Before you apply your infantile sarcasm with me, i would suggest to do your research. I have taken hundreds if not thousands of pictures of Suthep and Abhsit, both on stages and surrounded by supporters. Here you can see a few:
” … I would hardly have done all that if i were the propagandist you people accuse me of being.” – Nostitz
I am shocked that there are people accusing Mr. Nick Nostitz as a propagandist. I don’t recall Nick Nostitz photo that was flattering to Gen. Prayuth, or Abhisit, or Suthep or . . . So how could Nostitz be a propagandist, is puzzling indeed.
Anyway…
But those Black Shirts were certainly amidst the Red Shirts and most certainly being directed by some very senior Red Leaders. Otherwise how could those Black Shirts mingle so freely among the Reds. And when those Black Shirts scored very lethal murderous hits with their indiscriminate serial bomb attacks/assault rifle shootings, the Red Shirts were visibly jubilant … cheering loudly at the murderous success of their Black Shirted comrades. Right Nostitz?
Sondhi Limthongkul boss of Manager magazine and Asia Satellite Television said on the programme ‘Sondhitalk’ that the police were scared of the local mafia and could not touch them and then right from the start they were covering for them.
Thailand’s southern islands are a violent, dangerous, mafia-military-drug-tourist complex, operating completely outside of an international standard for the the rule of law.
The rest of Thailand is not much better.
I will not be returning and nor would I suggest others visit the southern islands, if they value their personal safety.
I am not sure what support Prayuth will end up with amongst the middle classes who largely created the conditions that put him in power. They hate the police for the reasons mentioned in the article and are thirsting for reform of the force which they are unlikely to get. Without sweeping police reform there is no point in bothering to add yet more laws against corruption because there will be no one to enforce them.
Whatever Prayuth’s end game is, he doesn’t seem to envisage needing much middle class support, unless he thinks the only thing they really cared about was getting rid of the Shins and will be eternally greatful for that, assumingf he is able to achieve it. Perhaps the proposal from Chai-Anan that the PM need not be elected is a clue to what is planned for the future. A return to the 80s where fragmented parties always invite the former army chief to be PM because they know the military won’t tolerate anything else.
On the economic reform front, I don’t see anything that could hold a candle to the reforms Anand Panyarachun put in place yet – only the low hanging fruit of the farmer payments and the Thaksin’s infrastructure payments but that is picked now.
@ lolitas brother – while I’m fairly certain this will fall on deaf ears – about the most ‘moronic’ poster on NM of late is yours truly mate. You seem to know very little about this country and shamelessly display your ignorance as some type of badge of honour. Generally speaking the hallmark of the ‘bogan’.
BTW since when does Australia ‘send’ tourists anywhere?
FYI I should add that I am neither a ‘red’ or ‘yellow’ shirt supporter, I also believe that Thaksin should be spending some years behind bars (along with a large number of other elite Thais whether they be in business, the military or the police – a forlorn hope, I know).
As for the monarch – his time has passed. He’s an ailing, lonely old man. Rather than long live the king a more fitting salutation would be – rest in peace.
Have i disputed here the fact that Thaksin shares responsibility?
That pro-Thaksin governments have not been forthcoming in investigations into the drug war killings is naturally not really surprising. The question you should ask yourself is why his opponents, who often use the drug war killings in the accusation against Thaksin, have done nothing in the years they had the opportunity to. This may give you an idea what really has taken place during that time.
You should also ask what created the conditions that the Thai state decided to take such harsh measures against an increasingly overwhelming drug problem.
Every aspect related to the drug war is very uncomfortable. There are no easy solutions. Simple moralistic views, self righteous accusations and political mudslinging will not lead you to understand the situation back then – during the drug war, and in the years leading up to it.
In 2010 literally hundreds of photographers and camera men worked the Red Shirt protests. Very little footage of Red Shirt armed militants exists. Therefore it is not just me who has not been able to take photos of these armed militants. The vast majority of these journalists have not even managed to see them, i at least have seen them on one occasion (as i have already stated countless times). Why don’t you ask the hundreds of other local and foreign journos why they have no footage? Why single me out?
First of all, no – there were not that many of them, and they were not “in the midst of all those Red Shirts”. They operated at the most dangerous front lines, and at night, where most journalists decided not to work (a decision which i made then as well).
