Hopefully! As “they will never go away”, I suggest they might want to start thinking for themselves for a change. Their addiction to the richman’s crumbs of comfort is still far from over. There are still idiots amongst them who are incapable of getting beyond the vacuous hero worship of that very flawed person.
Benjamin Schreer comparing China and the US presence in Southeast Asia over at The Strategist:
Of course, this doesn’t mean that Australia and America’s Southeast Asian allies and partners are now on an anti-China course. But they have a key interest in maintaining an American presence in the region and an acute awareness of when to step up the plate. China is a long way from undermining America’s position in Southeast Asia.
The Red Shirts are just starting to grow into their boots; by weening themselves off the Shinawatr’s teat they’re growing stronger. They will never go away until some collective leg-up allows for significant changes – preferably coming from the top-down – a must-do if Thailand’s admin class wants to salvage any dignity for herself.
Let’s simplify that a tad Vichai. There will be large groups of highly-suggestible beings in a limited range of prime colored ‘uniforms’ on the streets looking to bang heads.
One could argue that there is a tendency for flockleaders here to arrive at what seemed like a good idea (at the time), after being goaded relentlessly in the ‘right’ direction by those few sinister shepherds and their sychophantic sheepdogs who always want to put the local common kitty to the good use of their clans and other feudal associations. That ‘great idea’ then spreads like wildfire – much to the bewilderment of a tiny minority of folks who prefer to stay a little aloof from the local flockthink. It seems that some beings here begin to feel lonesome if they are not constantly being prodded into demonstrating their group and grayng-jai allegiances to supposedly more enlightened folks. The bogeyman might get them if they spend too long on the edge of the flock, so they have to keep milling around to make sure their exposure to danger is a shared one. Thus they are easily fleeced into collectively and mindlessly storming the hurdles.
No apologies for the mixed metaphors whatsoever! One must continue to keep thinking outside the flockthink to survive such collective nihilism.
So you enjoyed your ILLEGAL coup. Now you have told me that you are against democratic principles and love the absolutely corrupt military to run the country. All those in Bangkok that stood and cheered and elsewhere were fooled into thinking that the military was the only way to run this country.You always appear to blame Thaksin for his alleged crimes but always fail to mention the military and democrats corruption.This myopic view of Thailand is one of the reasons why corruption thrives here. It is time for you to wake up and see that your corrupt views as a coup lover will soon be a thing of the past.
“Where were these rectors when the military had their illegal coup in 2006?” – Roy
I presume you are asking me to guess where those rectors were during the upheavals in year 2006 that led to the coup that toppled disgraceful Thaksin.
My guess was that most of those rectors were standing right beside me, among tens of thousanes, as we shout our “Thaksin Og Pai” at Bangok streets. Where were you Roy during that time?
It has become clear to the Thai intelligentsia that Thaksin and his Thai Rak Thai Party (even then that outlawed party was a party 100% of, by and for Thaksin Shinawatra) was suborning/intimidating institutions towards a one-party Thaksin Republic. If Thaksin was not busy directing his extra-judicial police to shoot drug suspects on sight, he was helping his wife count the proceeds of their 20% (at that time I believe) take-it-or-leave cut on juicy government projects, or, making shady deals and amending laws to enrich himself, his family and his gang.
When the coup occurred, Bangkok citizens lined by the hundreds of thousands to shower garlands to military coupists and their tanks. I presume some rectors were dismayed at, and some were resigned to, and some approved of, the coup. But nearly every rector at that time, I am guessing, were relieved that Thaksin-the-Divisive or Thaksin-the-mother-of-Thai-corruption had been been permanently ousted from power. Or so we thought.
New Mandala readers in the Canberra area maybe interested in attending this seminar by Norshahril Saat titled, ‘Capturing the state: contrasting cases of state-official ulama relations in post-authoritarian Indonesia and Malaysia.’
