I’m amazed that the Indonesian government are this day 5/1/2015 that they now want trade agreements with Australia and yet they still chuck there rubbish in streets around the capital Jakata and have it picked up by the poor ==get your act together first Help The Poor !!!
Neither China run by a Dalai Lama nor the Burmese are the slave type. Like you, they just whine too much but unlike you, they don’t spread rumors and disinformation.
Interesting analysis. A great deal of this is relevant to the situation in thailand where the current junta is launching its own version of illusory democracy
So everything is for the benefit of the greedy Chinese, as I’ve always said. What about the people of Burma? Will they become Chinese slaves just like the Tibetans and the Uyghurs?
A port in this area has no benefit for China what soever unless a rail is built from Kunming. If a rail can carry Chinese shipping containers down this route, the the sky’s the limit Myanmar. We’ll guarantee the SEZ will have more than just port businesses.
I was really excited to come across this book in mid 2014, not least because I am in the category the reviewer identifies as one for whom the book will be useful. I am a doctoral student, heading to do fieldwork in South East Asia in mid 2015.
That said, my first reaction on reading this book was a something of a sense of despair. I wondered how, if those more experienced and better qualified than me had been through what can surely be described as difficult experiences, then how would I ever manage to do anything meaningful in the field at all? But that is where the book is such a useful resource. I would definitely have found this helpful reading as a master student in respect of thinking through what I need to consider, and the challenges that those seeking to do research in South East Asia may face. One point the contributors brought out to me was that of how even obstacles and challenges tell us something useful. That may sound very obvious, but I found it demonstrated very clearly in the contributions here.
Overall, a very useful book and one to return to throughout the research process
Burma a “peaceful buddhist community”. Is that a joke?There are tens of thousands of ethnic insurgent groups (Wa, Shan, Karen, Karen, Chin, Palaung, …) fighting the central government ever since Burma’s independence 67 years ago today. Some of the ethnics, such as the Karen, Kachin and Chin are also not Buddhists. U Nu tried to make Buddhism the State religion. It didn’t work, so what now? I know that there is a surge of “protectionist, xenophobic, nationalistic” style of Buddhism spreading around in Burma, and monks are involved. 969, mabatha, interreligious marriage laws, buddha figure with headphones and all that rubbish. If a Buddhist monk would follow the exact 227 bikkhu precepts then he shouldn’t be involved in politics at all. That’s not what a venerable Buddhist monk should be doing, but Buddhism is no longer what it used to be. I am not saying Muslims are better. ISIS is definitely a lot worse.
I personally believe that religion is an obsolete piece of evolutionary junk that humans should get rid off, but I am in the minority, i guess.
It would be so simple only if half of what is written were half true. But at the very least people called Rohingya are neither illegal nor immigrants. Left to their own devices, not danger either in much of the history. And most of all there is no evidence that they are jihadists or terrorists.
For deportation, no one would take them, either screaming sonni countries like Saudi, Pakistan or trying hard to be moderate when it suits, Malaysia.
Only solution seems to be people on the ground realizing how they are abused, manipulated and used as pawns by their own leaders- on both sides, for their own gain, spawning immense “Human Rights Industry” and champions and companies with financial interest in the region they reside.
So long as they sing to the tune of all these outsiders -including their own diaspora-, and opportunists, lives will continue to be barely worthwhile living for all the inhabitants.
Re the struggle between Islam and Catholicism in E.Timor.
Yes, there were localised struggles.
Most of E.Timor’s Muslims were from Manufahi and from the East. Indigenous, not Yemenis from Indonesia like the Algadri [Alkatiri] clan, who had migrated from Sana’a to Pontianak, thence to Ternate and Ende where they traded horses, guns and slaves.
A Catholic Catechist in Daisua, Manufahi, was so sick of being slapped around by the late mestico priest Rafael Dos Santos that when TNI arrived he converted to Islam and took the name Hanafi Martins. He converted his whole village and the religion spread to Simpang Tiga. Dos Santos, a fanatic UDT supporter, had been captured by Fretilin and buried, to be killed. He survived thanks to TNI. He later led the resistance to Islam in Manufahi, continuing his private feud with Martins. Dos Santos used Catholic youth to found Colimau 2000, a millenialist cult which had grown from the ‘vision’ of Vital, a nutjob from Taitudak, Alas, who announced 10 new commandments and prophesied that E.Timor would become independent in 2000, but as a precondition he would have to die.