In addition, they naturally did not want to be photographed. In my encounter they asked me not to take pictures, and i understandably did not argue the issue. The same occurred with several of my colleagues who have had similar encounters, and were asked by them, or people surrounding them, the same.
Furthermore, i reject in the tone of your comment implied accusation that i were to be biased in my work. I have always clearly confirmed the existence of armed militants in the Red Shirts (and in the PAD/PDRC as well!). I have done that in writing, and also in many TV and radio interviews – both local and international.
I have been the first photographer who has managed to photograph a Red Shirt protester with a gun – back in late 2008. I have published this image in my first Red/Yellow book. That book also has an image of arms (including an Uzi) that police managed to confiscate from a PAD Naclop Srivichai around the same time.
I would hardly have done all that if i were the propagandist you people accuse me of being.
Interesting comments. Like you, my expectation is that the alternatives to high-priced, high “prestige” products like those offered by KFC will maintain their good market share. In fact I would presume that for quite some years to come the booming urban economies of Myanmar will sustain the fullest possible spectrum of eating (and other retail) options. At some stage that will probably change and recent history in similar markets suggests that the KFCs, et al, end up dominating in certain urban cores. Elsewhere a range continues.
While this post highlighted the potential benefits of creative and progressive hiring policies, I think another possible social upside in a place like Myanmar with such investments comes from more robust supply chains. Given the inadequacy of those systems in the past, the possibility for plenty of other businesses, including the mum-and-dad stores, benefiting from stronger transportation and other links is profound. Supply chains are unsexy but important.
“Thai military stops Lahu minority from filing complaint on land rights to junta”
The Thai military stopped a caravan of 15 vans of Lahu from driving to Bangkok on Monday, October 13, to “complain [about the reclamation of their farm lands] to the junta’s National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO), according to Thairath.”
It’s always interesting to me to see someone defend the free market on this scale–to make an argument for the benefits of (a company like) KFC’s presence in a so-called “emerging market” like Myanmar. It’s interesting because I’ve watched the way companies like KFC/McD’s/other chains have destroyed neighborhood and small-town businesses in my area of the United States.
The Swensen’s on Anawratha, and the KFC–wherever it will be in downtown Yangon–certainly have the potential to create jobs for the disadvantaged without damaging the market for average small entrepreneurs. Folks on their way to work will probably still opt for tea in the place they know rather than weak coffee from KFC; perhaps the fried chicken is a different story, but not vastly different. I bet a couple of chicken wings fried up on the street will be cheaper enough than KFC to keep both stores in business. However, as the Usual Suspects have pointed out above, the franchise contracts (and the real financial gains) will stay firmly in the hands of those who already have power.
To put all that together: if KFC Yangon can hire a deaf/Rohingya/marginalized staff, thereby “putting highly competent but disadvantaged [people]” in a position to earn cash, I’m all the happier. However, it would sadden me deeply to see KFC (and the lot) move into suburbs and small towns where they could undercut locally-funded competitors and hurt family businesses. For now, at least, American-side cost-benefit considerations are probably keeping them firmly stuck in major urban cores.
Maybe I’m making an incongruent comparison: in my hometown, Burger King and Barnes and Noble ran out locally-owned burger joints and bookstores, respectively; KFC isn’t exactly a more efficient “replacement” for businesses that already thrive in Myanmar. The hilariously named Burger Queen may be gone, but most mom-and-pop businesses aren’t.
Nothing to do but wait and see what happens. I’ll be waiting with a little concern.
Australia is sending plenty of Tourists over here. there are two groups.
1.Those travelling onward to Europe or other place
2. Those settling in for some time
The Australians, and Canadians, and USA and Scandinavia really don’t give a rats arse about communist studies or what some sacked Reuters journalist thinks .
We just come here, pour money into the system, and we don’t care what the red shirt morons think, long live the King as long as he can God willing
How about the inactivity of several pro Thaksin governments on this issue? If we want to stay factual innocent people have been murdered, Thaksin was the prime minister by then so he had and still has some responsibility either way round.