Whilt I agree with you that this very stupid bill should be killed, the appointed senators decided to prolong the debate by striking and not attending on Saturday. However, you do not address my points about these rectors. WHERE WERE THEIR VOICES IN 2006 WHEN THE ILLEGAL COUP TOOK PLACE? WHERE WERE THEY WHEN THE ILLEGAL MILITARY COUP MAKERS RIPPED UP THE 1997 CONSTITUTION?
These esteemed academics should know better and must ponder their past mistakes or resign. As for your insults against law makers by calling them “Buffeloes, it shows your total contempt and your complete prejudice and your superiority complex.
Comments made about me are OK as I can defend myself.
BTW these military appointed senators have the right to strike but they should lose a day’s pay.
Those Red Shirts are baaaack in Bangkok Sunday today.
There are Reds who oppose the Thaksin amnesty (“we are not Red buffalos” is their mantra) and there those Reds streaming to Bangkok today. Word on the street is inflation has caught up indeed with the Red camp … Red per diem has risen to Baht 2,000 plus.
The Red leaders promised a much reduced Red turnout this time of at least 100,000. I am not sure if Nattawut and Arisman still insist on every Red to tote one gasoline-filled plastic bottle again, out of habit.
But when there Red shirts around, there will be Black Shirts (with their grenade launchers and assault rifles) too within the vicinity. Again that’s Black Shirt habit.
Much appreciated Scott. I knew the article would initially face a mixed reaction at best, because some of my themes defy conventional wisdom and/or common sense: the prince is not the assured successor, Thaksin is a royalist, ultra-royalists often don’t give two hoots about the monarchy, etc etc. Also some academics don’t like the idea of a journalist encroaching on their turf (as some of the initial sneering about TKNS also demonstrated). Not to mention that my penchant for relentless self-promotion and my generally smug tone (both on display in this very comment, in fact) understandably annoy the hell out of a lot of people, who think I am a verbose and pretentious prick who doesn’t know when to shut up, and who deserves a good kicking. Let’s face it, they do have a point. I even annoy the hell out of myself.
Anyway, I wrote р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д to share some of the main arguments of the book, partly to gauge the reaction and partly to get knee-jerk hostility out of the way. The reaction has been fantastic actually, and a lot of people have taken the trouble to write detailed comments to me, to a degree I have never experienced before in response to previous articles.
Most of the response has been private, because understandably, most people would rather not say positive things in public about a seditious article. So open discussion of р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д is necessarily confined to a few (excellent and much-needed) websites, including New Mandala and PPT, which is why I got rather annoyed by its dismissive treatment on both sites. Yes, the article is very long, but that is because I was trying to provide as much evidence as possible to back up a controversial revisionist account of recent events. Otherwise I would have been criticized for making wild unsupported claims. I’ll stop ranting now, but I am sure you can understand why it can be dispiriting to get snarky little putdowns from NM and PPT for having the temerity to research and write a 60,000-word work of detailed investigative journalism, and giving it away online for free.
The most interesting private feedback I received was from Thais in the establishment and officialdom who are privately appalled by the insanity they see around them and want to do something to help fix it. Many of the best sources for р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д were people like this, but the process of finding them and convincing them to talk was excruciatingly time-consuming, and I sometimes despaired at the apparent lack of sane and sensible people in the Thai elite. Even the so-called moderates were usually rabidly reactionary swivel-eyed loons. But the feedback I have received from Thais with direct knowledge of the events recounted in the article has shown me there are many more sane observers among the establishment than I suspected. They are also increasingly willing to break the taboo on sharing sensitive insider information with a foreign journalist. So these are very positive developments.
As a matter of policy, ANU invites all Malaysian leaders: from the government, from the various political parties, from the regional, religious, cultural groups, from social and peoples movements to share their views.
We would be very pleased if more Malaysian leaders who pass through Canberra, to drop by the ANU, to share their views and experience.
This country is an absolute paradise for complete & utter knobheads like Thaksin and Suthep. Oh the irony of a bunch of ANU intellectuals cutting some sympathetic slack for the latest bunch of exploitative cynical boneheads who claim to run this country. If such cretins ever dared raise their heads over even the Narrabri parish council parapets they would be immediately scorned to hell. Long live the tall poppy syndrome!