It wasn’t exactly what the Pope called for, but it was good enough for Rafael, who had a group of Catholic youth champing to join Falintil but were forbidden by parents and Church, because it was Communist. Rafael sooled them onto leading pro integrationists from Same, a couple of whom were Muslim and had wanted to exploit a Teak plantation. Using the issues of Teak and Islam, Rafael would form a private resistance army, all Catholic. He had some Indonesian Catholic allies.
Colimau, however, didn’t really take off farther than Same until Vital went to the big jerigen of tua muti in the sky thus fulfilling his prophesy. Colimau was always an underbouw of the Church and those interested in the 2006-7 civil war will find it useful to remember this. Even more useful to trace the antecedents of the late unlamented Millenium Party, which began the East-West provocations in Maliana. They killed a bullock for a pesta rakyat but had to delay proceedings while waiting for their spanduks to arrive, in a suitcase from Indonesia. Then it was on.
Hanafi’s Muslims were transmigrated to Malili and Mamuju in Sulawesi, with the guidance of Agus Dwikarna, the AQ boss. Colimau in Same wanted to burn down the Mosque and protested the presence of Jordanian UNPOL, but the Australian Administrator, unaware of the local history and determined to make Jordan welcome in UN missions, banned them from participation in local politics. In reply they held UN cars ‘hostage’ then went to Suai and did the same. The UN had made a new enemy and Timor would come to regret it.
Another high profile symptom of Islam’s development was the efforts of Mari’s brother, the abominable Ahmed Alkatiri, a Pemuda Pancasila leader in Dili who invited ICMI to commission an office on land owned by indigenous Timorese. They promptly attacked and he lost a digit to a well aimed parang. A reporter from the STT covered the story so Alkatiri and his PP thuglets trashed the paper’s office and computers, and beat up the journo. Ahmed fled to Jakarta and told a heap of porkies to our Post to get a visa and seek asylum, claiming the Indons were after him. Of course, they weren’t, the Timorese were.
To those seeking to defend the ‘enlightened’ Portuguese – I forgive you. But, just in case you haven’t learned your lesson, say the Rosary til Easter.
I am sorry Manhar, you have your beliefs but I, and many others no doubt, more would see them as ignorant and racist. Jihadist Muslims in Burma would be rare, and you, like other seemingly aggressive (not peaceful) Buddhists are inflaming the situation. In southern Thailand Buddhists and Muslims lived alongside each other in harmony since borders were demarcated, with only politics and outside aggression causing the rifts leading to conflict. I am sure it is the same in Burma. You make it worse by confusing religion, migration, territoriliasm and ethnicity. It is a complex picture and will not become clearer through simplistic analysis and aggressive language and actions.
While thinking of many factors, a campaign slogan “Change or no change, change/do min, do” should be also taken into account. Everywhere from the city to rural area, from government institutions to garment factories, from old people to 5-6 year-old children, they were chanting this simple and appealing slogan.
Lovely piece. Great description with a reflection connecting the Saman dance and its present popularity to J. Siegel’s 1960s-ethnography. I just wonder whether may be part of Aceh’s post-conflict inward looking trend of consciousness.
His Majesty the King wishes everyone (including friends of Thailand at New Mandala) a Happy New year and hopes they have perseverance, wisdom and good health in the royal New Year’s greeting card released by the palace Wednesday (Dec 31/2014)
Burma does not need to take care of these illigal immigrants cos they are danger for peaceful buddhist community so they should be deport form Burma. Burma is budhist country they are islamic jihadist and muslim terrorist in Burama.
Your observation is spot on toch. As a race they do feel they are guilty if/ and only if they get caught. To be fair, this time caught not by the ancestors but by the law.
Now in Burma, you will see that such lovely morality is going to be foundation stone of the New Society. Do whatever you can/ want for personal gain and money. Don’t get caught because it is sinful to get caught.
By the way what is Plato? Immigration officer or regional military commander?
I always have trouble explaining why plagiarism and copying is the same as cheating and stealing to a lot of students from mainland China (tons of them where I work). They tend to think that if you don’t get caught ( by your dead ancestors?), cheating (or breaking traffic rules and tax laws, for that matter) is perfectly ok. At first, I thought, it’s just the language barrier (why do students from Confucian cultures have so much trouble learning English or even basic Aristotelian logic. Another “research topic”?) It might all be a big multi-cultural “confuscion”. Analects, syllogisms, Plato and all that!
As cliché goes, change is the only constant. Religion/ tradition is subject to community more.
Even in Theravada redoubts, Burma and Sri Lanka, currently prevailing popular practice is unrecognizable from only a couple of generations ago. Beating up and killing in most cruel way in daylight and destroying properties of Kalars (in both SHAMELESS countries) is not only committed, but encouraged by a sizable majority so much so that the “moderates” dare not come out.