Thanks for your comments. You assume some attribution not in evidence. Most my comments are not in response to yours, or
in place of yours, but my perspective. I think it is important to place a little context about where and how the middle class
arose, and it was clearly not by those I mentioned; it is not a personal plug for the Suharto extended family (those still among us), but fact. Need not ask me, ask the World Bank for figures of various social
and economic factors during Suharto’s iron-clad rule. Anyway, given how long he ruled, I think your post required broadening into a larger context about social and economic causes of poverty. In fact, by brining up the names of Suharto, Sukarno, Megawati, Habibie and Abdurrahman Wahid, I am indirectly broadening the discussion beyond
just Jokowi and Prabowo, in reference to your observation. But let’s be realistic, Indonesia has undergone several paradigm shifts, one of which is the claim that it is a Democracy. No surprise, the most vocal adherents of this claim are Indonesians themselves. Prior to SBY, only the most diehard brainwashed neo-Marhaenist would have claimed Indonesia is a Democracy. This DOES make it a discussion about Jokowi and Prabowo, not 100 % exclusively, but primarily. The ghosts of the past live on as mirror images of what CURRENT leadership may or may not do. NOW, it is an argument about Prabowo and Jokowi, especially given Prabowo’s not very democratic attempts to nullify Jokowi’s win, which now has been settled, except for Prabowo. Again, attribution for laughter, cynicism, flippancy, or even a modicum of hope, I attribute to myself. I find sometimes, as one who has not been an invited guest commentator, that individuals in your position sometimes personalize responses, when they were not intended to be at all.
Perhaps my “you” and your “YOU” are different
pronouns ? I will accept I could have used
better terminology. I was, in fact, fighting the demons of common misunderstanding about Indonesia, often coloured by dislike for leaders, in the absence of whether they were competent leaders, and not merely fair leaders, of which Indonesia, has yet to have one fully proven.
I agree with some of your comments about poverty, but leery of most UN programmes, often driven by largesse, corruption and
politics, and not the interests of the people for whom they are intended. UNHCR
and UNWCR are fine example of expended rhetoric and little results.
There is also a tendency for some, in all nations, to be a bit defensive about the negative aspects of their respective nations, though in my case, as a current
American, I am not hesitant to be critical.
I should tell you, of my 56 years, 40 were spent in Malaysia, Indonesia and Singapore.
I spent my early youth, in Singapore, two years prior to Merdeka, so I do know something about the Emergency and the “Years
of Living Dangerously” as I was in Java at the time. My aunt is Indo-Dutch and I therefore have Indonesian relatives. I can tell you, as I have watched Indonesia grow from 1960 to 2014, that sources of poverty have drastically changed. EVERYONE, but Europeans, entrepreneurial early Chinese immigrants and Indonesian royalty, were poor.
As a Peranakan (I would be an Orang Campur in Bahasa Melayu designation), I know about “being outside the box” not by choice.
In 1960, NOBODY smoked ganja and kretek, like today (by the way, kretek causes esophageal and buccal cancer), rape was rare,
Indonesians were largely poor, but managed in the face of cholera, dysentery, hepatitis,
malaria and dengue, the last of three, I contracted as a child.
Moving forward, I respectfully would say your view of current poverty is a bit idealized. As with you regarding suppositions, I never said that street people were transients; quite the contrary. Poverty in Indonesia is very largely long term. It is no different in Malaysia in rural area in the North, where Malay kampungs have had generations of families live in the same houses, the only difference being, Indonesia has 10 times as many. However, you do not discuss an issue, which Indonesians almost all shy away from, which is the extent of drug abuse (haram in Islam) and mental illness (obviously not haram, but not something to brag about). Mental illness, according to well-respected (who I happen to know) Psychiatrists and Psychologists is more prevalent in both Indonesia and Malaysia, as commonly believed.
In fact, a certain percentage of people who live on the street (I do not mean in the villages, as much) everywhere may suffer from
depression, bipolar disorder or even schizophrenia. I am not being flippant when I say “Amok” is a Malay word for a reason.