“How dare they have the gaul to criticise any elected govt over this incredibly stupid and misguided law?” – Roy Anderson
There you go again Roy Anderson. Revealing your inner very intelligent self.
If a law is stupid, misguided and dangerous, then every decent Thai citizen should criticize it, band together to condemn it, protest loudly to kill it. Plus condemn the very buffalo-minded lawmakers, 310 of them I believe, and demand for their apologies. Right, Roy?
This has nothing to do with your comment,AMM, nor this article, and I sincerely apologise to everyone for impertinently chipping in…. but please allow a fellow who lives in the Kingdom & who is at that point between despair and tipping right off the edge when it comes to being informed about events in this benighted land so dear to me. AMM, disregard ALL criticisms of your essays. Era of Insanity – great, keep it coming. Dig ever deeper and do not quit. Thank you.
Why do Thai people say the love the king? To say otherwise one risks lengthy jail terms for breaching the LM laws. As for the question, since when have hypothetical questions have they been exorsised from your lexicon? However, the question is valid but unanswerable due to the LM laws.
The amnesty bill was meant to disproportionately benefit the rich and powerful, effectively, a reset button to give them a fresh start. The poor who died and were injured are told to forgive and forget. They must sacrifice for the rich and powerful to start anew. This was what happened in the past when blood was spilt on the streets. The poor died in vain.
Dr Thaksin, however, underestimated the Thai middle class and workers’ pent-up hatred of corruption which was being given amnesty as well. This struck a raw nerve for all Thais who felt all their lives that they have been exploited, abused and violated by corruption. In Thailand, 3 things in life are certain; death, taxes and corruption.
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The end of the Red Shirts?
Hopefully! As “they will never go away”, I suggest they might want to start thinking for themselves for a change. Their addiction to the richman’s crumbs of comfort is still far from over. There are still idiots amongst them who are incapable of getting beyond the vacuous hero worship of that very flawed person.
Malaysia-US and Malaysia-China relations
Benjamin Schreer comparing China and the US presence in Southeast Asia over at The Strategist:
The end of the Red Shirts?
The Red Shirts are just starting to grow into their boots; by weening themselves off the Shinawatr’s teat they’re growing stronger. They will never go away until some collective leg-up allows for significant changes – preferably coming from the top-down – a must-do if Thailand’s admin class wants to salvage any dignity for herself.
What is to be done in Thailand?
“activist judges” – best description I’ve heard so far…
The end of the Red Shirts?
Let’s simplify that a tad Vichai. There will be large groups of highly-suggestible beings in a limited range of prime colored ‘uniforms’ on the streets looking to bang heads.
One could argue that there is a tendency for flockleaders here to arrive at what seemed like a good idea (at the time), after being goaded relentlessly in the ‘right’ direction by those few sinister shepherds and their sychophantic sheepdogs who always want to put the local common kitty to the good use of their clans and other feudal associations. That ‘great idea’ then spreads like wildfire – much to the bewilderment of a tiny minority of folks who prefer to stay a little aloof from the local flockthink. It seems that some beings here begin to feel lonesome if they are not constantly being prodded into demonstrating their group and grayng-jai allegiances to supposedly more enlightened folks. The bogeyman might get them if they spend too long on the edge of the flock, so they have to keep milling around to make sure their exposure to danger is a shared one. Thus they are easily fleeced into collectively and mindlessly storming the hurdles.
No apologies for the mixed metaphors whatsoever! One must continue to keep thinking outside the flockthink to survive such collective nihilism.
Back to Thailand’s future
So you enjoyed your ILLEGAL coup. Now you have told me that you are against democratic principles and love the absolutely corrupt military to run the country. All those in Bangkok that stood and cheered and elsewhere were fooled into thinking that the military was the only way to run this country.You always appear to blame Thaksin for his alleged crimes but always fail to mention the military and democrats corruption.This myopic view of Thailand is one of the reasons why corruption thrives here. It is time for you to wake up and see that your corrupt views as a coup lover will soon be a thing of the past.
