These comments are meant to be another Reply to the Chinese Rail Link comments on the published article “Lao Development on Track”, New Mandala, May 5th, 2010.
The referenced article stated that (1) the “‘Chinatown’ development near That Luang was condemned by some as treasonous, . . . . but continues to bubble along”. And (2) “opposition to the development did demonstrate public sensitivity to Chinese investment, to the extent that the proposal sparked quite unprecedented popular opposition among those that stood to lose through such investment”. Both of these statements should be revalued. Firstly, the trading of the That Luang wetlands in return for the Chinese gift to build the sport facilities for the SEA Games of December 2009 was a political decision which bypassed many impacted government organizations and existing Lao regulations. The reactions by many individuals were not just based on “who stood to lose”. Danida and JICA had spent considerable sums to manage the wetlands for their ecological services as well as flood control and wastewater management purposes. The decision to give the “green light” to the proposed Chinese investment without a proper social and environmental impact assessment bypassed the Lao EIA Regulation and created considerable opposition within The Prime Minister’s Office as well as finding opposition from hundreds of project affected persons. The opposition might be considered “unprecedented” also became it came from a wide group of stakeholders objecting to a decision by a high ranking officer without regards to the law, in this case environmental law (both the Environmental Protection Law (1999) and the EIA Regulation of STEA (now WREA) (2002) which were bypassed by the decision. These laws require the project developer to cover all environmental impacts, similar to the “polluter-pays-principle” and the proposed Chinese commercial project had clearly overlooked such details. A significant environmental and social impact study was needed for the “Chinatown” development near That Luang and this was completely bypassed.
So the same question must be asked for the proposed Chinese railway across Laos. The time schedule (yet to be noted in the article) should be modified to include public involvement meetings, in which various stakeholders can voice their opinions and cast their objections to railway links which cross or impact cultural, physical or ecological sites considered as “valued environmental components” (sites which are sacred, unique or of significant ecological value to stakeholders) and therefore options to the proposed railway route must be studied before approval by the government can be granted. This is a long and detailed process for such a far reaching project. It will be interesting to see if the Lao follow the law on this proposed investment (requiring that an ESIA, EMP, and SDP be completed, reviewed, and approved as part of the project’s development cost) before government approval is granted to the ambitious project.
Submitted by
Richard J. Frankel, Ph.D.
International EIA Specialist (part-time consultant to the SEM II Project, WREA)
Adjunct Professor
Natural Resources & Environmental Management Center
Mae Fah Luang University, Chiang Rai, Thailand
[…] Vocab traces the term back to one of my 2006 posts where I wrote (much to the dismay of some of the New Mandala commentariat): Not only are rural […]
This is an excellent paper and discussion From the perspective of a non-academic fahlang around Thailand for a long time, including village and Bangkok, a few random observations on the local scene:
-most of the reds in BKK protest are more affable than the regular residents, but many drink and party a lot in the manner of college kids
-the occupied zones are clean and well organized and morale is high, I think most feel rather empowered by the whole scene. Life for most of them in BKK protest is more comfortable and exciting than back home and most consider the protest payments a great benefit
-some of the blackshirt guards of the redshirts are polite to fahlang but some are pretty tough and one has to believe that they come from rural mafias of various kinds
-most villagers from red areas consider it normal to sell their votes for about $20 each and are not particularly ashamed at this
-longtime residents of BKK including maids and low service people from NE often express horror at rural life. Especially true of women
-expressions of most middle class Thai on the street at sight of cheerful parading protesters is usually horror, fear, disgust
-the protest areas are in some cultural respects a big improvement over jams of expensive cars and import luxury stores
-the Thai in general have not learned to laugh at conspicuous consumption
-the redshirts seem to this observer to be perceived here in much the same way as American blacks in the 50s and 60s
-Anderson’s 1977 paper “Withdrawal Symptoms” has some dated lefty views but also many ideas that illuminate the radical bifurcations that seem to characterize Thai society
I am a Red Shirt.