Ritualistic possession among poor factory workers has been studies by Ai Wah Ong (sorry, if I have misspelled her name). But her work is well-known. Most of the workers are working poor and barely make enough to scrape by. If the factory lays them off, they are unemployed poor. I have done research myself on poverty in Indonesia and Malaysia, over about 15 years, and I have found that, in addition to simply not being able to work or make enough to manage, drug abuse among male Javanese and Malays is not “low” at all. Drugs affect brain chemistry, and therefore, affect functionality in society. It is one factor, not the sole factor by any means, but it is no surprise, getting high makes you feel better (for about one hour). I have queried my therapist colleagues, and they feel, due to stigma (throughout Asia and elsewhere) and lack of sufficient clinics, mental illness is way under-reported for all Indonesians, but more so for the poor, who lack the means to go to a therapist and receive proper medication. Slowly, Asia is waking up to this. In Japan, 20 years ago, mental illness never existed, so any Japanese would tell you, and now ? Japan is full of clinics, psychologists, and sadly, street people, many mentally ill. Singapore, Taiwan and South Korea are beginning also to accept this reality of human frailty, Note the richer nations accept “foreign” ideas first, though in Thailand, in Bangkok, therapy has been accepted longer than Malaysia (which is wealthier) or Indonesia.
You words are welcome, but align with mine anyway, as I get the physical reality of poverty in Indonesia, and have for 40 years.
What I think, and I am quite certain about this, some Indonesians are more reticent to accept is that, in some instances (you can hardly exclude personal responsibility entirely, anywhere, on the planet), people choose not to work (more often men), and in surveys conducted properly with controls, some street poor have admitted as much, in Indonesia. Drug use is old news, and kretek has been shown as well to reduce reaction time, and the way Indonesian men often smoke, I am surprised they don’t get Black Lung Disease. Finally, it is all too easy to wish away mental illness with a derisory flip of the hand, but that is not the real world. Studies, by the World Bank and the WHO (the one UN agency that does work), have shown mental illness is a frequent global factor in the social, economic and interfamilial status of the poor, whether in villages (kampungs in this case), towns, or under overpasses. Men drink also, and they do so in Indonesia. The percent of those who follow Shari’a Law is always lower than they would like to claim and what federal governments do falsely claim. These factors cannot be excluded. There are boundless cases of former street poor, going to work and functioning normally, simply because they were mentally ill and got the right medication and therapy. It is BECAUSE this is not talked about in Indonesia, that I do.
It is not the point whether only 10 % of street poor are mentally ill and 90 % aren’t. It IS the point that the 90 % need a different regimen of assistance than the 10 %. I can assure, 100 %, that you might be able to improve some of the 90 % with poverty measures, but no amount of economic aid, in the absence of medication and therapy, will help the 10 % no matter what.
Are we looking for quantitative or qualitative improvement for ALL poor people ?
I rather think the latter (and I am quite sure the figure for the mentally ill is higher than 10 %). Yes, indeed it would be inadequate to equate the healthy with the unhealthy (not forgetting Jakarta’s rising diabetes rates, as if the affluent should be ignored altogether).
Petition for an independent inquiry on the terrible murders of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller now has more than 75,000 signatures from concerned people around the world.
Facebook 
Twitter 
Soundcloud 
Youtube 
Rss
A numbers game: Social media and political legitimacy
Before you apply your infantile sarcasm with me, i would suggest to do your research. I have taken hundreds if not thousands of pictures of Suthep and Abhsit, both on stages and surrounded by supporters. Here you can see a few:
http://www.newmandala.org/2012/10/18/here-were-men-in-black/
http://www.newmandala.org/2012/06/05/reconciliation-games/
A numbers game: Social media and political legitimacy
” … I would hardly have done all that if i were the propagandist you people accuse me of being.” – Nostitz
I am shocked that there are people accusing Mr. Nick Nostitz as a propagandist. I don’t recall Nick Nostitz photo that was flattering to Gen. Prayuth, or Abhisit, or Suthep or . . . So how could Nostitz be a propagandist, is puzzling indeed.
Anyway…
But those Black Shirts were certainly amidst the Red Shirts and most certainly being directed by some very senior Red Leaders. Otherwise how could those Black Shirts mingle so freely among the Reds. And when those Black Shirts scored very lethal murderous hits with their indiscriminate serial bomb attacks/assault rifle shootings, the Red Shirts were visibly jubilant … cheering loudly at the murderous success of their Black Shirted comrades. Right Nostitz?