Seeds of Thai democracy
There are too many Thai intellectuals with a serious grasp of their country’s history for New Mandala to waste band-width with material like this.
Back to Thailand’s future
“Where were these rectors when the military had their illegal coup in 2006?” – Roy
I presume you are asking me to guess where those rectors were during the upheavals in year 2006 that led to the coup that toppled disgraceful Thaksin.
My guess was that most of those rectors were standing right beside me, among tens of thousanes, as we shout our “Thaksin Og Pai” at Bangok streets. Where were you Roy during that time?
It has become clear to the Thai intelligentsia that Thaksin and his Thai Rak Thai Party (even then that outlawed party was a party 100% of, by and for Thaksin Shinawatra) was suborning/intimidating institutions towards a one-party Thaksin Republic. If Thaksin was not busy directing his extra-judicial police to shoot drug suspects on sight, he was helping his wife count the proceeds of their 20% (at that time I believe) take-it-or-leave cut on juicy government projects, or, making shady deals and amending laws to enrich himself, his family and his gang.
When the coup occurred, Bangkok citizens lined by the hundreds of thousands to shower garlands to military coupists and their tanks. I presume some rectors were dismayed at, and some were resigned to, and some approved of, the coup. But nearly every rector at that time, I am guessing, were relieved that Thaksin-the-Divisive or Thaksin-the-mother-of-Thai-corruption had been been permanently ousted from power. Or so we thought.
Satisfied Roy?
Constructing the deviant ‘other’ – religious traditionalism in contemporary Malaysia
New Mandala readers in the Canberra area maybe interested in attending this seminar by Norshahril Saat titled, ‘Capturing the state: contrasting cases of state-official ulama relations in post-authoritarian Indonesia and Malaysia.’
For more information, click here.
Back to Thailand’s future
Whilt I agree with you that this very stupid bill should be killed, the appointed senators decided to prolong the debate by striking and not attending on Saturday. However, you do not address my points about these rectors. WHERE WERE THEIR VOICES IN 2006 WHEN THE ILLEGAL COUP TOOK PLACE? WHERE WERE THEY WHEN THE ILLEGAL MILITARY COUP MAKERS RIPPED UP THE 1997 CONSTITUTION?
These esteemed academics should know better and must ponder their past mistakes or resign. As for your insults against law makers by calling them “Buffeloes, it shows your total contempt and your complete prejudice and your superiority complex.
Comments made about me are OK as I can defend myself.
BTW these military appointed senators have the right to strike but they should lose a day’s pay.
The end of the Red Shirts?
Those Red Shirts are baaaack in Bangkok Sunday today.
There are Reds who oppose the Thaksin amnesty (“we are not Red buffalos” is their mantra) and there those Reds streaming to Bangkok today. Word on the street is inflation has caught up indeed with the Red camp … Red per diem has risen to Baht 2,000 plus.
The Red leaders promised a much reduced Red turnout this time of at least 100,000. I am not sure if Nattawut and Arisman still insist on every Red to tote one gasoline-filled plastic bottle again, out of habit.
But when there Red shirts around, there will be Black Shirts (with their grenade launchers and assault rifles) too within the vicinity. Again that’s Black Shirt habit.
Show us your theories
Much appreciated Scott. I knew the article would initially face a mixed reaction at best, because some of my themes defy conventional wisdom and/or common sense: the prince is not the assured successor, Thaksin is a royalist, ultra-royalists often don’t give two hoots about the monarchy, etc etc. Also some academics don’t like the idea of a journalist encroaching on their turf (as some of the initial sneering about TKNS also demonstrated). Not to mention that my penchant for relentless self-promotion and my generally smug tone (both on display in this very comment, in fact) understandably annoy the hell out of a lot of people, who think I am a verbose and pretentious prick who doesn’t know when to shut up, and who deserves a good kicking. Let’s face it, they do have a point. I even annoy the hell out of myself.
Anyway, I wrote р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д to share some of the main arguments of the book, partly to gauge the reaction and partly to get knee-jerk hostility out of the way. The reaction has been fantastic actually, and a lot of people have taken the trouble to write detailed comments to me, to a degree I have never experienced before in response to previous articles.