The problem with multi-culturalism and fundamentalism result from the common source of both. Multi-culturalism has become an issue only after communal association and identification is not ascribed or pre-given, but based on individual choice, what Sartre referred to as “condemned to freedom”. This means that a person is forced to choose what to identify with, and that communities to identify with exist. In other words, multi-culturalism is an integral aspect of modernity. Fundamentalism be it nationalist, ethnic, religious, political (including market-fundamentalism) is basically a response as an attempt of communities to demand identification, what always implies a loss of freedom for the person. Thus, fundamentalism only works in multi-cultural societies! The close linkage between fundamentalism and modernity is indicated already by fundamentalist, traditionalist groups to rapidly embrace modernity in terms of technologies (instrumental action) for their social integration. Thus, the realization of fundamentalist visions of a future implies its own dissolution. An example is Iran, where they established an “Islamic Republic”, what is a contradiction in itself. Fundamentalists have a political not a religious or whatever agenda, and use fundamentalist ideologies for their political ends! Here what C. Taylor discusses as “politics of recognition” or “liberalism II” is relevant. It refers to the recognition of communities because only if these exist, freedom of choice can be realized. For him recognition requires an open discourse or “public sphere” in which recognition is institutionalized as mutual acceptance. Politics of fundamentalism use a public sphere, usually by applying the latest technical gadgets to enhance their own position (special rights) against others. In other words, their political agenda can only work in a multi-cultural setting. Thus, it can hardly be discussed in terms of religion, ethnicity etc. but in terms of strategies to enhance political and economic power.
I think this angle provides a perspective for the analysis of fundamentalist groups in Malaysia as well as Thailand (Thainess and all what is defined as belonging to it as fundamentalism).
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Myanmar Special Economic Zones, Part II
argumentum ad hominem
Hope, cynicism and Jokowi in a Jakarta slum
I’m amazed that the Indonesian government are this day 5/1/2015 that they now want trade agreements with Australia and yet they still chuck there rubbish in streets around the capital Jakata and have it picked up by the poor ==get your act together first Help The Poor !!!
Myanmar Special Economic Zones, Part II
Neither China run by a Dalai Lama nor the Burmese are the slave type. Like you, they just whine too much but unlike you, they don’t spread rumors and disinformation.
Gangsta to the roots: A Gangsta’s paradise
Interesting analysis. A great deal of this is relevant to the situation in thailand where the current junta is launching its own version of illusory democracy
Myanmar Special Economic Zones, Part II
So everything is for the benefit of the greedy Chinese, as I’ve always said. What about the people of Burma? Will they become Chinese slaves just like the Tibetans and the Uyghurs?
Myanmar Special Economic Zones, Part II
For China no rail no Kyaukphyu, is that simple.
A port in this area has no benefit for China what soever unless a rail is built from Kunming. If a rail can carry Chinese shipping containers down this route, the the sky’s the limit Myanmar. We’ll guarantee the SEZ will have more than just port businesses.
This is business, nothing personal.
Review of Red Stamps and Gold Stars
Thanks for a really insightful review
I was really excited to come across this book in mid 2014, not least because I am in the category the reviewer identifies as one for whom the book will be useful. I am a doctoral student, heading to do fieldwork in South East Asia in mid 2015.
That said, my first reaction on reading this book was a something of a sense of despair. I wondered how, if those more experienced and better qualified than me had been through what can surely be described as difficult experiences, then how would I ever manage to do anything meaningful in the field at all? But that is where the book is such a useful resource. I would definitely have found this helpful reading as a master student in respect of thinking through what I need to consider, and the challenges that those seeking to do research in South East Asia may face. One point the contributors brought out to me was that of how even obstacles and challenges tell us something useful. That may sound very obvious, but I found it demonstrated very clearly in the contributions here.
Overall, a very useful book and one to return to throughout the research process
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
Burma a “peaceful buddhist community”. Is that a joke?There are tens of thousands of ethnic insurgent groups (Wa, Shan, Karen, Karen, Chin, Palaung, …) fighting the central government ever since Burma’s independence 67 years ago today. Some of the ethnics, such as the Karen, Kachin and Chin are also not Buddhists. U Nu tried to make Buddhism the State religion. It didn’t work, so what now? I know that there is a surge of “protectionist, xenophobic, nationalistic” style of Buddhism spreading around in Burma, and monks are involved. 969, mabatha, interreligious marriage laws, buddha figure with headphones and all that rubbish. If a Buddhist monk would follow the exact 227 bikkhu precepts then he shouldn’t be involved in politics at all. That’s not what a venerable Buddhist monk should be doing, but Buddhism is no longer what it used to be. I am not saying Muslims are better. ISIS is definitely a lot worse.