I am English is not good.
Hana is Yellow Shirt!
Yellow Shirt is love Revolution Military.
Yellow Shirt is love Constitution by Military(2007).
Yellow Shirt is Influence to Abhisit.
The Leader of Yellow Shirt has not ever to benefits with Thailand,And them has lose benefits from Thaksin Government’s.
Updater – Im aware of the apology that has been issued later on, my point of bringing it up was not to prove that the police didnt get the treatment they deserve, but that Chula hospital was trying to play politic against the UDD, such as moving the patient just because of a dozen of red want to search the hospital for soldiers. The hospital in Sarajevo never move their patient even when the whole city is a war zone.
[…] the undemocratic clauses of the 2008 Constitution on which the 2010 election is based, it will essentially allow a pseudo-civilian government to be […]
I think you’ll find M.L. Sukumbhand, BKK Governor for instance has been involved in negotiations. Does a governor trump a Prime Minister? Does an ML trump a Vejajiwa?
I don’t know how to play the Sakdina card game. Either way he’s a significant and much respected individual.
Is he “somebody higher up”?? That would depend on who you asked I guess!
“Details of protesters and their photos would be recorded before they would be allowed to leave for home, the source said. Troops with the Internal Security Operations Command in all provinces would later be sent to talk to them.”
Given what happened on April 10, troops from the Internal Security Operations Command are guarranteed to be killed
if they enter Red provinces.
I’m surprised there has n’t been any discussion here of who
the highly “significant person” is, who is credited with brokering this deal.
And of what he / she may be up to ?
We can be certain the “significant person” is most likely somebody higher than Abhisit.
No matter what color they are… their idea of thinking at the end are the same which is to have a better future for Thailand. Even the red shirts out there, I’m sure none of them want to destroy their own country or , red yellow any colors they just have different ideas and opinions in what needs to be done to te country.So here is the question….What is needed to be done to fix this ideas and opinions problem?I’m a Thai person and I do admit that the media here do cover up a lot of story and is being control. There are many opioions talking on the TV show give people different point of view of information creating people to believe differently. Not only that but many international websites are also blocked. It is hard for Thai people to find out what is really going on and what the truth really is.And I do believe that “Double standard” do really exsit here in the country, With this “Double standard” there will never be a true justice and, a country with out true justice will never find peace.
+1
As a total outsider, my perspective is from revolutionary groups in Latin America. during the 1960-1975, that continent was in a similar uproar as leftist of various stripes tried to take over. Cuba, particularly in the image of the Christ like Che, was the leader.
The unemployed and especially the educated underemployed were the main force. The “Reds” never got to their annonced core, the mestizos, blacks and indians. The latter in particular had evloved a welfare family tribe net that trounced socialist moves.
At present, it is still evolving, but in a unique way. -Bostonirish
The South Koreans best not go there during the rainy season – when that area is a total wash-out.
I met some very unhappy backpackers second time I was in that area – you guessed it : during rainy season.
Since Enrico Damanche has let the proverbial crouching tiger out of the bottle, maybe this is not the wrong thread to recommend an article to New Mandalaland readers:
The column gathers up what can only be understood as remarkably prescient observations made by Leon Trotsky almost a century ago. One interesting example:
“One trend that Trotsky identified was the use of ‘conspiracy’ as one of the prime accusations made by the ruling class – consciously or not – in their attempts to demobilise the masses at a time of insurrection. Members of the elite are unable to understand through their ‘police mind’ that periods of rapid change stem, not from ‘the activities of ‘demagogues,’ but from the precise opposite – the ‘deep conservatism’ of the masses, whose views lag chronically ‘behind new objective conditions’.”
If military intelligence is that inept, it helps explain why, despite Seh Daeng’s overt threats of waging war and the not so mock appointment of Chavalit as commander-in-chief of the “People’s Army”, they were blissfully unaware that the militant red shirts had stockpiled heavy weapons that they were willing to use against the army, property and the general population. Or perhaps they are just taking the piss to show what they think of their orders.