Most of the response has been private, because understandably, most people would rather not say positive things in public about a seditious article. So open discussion of р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д is necessarily confined to a few (excellent and much-needed) websites, including New Mandala and PPT, which is why I got rather annoyed by its dismissive treatment on both sites. Yes, the article is very long, but that is because I was trying to provide as much evidence as possible to back up a controversial revisionist account of recent events. Otherwise I would have been criticized for making wild unsupported claims. I’ll stop ranting now, but I am sure you can understand why it can be dispiriting to get snarky little putdowns from NM and PPT for having the temerity to research and write a 60,000-word work of detailed investigative journalism, and giving it away online for free.
The most interesting private feedback I received was from Thais in the establishment and officialdom who are privately appalled by the insanity they see around them and want to do something to help fix it. Many of the best sources for р╕Бр╕ер╕╡р╕вр╕╕р╕Д were people like this, but the process of finding them and convincing them to talk was excruciatingly time-consuming, and I sometimes despaired at the apparent lack of sane and sensible people in the Thai elite. Even the so-called moderates were usually rabidly reactionary swivel-eyed loons. But the feedback I have received from Thais with direct knowledge of the events recounted in the article has shown me there are many more sane observers among the establishment than I suspected. They are also increasingly willing to break the taboo on sharing sensitive insider information with a foreign journalist. So these are very positive developments.
Unsilenced
Thanks ‘a second class Malaysian’,
Just doing my job.
As a matter of policy, ANU invites all Malaysian leaders: from the government, from the various political parties, from the regional, religious, cultural groups, from social and peoples movements to share their views.
We would be very pleased if more Malaysian leaders who pass through Canberra, to drop by the ANU, to share their views and experience.
Back to Thailand’s future
This country is an absolute paradise for complete & utter knobheads like Thaksin and Suthep. Oh the irony of a bunch of ANU intellectuals cutting some sympathetic slack for the latest bunch of exploitative cynical boneheads who claim to run this country. If such cretins ever dared raise their heads over even the Narrabri parish council parapets they would be immediately scorned to hell. Long live the tall poppy syndrome!
Back to Thailand’s future
Especially the 2005 election is a good example of what orhers have called “retrospective voting”.
Back to Thailand’s future
“How dare they have the gaul to criticise any elected govt over this incredibly stupid and misguided law?” – Roy Anderson
There you go again Roy Anderson. Revealing your inner very intelligent self.
If a law is stupid, misguided and dangerous, then every decent Thai citizen should criticize it, band together to condemn it, protest loudly to kill it. Plus condemn the very buffalo-minded lawmakers, 310 of them I believe, and demand for their apologies. Right, Roy?
Show us your theories
This has nothing to do with your comment,AMM, nor this article, and I sincerely apologise to everyone for impertinently chipping in…. but please allow a fellow who lives in the Kingdom & who is at that point between despair and tipping right off the edge when it comes to being informed about events in this benighted land so dear to me. AMM, disregard ALL criticisms of your essays. Era of Insanity – great, keep it coming. Dig ever deeper and do not quit. Thank you.
Why Thailand needs its king
Why do Thai people say the love the king? To say otherwise one risks lengthy jail terms for breaching the LM laws. As for the question, since when have hypothetical questions have they been exorsised from your lexicon? However, the question is valid but unanswerable due to the LM laws.
Show us your theories
The amnesty bill was meant to disproportionately benefit the rich and powerful, effectively, a reset button to give them a fresh start. The poor who died and were injured are told to forgive and forget. They must sacrifice for the rich and powerful to start anew. This was what happened in the past when blood was spilt on the streets. The poor died in vain.
Dr Thaksin, however, underestimated the Thai middle class and workers’ pent-up hatred of corruption which was being given amnesty as well. This struck a raw nerve for all Thais who felt all their lives that they have been exploited, abused and violated by corruption. In Thailand, 3 things in life are certain; death, taxes and corruption.
Show us your theories
My theory:
Class struggle