Islam: A religion of peace
Clive Kessler debates Sahar Amer on the proposition “Does Islam promote violence?” on the ABC Religion and Ethics Report.
ISIS and Malaysia are quoted as examples.
http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/religionandethicsreport/does-islam-promote-violence3f/5815358
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
Sondhi Limthongkul: “Everyone knew from the start the Burmese were scapegoats.”
http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2014/10/thai-police-covered-up-for-mafia-claims.html
Sondhi Limthongkul boss of Manager magazine and Asia Satellite Television said on the programme ‘Sondhitalk’ that the police were scared of the local mafia and could not touch them and then right from the start they were covering for them.
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
Thailand’s southern islands are a violent, dangerous, mafia-military-drug-tourist complex, operating completely outside of an international standard for the the rule of law.
The rest of Thailand is not much better.
I will not be returning and nor would I suggest others visit the southern islands, if they value their personal safety.
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
Somboon Arthit #8. I thought Koh Tao had already been renamed ‘Koh Phe’ by popular acclaim.
I will certainly never set foot on it again or recommend anyone else to do so.
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
The article is sad but true.
I am not sure what support Prayuth will end up with amongst the middle classes who largely created the conditions that put him in power. They hate the police for the reasons mentioned in the article and are thirsting for reform of the force which they are unlikely to get. Without sweeping police reform there is no point in bothering to add yet more laws against corruption because there will be no one to enforce them.
Whatever Prayuth’s end game is, he doesn’t seem to envisage needing much middle class support, unless he thinks the only thing they really cared about was getting rid of the Shins and will be eternally greatful for that, assumingf he is able to achieve it. Perhaps the proposal from Chai-Anan that the PM need not be elected is a clue to what is planned for the future. A return to the 80s where fragmented parties always invite the former army chief to be PM because they know the military won’t tolerate anything else.
On the economic reform front, I don’t see anything that could hold a candle to the reforms Anand Panyarachun put in place yet – only the low hanging fruit of the farmer payments and the Thaksin’s infrastructure payments but that is picked now.
Intolerance, Islam and the Internet in Burma
[…] 10 orang Muslim yang terbunuh, seorang Buddhis juga terbunuh [New Mandala, tanggal 10 Juni […]
Review of Thai language phrasebooks
I have been a student of Thai for a while now and have read quite a lot of Thai language phrasebooks. A couple that have garbbed my attention are the…
1.English Thai bar guide
2.And a new kid on the block “Romancing The Thai”.
These ebooks are basically based around the Thai love and romance language. There are plenty of phrases and Thai sweet words to amuse anyone.
Recent reports also say that these books are pretty funny and are a breath of fresh air for language learners.
Thank you!
Thai Studies in Australia, redux
@ lolitas brother – while I’m fairly certain this will fall on deaf ears – about the most ‘moronic’ poster on NM of late is yours truly mate. You seem to know very little about this country and shamelessly display your ignorance as some type of badge of honour. Generally speaking the hallmark of the ‘bogan’.
BTW since when does Australia ‘send’ tourists anywhere?
FYI I should add that I am neither a ‘red’ or ‘yellow’ shirt supporter, I also believe that Thaksin should be spending some years behind bars (along with a large number of other elite Thais whether they be in business, the military or the police – a forlorn hope, I know).
As for the monarch – his time has passed. He’s an ailing, lonely old man. Rather than long live the king a more fitting salutation would be – rest in peace.
Thailand’s Prayuth: Not just another coup-maker
Have i disputed here the fact that Thaksin shares responsibility?
That pro-Thaksin governments have not been forthcoming in investigations into the drug war killings is naturally not really surprising. The question you should ask yourself is why his opponents, who often use the drug war killings in the accusation against Thaksin, have done nothing in the years they had the opportunity to. This may give you an idea what really has taken place during that time.
You should also ask what created the conditions that the Thai state decided to take such harsh measures against an increasingly overwhelming drug problem.
Every aspect related to the drug war is very uncomfortable. There are no easy solutions. Simple moralistic views, self righteous accusations and political mudslinging will not lead you to understand the situation back then – during the drug war, and in the years leading up to it.