When all is said and done, Thailand’s long political crisis from 2006 to 2010 (and beyond!) clearly illustrates that the proverbial genie is out of the bottle regarding the mobilization of the Thai masses and its attendant challenge of the status quo. Yes, an emerging new ruling (moneyed) elite is on the rise. Still, what captivates me more than anything else about this Siamese street theater is that unknowingly a tiger has been unleashed upon the stage and now we wait and see as to what it will do next. It roars and we tremble. It paces and we stand motionless. It crouches and we anticipate an attack. We view the animal with a strange mixture of awe and fear. How can it be pacified? Who will have the temerity and the ability to tame it? When will it return to its cage?
A tiger can be captured in the wild and trained to perform tricks in a circus for our collective amusement, but it nevertheless is a powerful creature that can turn on its “master”. We have ignored its presence for far too long and now we are getting a glimpse of its might.
A nice parody between French and Chinese interest in Laos, very much on track by reference to the beautiful little puffer engine. It is at the present time noted that the French built seven kilometres of track on the southern islands, which is twice that of the current Lao-Thai-Chinese operation. It may also be of interest to note that South Korea will finance restoration of the original French track, using working repro locomotives. This is part of their tourist interests in the Four Thousand Islands and will add to their plans to build a large hotel, golf course and possibly a casino in the area.
It is only when we walk in the footsteps of others that we are truly walking, for only then can we see the true path before us and not just the narrow view we walk in our day-to-day lives.
Dr. Apisit, Abbott of Wat Sri Boen Ruang, embraced this philosophy in endorsing the monk for a month program.
Young novices and participants alike gain new perspectives on culture, spirituality, harmony and respect. And the monastery gains much-needed support for its school
and other programs.
A win-win situation made possible by the monk for a month program.
Some have questioned the charges for the program as Buddhist teachings are supposed to be free While this may be true, the cost of providing meals learning materials and accommodation Is more than the monastery can afford.
All I can do is relate my personal experience, and explain why I see the monk for a month program as valuable in a troubled world.
One of the greatest threats to humanity is many people’s belief in their own righteousness.
They believe that their tradition is the ultimate truth, therefore dismissing other points of view, blindly trusting in their way of life and religious outlook, often unwilling or unable to consider change, or entertain the possibility that they may not have all the answers.
And as they think they have the ultimate truth, anything others may have to offer would lead to damnation.
I on the other hand dare to walk in the footsteps of others, I dare to question the self, and in so doing I’ve gained a deeper awareness and understanding of my own knowing.
This allows me to embrace the reality of other paths while remaining true to the self.
The monk for a month program does not seek to convert, proselytise or enlighten; it seeks to broaden your horizons, show the possibilities and help you on your spiritual journey.
And from my perspective it does this extremely well.
You will only get out of the program what you are willing to put in, if you embrace the possibilities,
I am sure you will come away with a deeper perspective and understanding
of the Thai Sangha and their unique way of life.
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Why King Vajiralongkorn will be good for Thai Democracy
If Thaksin got back into power I wonder, given his comments, how he would attempt to position the monarchy and himself in relation to it.
Lao development on track?
These comments are meant to be another Reply to the Chinese Rail Link comments on the published article “Lao Development on Track”, New Mandala, May 5th, 2010.