I personally believe that religion is an obsolete piece of evolutionary junk that humans should get rid off, but I am in the minority, i guess.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
It would be so simple only if half of what is written were half true. But at the very least people called Rohingya are neither illegal nor immigrants. Left to their own devices, not danger either in much of the history. And most of all there is no evidence that they are jihadists or terrorists.
For deportation, no one would take them, either screaming sonni countries like Saudi, Pakistan or trying hard to be moderate when it suits, Malaysia.
Only solution seems to be people on the ground realizing how they are abused, manipulated and used as pawns by their own leaders- on both sides, for their own gain, spawning immense “Human Rights Industry” and champions and companies with financial interest in the region they reside.
So long as they sing to the tune of all these outsiders -including their own diaspora-, and opportunists, lives will continue to be barely worthwhile living for all the inhabitants.
The changing face of Xanana Gusmao
Re the struggle between Islam and Catholicism in E.Timor.
Yes, there were localised struggles.
Most of E.Timor’s Muslims were from Manufahi and from the East. Indigenous, not Yemenis from Indonesia like the Algadri [Alkatiri] clan, who had migrated from Sana’a to Pontianak, thence to Ternate and Ende where they traded horses, guns and slaves.
A Catholic Catechist in Daisua, Manufahi, was so sick of being slapped around by the late mestico priest Rafael Dos Santos that when TNI arrived he converted to Islam and took the name Hanafi Martins. He converted his whole village and the religion spread to Simpang Tiga. Dos Santos, a fanatic UDT supporter, had been captured by Fretilin and buried, to be killed. He survived thanks to TNI. He later led the resistance to Islam in Manufahi, continuing his private feud with Martins. Dos Santos used Catholic youth to found Colimau 2000, a millenialist cult which had grown from the ‘vision’ of Vital, a nutjob from Taitudak, Alas, who announced 10 new commandments and prophesied that E.Timor would become independent in 2000, but as a precondition he would have to die.
It wasn’t exactly what the Pope called for, but it was good enough for Rafael, who had a group of Catholic youth champing to join Falintil but were forbidden by parents and Church, because it was Communist. Rafael sooled them onto leading pro integrationists from Same, a couple of whom were Muslim and had wanted to exploit a Teak plantation. Using the issues of Teak and Islam, Rafael would form a private resistance army, all Catholic. He had some Indonesian Catholic allies.
Colimau, however, didn’t really take off farther than Same until Vital went to the big jerigen of tua muti in the sky thus fulfilling his prophesy. Colimau was always an underbouw of the Church and those interested in the 2006-7 civil war will find it useful to remember this. Even more useful to trace the antecedents of the late unlamented Millenium Party, which began the East-West provocations in Maliana. They killed a bullock for a pesta rakyat but had to delay proceedings while waiting for their spanduks to arrive, in a suitcase from Indonesia. Then it was on.
Hanafi’s Muslims were transmigrated to Malili and Mamuju in Sulawesi, with the guidance of Agus Dwikarna, the AQ boss. Colimau in Same wanted to burn down the Mosque and protested the presence of Jordanian UNPOL, but the Australian Administrator, unaware of the local history and determined to make Jordan welcome in UN missions, banned them from participation in local politics. In reply they held UN cars ‘hostage’ then went to Suai and did the same. The UN had made a new enemy and Timor would come to regret it.
Another high profile symptom of Islam’s development was the efforts of Mari’s brother, the abominable Ahmed Alkatiri, a Pemuda Pancasila leader in Dili who invited ICMI to commission an office on land owned by indigenous Timorese. They promptly attacked and he lost a digit to a well aimed parang. A reporter from the STT covered the story so Alkatiri and his PP thuglets trashed the paper’s office and computers, and beat up the journo. Ahmed fled to Jakarta and told a heap of porkies to our Post to get a visa and seek asylum, claiming the Indons were after him. Of course, they weren’t, the Timorese were.
To those seeking to defend the ‘enlightened’ Portuguese – I forgive you. But, just in case you haven’t learned your lesson, say the Rosary til Easter.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
I am sorry Manhar, you have your beliefs but I, and many others no doubt, more would see them as ignorant and racist. Jihadist Muslims in Burma would be rare, and you, like other seemingly aggressive (not peaceful) Buddhists are inflaming the situation. In southern Thailand Buddhists and Muslims lived alongside each other in harmony since borders were demarcated, with only politics and outside aggression causing the rifts leading to conflict. I am sure it is the same in Burma. You make it worse by confusing religion, migration, territoriliasm and ethnicity. It is a complex picture and will not become clearer through simplistic analysis and aggressive language and actions.