A numbers game: Social media and political legitimacy
In 2010 literally hundreds of photographers and camera men worked the Red Shirt protests. Very little footage of Red Shirt armed militants exists. Therefore it is not just me who has not been able to take photos of these armed militants. The vast majority of these journalists have not even managed to see them, i at least have seen them on one occasion (as i have already stated countless times). Why don’t you ask the hundreds of other local and foreign journos why they have no footage? Why single me out?
First of all, no – there were not that many of them, and they were not “in the midst of all those Red Shirts”. They operated at the most dangerous front lines, and at night, where most journalists decided not to work (a decision which i made then as well).
In addition, they naturally did not want to be photographed. In my encounter they asked me not to take pictures, and i understandably did not argue the issue. The same occurred with several of my colleagues who have had similar encounters, and were asked by them, or people surrounding them, the same.
Furthermore, i reject in the tone of your comment implied accusation that i were to be biased in my work. I have always clearly confirmed the existence of armed militants in the Red Shirts (and in the PAD/PDRC as well!). I have done that in writing, and also in many TV and radio interviews – both local and international.
I have been the first photographer who has managed to photograph a Red Shirt protester with a gun – back in late 2008. I have published this image in my first Red/Yellow book. That book also has an image of arms (including an Uzi) that police managed to confiscate from a PAD Naclop Srivichai around the same time.
I would hardly have done all that if i were the propagandist you people accuse me of being.
Burgers and social responsibility in Myanmar
Thanks Michael,
Interesting comments. Like you, my expectation is that the alternatives to high-priced, high “prestige” products like those offered by KFC will maintain their good market share. In fact I would presume that for quite some years to come the booming urban economies of Myanmar will sustain the fullest possible spectrum of eating (and other retail) options. At some stage that will probably change and recent history in similar markets suggests that the KFCs, et al, end up dominating in certain urban cores. Elsewhere a range continues.
While this post highlighted the potential benefits of creative and progressive hiring policies, I think another possible social upside in a place like Myanmar with such investments comes from more robust supply chains. Given the inadequacy of those systems in the past, the possibility for plenty of other businesses, including the mum-and-dad stores, benefiting from stronger transportation and other links is profound. Supply chains are unsexy but important.
Best wishes to all,
Nich
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
Koh Tao should be renamed Murder Island.
The Thai police are corrupt.
While the real killers still walk free.
Forest evictions under Prayuth?
As predicted, the forest evictions are concentrated on those least likely to defend themselves. The following was posted on Prachatai:
http://www.prachatai.com/english/node/4401
“Thai military stops Lahu minority from filing complaint on land rights to junta”
The Thai military stopped a caravan of 15 vans of Lahu from driving to Bangkok on Monday, October 13, to “complain [about the reclamation of their farm lands] to the junta’s National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO), according to Thairath.”
Burgers and social responsibility in Myanmar
It’s always interesting to me to see someone defend the free market on this scale–to make an argument for the benefits of (a company like) KFC’s presence in a so-called “emerging market” like Myanmar. It’s interesting because I’ve watched the way companies like KFC/McD’s/other chains have destroyed neighborhood and small-town businesses in my area of the United States.
The Swensen’s on Anawratha, and the KFC–wherever it will be in downtown Yangon–certainly have the potential to create jobs for the disadvantaged without damaging the market for average small entrepreneurs. Folks on their way to work will probably still opt for tea in the place they know rather than weak coffee from KFC; perhaps the fried chicken is a different story, but not vastly different. I bet a couple of chicken wings fried up on the street will be cheaper enough than KFC to keep both stores in business. However, as the Usual Suspects have pointed out above, the franchise contracts (and the real financial gains) will stay firmly in the hands of those who already have power.
To put all that together: if KFC Yangon can hire a deaf/Rohingya/marginalized staff, thereby “putting highly competent but disadvantaged [people]” in a position to earn cash, I’m all the happier. However, it would sadden me deeply to see KFC (and the lot) move into suburbs and small towns where they could undercut locally-funded competitors and hurt family businesses. For now, at least, American-side cost-benefit considerations are probably keeping them firmly stuck in major urban cores.
Maybe I’m making an incongruent comparison: in my hometown, Burger King and Barnes and Noble ran out locally-owned burger joints and bookstores, respectively; KFC isn’t exactly a more efficient “replacement” for businesses that already thrive in Myanmar. The hilariously named Burger Queen may be gone, but most mom-and-pop businesses aren’t.