The referenced article stated that (1) the “‘Chinatown’ development near That Luang was condemned by some as treasonous, . . . . but continues to bubble along”. And (2) “opposition to the development did demonstrate public sensitivity to Chinese investment, to the extent that the proposal sparked quite unprecedented popular opposition among those that stood to lose through such investment”. Both of these statements should be revalued. Firstly, the trading of the That Luang wetlands in return for the Chinese gift to build the sport facilities for the SEA Games of December 2009 was a political decision which bypassed many impacted government organizations and existing Lao regulations. The reactions by many individuals were not just based on “who stood to lose”. Danida and JICA had spent considerable sums to manage the wetlands for their ecological services as well as flood control and wastewater management purposes. The decision to give the “green light” to the proposed Chinese investment without a proper social and environmental impact assessment bypassed the Lao EIA Regulation and created considerable opposition within The Prime Minister’s Office as well as finding opposition from hundreds of project affected persons. The opposition might be considered “unprecedented” also became it came from a wide group of stakeholders objecting to a decision by a high ranking officer without regards to the law, in this case environmental law (both the Environmental Protection Law (1999) and the EIA Regulation of STEA (now WREA) (2002) which were bypassed by the decision. These laws require the project developer to cover all environmental impacts, similar to the “polluter-pays-principle” and the proposed Chinese commercial project had clearly overlooked such details. A significant environmental and social impact study was needed for the “Chinatown” development near That Luang and this was completely bypassed.
So the same question must be asked for the proposed Chinese railway across Laos. The time schedule (yet to be noted in the article) should be modified to include public involvement meetings, in which various stakeholders can voice their opinions and cast their objections to railway links which cross or impact cultural, physical or ecological sites considered as “valued environmental components” (sites which are sacred, unique or of significant ecological value to stakeholders) and therefore options to the proposed railway route must be studied before approval by the government can be granted. This is a long and detailed process for such a far reaching project. It will be interesting to see if the Lao follow the law on this proposed investment (requiring that an ESIA, EMP, and SDP be completed, reviewed, and approved as part of the project’s development cost) before government approval is granted to the ambitious project.
Submitted by
Richard J. Frankel, Ph.D.
International EIA Specialist (part-time consultant to the SEM II Project, WREA)
Adjunct Professor
Natural Resources & Environmental Management Center
Mae Fah Luang University, Chiang Rai, Thailand
Sufficiency democracy
[…] Vocab traces the term back to one of my 2006 posts where I wrote (much to the dismay of some of the New Mandala commentariat): Not only are rural […]
Thongchai Winichakul on the Red “germs”
This is an excellent paper and discussion From the perspective of a non-academic fahlang around Thailand for a long time, including village and Bangkok, a few random observations on the local scene:
-most of the reds in BKK protest are more affable than the regular residents, but many drink and party a lot in the manner of college kids
-the occupied zones are clean and well organized and morale is high, I think most feel rather empowered by the whole scene. Life for most of them in BKK protest is more comfortable and exciting than back home and most consider the protest payments a great benefit
-some of the blackshirt guards of the redshirts are polite to fahlang but some are pretty tough and one has to believe that they come from rural mafias of various kinds
-most villagers from red areas consider it normal to sell their votes for about $20 each and are not particularly ashamed at this
-longtime residents of BKK including maids and low service people from NE often express horror at rural life. Especially true of women
-expressions of most middle class Thai on the street at sight of cheerful parading protesters is usually horror, fear, disgust
-the protest areas are in some cultural respects a big improvement over jams of expensive cars and import luxury stores
-the Thai in general have not learned to laugh at conspicuous consumption
-the redshirts seem to this observer to be perceived here in much the same way as American blacks in the 50s and 60s
-Anderson’s 1977 paper “Withdrawal Symptoms” has some dated lefty views but also many ideas that illuminate the radical bifurcations that seem to characterize Thai society
Video of Thailand on the Verge
I am a Red Shirt.
I am English is not good.
Hana is Yellow Shirt!
Yellow Shirt is love Revolution Military.
Yellow Shirt is love Constitution by Military(2007).
Yellow Shirt is Influence to Abhisit.
The Leader of Yellow Shirt has not ever to benefits with Thailand,And them has lose benefits from Thaksin Government’s.
Lao explorers reach Vietnam on Italian Scooters
Nice Info. I’m gonna get a Vespa scooter. I ride around by myself most of the time anyway, mine as well get good mileage.
