of Dave Everett. The […]
Any chance of a word from on high?
I would prefer to solve problem(s) ourself.
Any chance of a word from on high?
On the one hand, Thailand is criticized for the immaturity of its political development, and in some quarters HM and the neo-feudal “patronage system” are blamed for retarding this development.
On the other hand, now you want Big Daddy to come in and yell at the kids to play nice instead of learning for themselves how to act like grown ups.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
I think each side, when it comes to the monarchy, does things that are absolutely unacceptable.