Nothing to do but wait and see what happens. I’ll be waiting with a little concern.
Thai Studies in Australia, redux
Australia is sending plenty of Tourists over here. there are two groups.
1.Those travelling onward to Europe or other place
2. Those settling in for some time
The Australians, and Canadians, and USA and Scandinavia really don’t give a rats arse about communist studies or what some sacked Reuters journalist thinks .
We just come here, pour money into the system, and we don’t care what the red shirt morons think, long live the King as long as he can God willing
Thailand’s Prayuth: Not just another coup-maker
How about the inactivity of several pro Thaksin governments on this issue? If we want to stay factual innocent people have been murdered, Thaksin was the prime minister by then so he had and still has some responsibility either way round.
Life under a railway flyover
Hello Ray,
Thanks for your comments. You assume some attribution not in evidence. Most my comments are not in response to yours, or
in place of yours, but my perspective. I think it is important to place a little context about where and how the middle class
arose, and it was clearly not by those I mentioned; it is not a personal plug for the Suharto extended family (those still among us), but fact. Need not ask me, ask the World Bank for figures of various social
and economic factors during Suharto’s iron-clad rule. Anyway, given how long he ruled, I think your post required broadening into a larger context about social and economic causes of poverty. In fact, by brining up the names of Suharto, Sukarno, Megawati, Habibie and Abdurrahman Wahid, I am indirectly broadening the discussion beyond
just Jokowi and Prabowo, in reference to your observation. But let’s be realistic, Indonesia has undergone several paradigm shifts, one of which is the claim that it is a Democracy. No surprise, the most vocal adherents of this claim are Indonesians themselves. Prior to SBY, only the most diehard brainwashed neo-Marhaenist would have claimed Indonesia is a Democracy. This DOES make it a discussion about Jokowi and Prabowo, not 100 % exclusively, but primarily. The ghosts of the past live on as mirror images of what CURRENT leadership may or may not do. NOW, it is an argument about Prabowo and Jokowi, especially given Prabowo’s not very democratic attempts to nullify Jokowi’s win, which now has been settled, except for Prabowo. Again, attribution for laughter, cynicism, flippancy, or even a modicum of hope, I attribute to myself. I find sometimes, as one who has not been an invited guest commentator, that individuals in your position sometimes personalize responses, when they were not intended to be at all.
Perhaps my “you” and your “YOU” are different
pronouns ? I will accept I could have used
better terminology. I was, in fact, fighting the demons of common misunderstanding about Indonesia, often coloured by dislike for leaders, in the absence of whether they were competent leaders, and not merely fair leaders, of which Indonesia, has yet to have one fully proven.
I agree with some of your comments about poverty, but leery of most UN programmes, often driven by largesse, corruption and
politics, and not the interests of the people for whom they are intended. UNHCR
and UNWCR are fine example of expended rhetoric and little results.
There is also a tendency for some, in all nations, to be a bit defensive about the negative aspects of their respective nations, though in my case, as a current
American, I am not hesitant to be critical.
I should tell you, of my 56 years, 40 were spent in Malaysia, Indonesia and Singapore.
I spent my early youth, in Singapore, two years prior to Merdeka, so I do know something about the Emergency and the “Years
of Living Dangerously” as I was in Java at the time. My aunt is Indo-Dutch and I therefore have Indonesian relatives. I can tell you, as I have watched Indonesia grow from 1960 to 2014, that sources of poverty have drastically changed. EVERYONE, but Europeans, entrepreneurial early Chinese immigrants and Indonesian royalty, were poor.
As a Peranakan (I would be an Orang Campur in Bahasa Melayu designation), I know about “being outside the box” not by choice.
In 1960, NOBODY smoked ganja and kretek, like today (by the way, kretek causes esophageal and buccal cancer), rape was rare,
Indonesians were largely poor, but managed in the face of cholera, dysentery, hepatitis,
malaria and dengue, the last of three, I contracted as a child.