Chulalongkorn Hospital – an alternative account
Updater – Im aware of the apology that has been issued later on, my point of bringing it up was not to prove that the police didnt get the treatment they deserve, but that Chula hospital was trying to play politic against the UDD, such as moving the patient just because of a dozen of red want to search the hospital for soldiers. The hospital in Sarajevo never move their patient even when the whole city is a war zone.
Burma’s 2008 Constitution in translation
[…] the undemocratic clauses of the 2008 Constitution on which the 2010 election is based, it will essentially allow a pseudo-civilian government to be […]
Abhisit’s offer
I think you’ll find M.L. Sukumbhand, BKK Governor for instance has been involved in negotiations. Does a governor trump a Prime Minister? Does an ML trump a Vejajiwa?
I don’t know how to play the Sakdina card game. Either way he’s a significant and much respected individual.
Is he “somebody higher up”?? That would depend on who you asked I guess!
Thai military intelligence in action
John Francis Lee@9 :
“Details of protesters and their photos would be recorded before they would be allowed to leave for home, the source said. Troops with the Internal Security Operations Command in all provinces would later be sent to talk to them.”
Given what happened on April 10, troops from the Internal Security Operations Command are guarranteed to be killed
if they enter Red provinces.
Abhisit’s offer
I’m surprised there has n’t been any discussion here of who
the highly “significant person” is, who is credited with brokering this deal.
And of what he / she may be up to ?
We can be certain the “significant person” is most likely somebody higher than Abhisit.
Video of Thailand on the Verge
No matter what color they are… their idea of thinking at the end are the same which is to have a better future for Thailand. Even the red shirts out there, I’m sure none of them want to destroy their own country or , red yellow any colors they just have different ideas and opinions in what needs to be done to te country.So here is the question….What is needed to be done to fix this ideas and opinions problem?I’m a Thai person and I do admit that the media here do cover up a lot of story and is being control. There are many opioions talking on the TV show give people different point of view of information creating people to believe differently. Not only that but many international websites are also blocked. It is hard for Thai people to find out what is really going on and what the truth really is.And I do believe that “Double standard” do really exsit here in the country, With this “Double standard” there will never be a true justice and, a country with out true justice will never find peace.
+1
Thongchai Winichakul on the Red “germs”
As a total outsider, my perspective is from revolutionary groups in Latin America. during the 1960-1975, that continent was in a similar uproar as leftist of various stripes tried to take over. Cuba, particularly in the image of the Christ like Che, was the leader.
The unemployed and especially the educated underemployed were the main force. The “Reds” never got to their annonced core, the mestizos, blacks and indians. The latter in particular had evloved a welfare family tribe net that trounced socialist moves.
At present, it is still evolving, but in a unique way. -Bostonirish
Lao development on track?
The South Koreans best not go there during the rainy season – when that area is a total wash-out.
I met some very unhappy backpackers second time I was in that area – you guessed it : during rainy season.
Thongchai Winichakul on the Red “germs”
Since Enrico Damanche has let the proverbial crouching tiger out of the bottle, maybe this is not the wrong thread to recommend an article to New Mandalaland readers:
” On Thailand, what would Trotsky say?” http://www.spiked-online.com/index.php/site/article/8793/
The column gathers up what can only be understood as remarkably prescient observations made by Leon Trotsky almost a century ago. One interesting example:
“One trend that Trotsky identified was the use of ‘conspiracy’ as one of the prime accusations made by the ruling class – consciously or not – in their attempts to demobilise the masses at a time of insurrection. Members of the elite are unable to understand through their ‘police mind’ that periods of rapid change stem, not from ‘the activities of ‘demagogues,’ but from the precise opposite – the ‘deep conservatism’ of the masses, whose views lag chronically ‘behind new objective conditions’.”