Rethinking Cambodia’s political transformation
While thinking of many factors, a campaign slogan “Change or no change, change/do min, do” should be also taken into account. Everywhere from the city to rural area, from government institutions to garment factories, from old people to 5-6 year-old children, they were chanting this simple and appealing slogan.
In search of Saman
Lovely piece. Great description with a reflection connecting the Saman dance and its present popularity to J. Siegel’s 1960s-ethnography. I just wonder whether may be part of Aceh’s post-conflict inward looking trend of consciousness.
Review of Kingdom in Crisis
Shouldn’t “everyone” automatically include “friends of Thailand at New Mandela”?
I am used to Aristotelian syllogisms!
Review of Kingdom in Crisis
His Majesty the King wishes everyone (including friends of Thailand at New Mandala) a Happy New year and hopes they have perseverance, wisdom and good health in the royal New Year’s greeting card released by the palace Wednesday (Dec 31/2014)
link:http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/453442/king-sends-2015-new-year-greetings. http://goo.gl/ou6Ip. ┬й Post Publishing PCL. All rights reserved.
Rohingya and national identities in Burma
Burma does not need to take care of these illigal immigrants cos they are danger for peaceful buddhist community so they should be deport form Burma. Burma is budhist country they are islamic jihadist and muslim terrorist in Burama.
Multi-culturalism: the flipside of fundamentalism?
@ #9.1.1.1.1
Your observation is spot on toch. As a race they do feel they are guilty if/ and only if they get caught. To be fair, this time caught not by the ancestors but by the law.
Now in Burma, you will see that such lovely morality is going to be foundation stone of the New Society. Do whatever you can/ want for personal gain and money. Don’t get caught because it is sinful to get caught.
By the way what is Plato? Immigration officer or regional military commander?
Multi-culturalism: the flipside of fundamentalism?
I always have trouble explaining why plagiarism and copying is the same as cheating and stealing to a lot of students from mainland China (tons of them where I work). They tend to think that if you don’t get caught ( by your dead ancestors?), cheating (or breaking traffic rules and tax laws, for that matter) is perfectly ok. At first, I thought, it’s just the language barrier (why do students from Confucian cultures have so much trouble learning English or even basic Aristotelian logic. Another “research topic”?) It might all be a big multi-cultural “confuscion”. Analects, syllogisms, Plato and all that!
Multi-culturalism: the flipside of fundamentalism?
As cliché goes, change is the only constant. Religion/ tradition is subject to community more.
Even in Theravada redoubts, Burma and Sri Lanka, currently prevailing popular practice is unrecognizable from only a couple of generations ago. Beating up and killing in most cruel way in daylight and destroying properties of Kalars (in both SHAMELESS countries) is not only committed, but encouraged by a sizable majority so much so that the “moderates” dare not come out.
So much for embracing “fundamentalists”.
Multi-culturalism: the flipside of fundamentalism?
The problem with multi-culturalism and fundamentalism result from the common source of both. Multi-culturalism has become an issue only after communal association and identification is not ascribed or pre-given, but based on individual choice, what Sartre referred to as “condemned to freedom”. This means that a person is forced to choose what to identify with, and that communities to identify with exist. In other words, multi-culturalism is an integral aspect of modernity. Fundamentalism be it nationalist, ethnic, religious, political (including market-fundamentalism) is basically a response as an attempt of communities to demand identification, what always implies a loss of freedom for the person. Thus, fundamentalism only works in multi-cultural societies! The close linkage between fundamentalism and modernity is indicated already by fundamentalist, traditionalist groups to rapidly embrace modernity in terms of technologies (instrumental action) for their social integration. Thus, the realization of fundamentalist visions of a future implies its own dissolution. An example is Iran, where they established an “Islamic Republic”, what is a contradiction in itself. Fundamentalists have a political not a religious or whatever agenda, and use fundamentalist ideologies for their political ends! Here what C. Taylor discusses as “politics of recognition” or “liberalism II” is relevant. It refers to the recognition of communities because only if these exist, freedom of choice can be realized. For him recognition requires an open discourse or “public sphere” in which recognition is institutionalized as mutual acceptance. Politics of fundamentalism use a public sphere, usually by applying the latest technical gadgets to enhance their own position (special rights) against others. In other words, their political agenda can only work in a multi-cultural setting. Thus, it can hardly be discussed in terms of religion, ethnicity etc. but in terms of strategies to enhance political and economic power.
I think this angle provides a perspective for the analysis of fundamentalist groups in Malaysia as well as Thailand (Thainess and all what is defined as belonging to it as fundamentalism).