Moving forward, I respectfully would say your view of current poverty is a bit idealized. As with you regarding suppositions, I never said that street people were transients; quite the contrary. Poverty in Indonesia is very largely long term. It is no different in Malaysia in rural area in the North, where Malay kampungs have had generations of families live in the same houses, the only difference being, Indonesia has 10 times as many. However, you do not discuss an issue, which Indonesians almost all shy away from, which is the extent of drug abuse (haram in Islam) and mental illness (obviously not haram, but not something to brag about). Mental illness, according to well-respected (who I happen to know) Psychiatrists and Psychologists is more prevalent in both Indonesia and Malaysia, as commonly believed.
In fact, a certain percentage of people who live on the street (I do not mean in the villages, as much) everywhere may suffer from
depression, bipolar disorder or even schizophrenia. I am not being flippant when I say “Amok” is a Malay word for a reason.
Ritualistic possession among poor factory workers has been studies by Ai Wah Ong (sorry, if I have misspelled her name). But her work is well-known. Most of the workers are working poor and barely make enough to scrape by. If the factory lays them off, they are unemployed poor. I have done research myself on poverty in Indonesia and Malaysia, over about 15 years, and I have found that, in addition to simply not being able to work or make enough to manage, drug abuse among male Javanese and Malays is not “low” at all. Drugs affect brain chemistry, and therefore, affect functionality in society. It is one factor, not the sole factor by any means, but it is no surprise, getting high makes you feel better (for about one hour). I have queried my therapist colleagues, and they feel, due to stigma (throughout Asia and elsewhere) and lack of sufficient clinics, mental illness is way under-reported for all Indonesians, but more so for the poor, who lack the means to go to a therapist and receive proper medication. Slowly, Asia is waking up to this. In Japan, 20 years ago, mental illness never existed, so any Japanese would tell you, and now ? Japan is full of clinics, psychologists, and sadly, street people, many mentally ill. Singapore, Taiwan and South Korea are beginning also to accept this reality of human frailty, Note the richer nations accept “foreign” ideas first, though in Thailand, in Bangkok, therapy has been accepted longer than Malaysia (which is wealthier) or Indonesia.
You words are welcome, but align with mine anyway, as I get the physical reality of poverty in Indonesia, and have for 40 years.
What I think, and I am quite certain about this, some Indonesians are more reticent to accept is that, in some instances (you can hardly exclude personal responsibility entirely, anywhere, on the planet), people choose not to work (more often men), and in surveys conducted properly with controls, some street poor have admitted as much, in Indonesia. Drug use is old news, and kretek has been shown as well to reduce reaction time, and the way Indonesian men often smoke, I am surprised they don’t get Black Lung Disease. Finally, it is all too easy to wish away mental illness with a derisory flip of the hand, but that is not the real world. Studies, by the World Bank and the WHO (the one UN agency that does work), have shown mental illness is a frequent global factor in the social, economic and interfamilial status of the poor, whether in villages (kampungs in this case), towns, or under overpasses. Men drink also, and they do so in Indonesia. The percent of those who follow Shari’a Law is always lower than they would like to claim and what federal governments do falsely claim. These factors cannot be excluded. There are boundless cases of former street poor, going to work and functioning normally, simply because they were mentally ill and got the right medication and therapy. It is BECAUSE this is not talked about in Indonesia, that I do.
It is not the point whether only 10 % of street poor are mentally ill and 90 % aren’t. It IS the point that the 90 % need a different regimen of assistance than the 10 %. I can assure, 100 %, that you might be able to improve some of the 90 % with poverty measures, but no amount of economic aid, in the absence of medication and therapy, will help the 10 % no matter what.
Are we looking for quantitative or qualitative improvement for ALL poor people ?
I rather think the latter (and I am quite sure the figure for the mentally ill is higher than 10 %). Yes, indeed it would be inadequate to equate the healthy with the unhealthy (not forgetting Jakarta’s rising diabetes rates, as if the affluent should be ignored altogether).
Thai Police: Intent to reform?
Petition for an independent inquiry on the terrible murders of Hannah Witheridge and David Miller now has more than 75,000 signatures from concerned people around the world.
http://www.change.org/p/the-government-of-the-united-kingdom-independently-investigate-the-horrific-murders-of-hannah-witheridge-and-david-miller
http://i7.cdnds.net/14/38/450×450/rexfeatures_4104522a.jpg