Thai military intelligence in action
If military intelligence is that inept, it helps explain why, despite Seh Daeng’s overt threats of waging war and the not so mock appointment of Chavalit as commander-in-chief of the “People’s Army”, they were blissfully unaware that the militant red shirts had stockpiled heavy weapons that they were willing to use against the army, property and the general population. Or perhaps they are just taking the piss to show what they think of their orders.
Thongchai Winichakul on the Red “germs”
When all is said and done, Thailand’s long political crisis from 2006 to 2010 (and beyond!) clearly illustrates that the proverbial genie is out of the bottle regarding the mobilization of the Thai masses and its attendant challenge of the status quo. Yes, an emerging new ruling (moneyed) elite is on the rise. Still, what captivates me more than anything else about this Siamese street theater is that unknowingly a tiger has been unleashed upon the stage and now we wait and see as to what it will do next. It roars and we tremble. It paces and we stand motionless. It crouches and we anticipate an attack. We view the animal with a strange mixture of awe and fear. How can it be pacified? Who will have the temerity and the ability to tame it? When will it return to its cage?
A tiger can be captured in the wild and trained to perform tricks in a circus for our collective amusement, but it nevertheless is a powerful creature that can turn on its “master”. We have ignored its presence for far too long and now we are getting a glimpse of its might.
Lao development on track?
A nice parody between French and Chinese interest in Laos, very much on track by reference to the beautiful little puffer engine. It is at the present time noted that the French built seven kilometres of track on the southern islands, which is twice that of the current Lao-Thai-Chinese operation. It may also be of interest to note that South Korea will finance restoration of the original French track, using working repro locomotives. This is part of their tourist interests in the Four Thousand Islands and will add to their plans to build a large hotel, golf course and possibly a casino in the area.
Mixing religion and commerce: The Monk for a Month Program in Fang, Chiang Mai
The monk for a month program.
It is only when we walk in the footsteps of others that we are truly walking, for only then can we see the true path before us and not just the narrow view we walk in our day-to-day lives.
Dr. Apisit, Abbott of Wat Sri Boen Ruang, embraced this philosophy in endorsing the monk for a month program.
Young novices and participants alike gain new perspectives on culture, spirituality, harmony and respect. And the monastery gains much-needed support for its school
and other programs.
A win-win situation made possible by the monk for a month program.
Some have questioned the charges for the program as Buddhist teachings are supposed to be free While this may be true, the cost of providing meals learning materials and accommodation Is more than the monastery can afford.
All I can do is relate my personal experience, and explain why I see the monk for a month program as valuable in a troubled world.
One of the greatest threats to humanity is many people’s belief in their own righteousness.
They believe that their tradition is the ultimate truth, therefore dismissing other points of view, blindly trusting in their way of life and religious outlook, often unwilling or unable to consider change, or entertain the possibility that they may not have all the answers.
And as they think they have the ultimate truth, anything others may have to offer would lead to damnation.
I on the other hand dare to walk in the footsteps of others, I dare to question the self, and in so doing I’ve gained a deeper awareness and understanding of my own knowing.
This allows me to embrace the reality of other paths while remaining true to the self.
The monk for a month program does not seek to convert, proselytise or enlighten; it seeks to broaden your horizons, show the possibilities and help you on your spiritual journey.
And from my perspective it does this extremely well.
You will only get out of the program what you are willing to put in, if you embrace the possibilities,
I am sure you will come away with a deeper perspective and understanding
of the Thai Sangha and their unique way of life.
Peter Forell the 14th of the sixth 2009 ┬й
Thongchai Winichakul on the Red “germs”
[…] : р╣Ар╕зр╣Зр╕Ър╣Др╕Лр╕Хр╣Мр╕Ыр╕гр╕░р╕Кр╕▓р╣Др╕Ч р╣Бр╕Ыр╕ер╕Ир╕▓р╕Б: р╣Ар╕зр╣Зр╕Ър╣Др╕Лр╕Хр╣Мр╕Щр╕зр╕бр╕Ур╕Ср╕е, 3 р╕Ю.р╕Д. […]