Re the effectiveness of a duffer with a golf club. How do you reckon it does against a grenade coming in from an m79 at 76 meters/second?
From the record, it doesn’t appear the PAD had the quality of golfer needed to accomplish that task.
Not even including the injuries and death caused by the bumbling police/tear gas incident, the strong preponderance of injuries and deaths were suffered by, rather than caused by, the PAD.
In context, the PAD can be characterized as a “fairly non-violent” or “relatively non-violent” movement, and “very violent” is inaccurate.
That last comment is like saying why does it matter what zoologists think of reptilian behavior because they are not actually reptiles themselves.
This is a forum for the discussion of , in this case, Thai politics. What should we discuss, if not Thai poltics?
My wife and children are Thai citizens and I live in the country so it directly concerns me in regard to both my daily life and the future of my children.
My opinion is that if they were paid 750 baht they would think it a great opportunity to be disenfranchised. Which is exactly what the Phantumitr is proposing- abolishing votng rights for the rural poor because they cannot make choices for themselves, many of whom were sitting in Suwannabhumi airport holding brightly colored noisemakers and drinking Fanta from plastic bags for 750 baht because the rich Chinese businessmen who don’t want to lose hold of their power were upset by the third consecutive electoral victory of a new guard of rich Chinese businessmen.
If you consider vote-buying and disruption of international transportation systems to be in violation of some “arbitrary Western standard” and not a universal infringement of democracy, perhaps we need to define terms before this discussion continues.
If your father, Charles Foster, Sr., were alive today, what would he say about your comments and behavior? He never tolerated crap like that. He was Thomas Bleming’s friend. He helped him fight for others in the cause of freedom. He would take you to the woodshed and spank your butt for what you said. You have never been anywhere or done anything your own life, but you feel the need to attack others like Thomas Bleming who have, who is leading the way for others to follow. Thank God for good men like Thomas Bleming, risking his life, to draw attention to the cause of freedom for the Burmese people. You should apologize and help, not hinder, Thomas Bleming in his efforts seeking a free Burma.
Dear Charles,
I’m sorry that it came to this.
I have never met you, but hope to one day.
God bless, we keep working to defend others less privileged.
Dan
You’re right. The Udon incident should have been mentioned. And many others. But the “thesis” of the piece was that PAD was a very violent departure from a non-violent culture of protest in the past. Mentioning the Udon incident would not change that observation. Many past demonstrations have been attacked far more viciously than the PAD in Udon but the reaction was not the same.
It seems to me that there is a small group of hardcore freedom fighters here focused on ending what appears to be a war without end. May I suggest you all begin to hunker down here in the USA and prepare yourselves for an inevitible confrontation between the forces of good and evil, depending on your perspective, and kick some relative ass. Or… maybe it’s more important to you to continue to engage in rhetoric on an unpaved road to nowhere many miles from American soil, and light years away from a blinding reality.
1) Every time we hear about you going into Burma, the number grows. We’re up to 24 now.
2) You’ve gone from being the Consul-General of Kawthoolei to now being the Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office. Do they know about this, or will we be soon reading another communique from the KNU central committee, denouncing you yet again?
3)You can cease emailing Colonel Nerdah – he isn’t going to reply to you. In fact, he deletes your emails without even reading them, like so much spam.
4) I defended you on New Mandala – and a few other web sites – without having first read your book. Once I had read it, I realized that you had deceived me. Basically, you took advantage of over 30 years of friendship, using me to defend the indefensible. Your book is chock full of omissions of fact, misrepresentations of actual events, and in a few places, outright lies. I allowed my otherwise cautious nature to be overridden by friendship, and as a result ended up looking the perfect ass for defending you.
Example 1: you told people that goons from the KNU frog marched you to their headquarters and severely grilled you about he assassination of Pado Manh Sha.
You neglected to tell people that there was a witness to this non event – that it never happened in the way you stated it. The meeting was at Guesthouse #4, and was described as cordial. They wanted you to change a few statements in your book, and you refused. The witness to that meeting regularly peruses NM, and he told me all about it. You were never asked anything about Pado Manh Sha.
Example 2: You wrote in your book that you were involved in combat against the SPDC. I know from people who were there that this is untrue. You were never allowed to have a loaded weapon, which would put you at a serious disadvantage in combat. Yelling, “bang-bang” doesn’t cut it.
Those are but two incidents. There are many, many others.
You threw hissy fits over the articles written about you by Antonio Graceffo (http://www.hackwriters.com/Adriver.htm) and Brian McCartan (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/JD02Ae01.html), but you neglect to tell people that you sought them out and submitted for the interviews. Only when things didn’t turn out like you wanted did you get angry. Why? All they did was print what you told them. Remember the stinger missiles?
5) For something that’s supposed to be secret, you sure like to talk about it. Alot. ALOT.
I counseled you many, many times to cease discussing it, yet you persisted. Your exact words to me were, “any publicity is good publicity”.
6) Which brings us to the crux of this. Your primary motivation is to sell a book. Just read your last post (#108) where you plug your book.
That’s all it has ever been about for you. To sell that poorly written book.
And while we’re still on the subject of your book – tell me one more time which company contacted you in the hopes of making it into a movie. I want to get an advance ticket. This I have to see.
7) Calling yourself a journalist doesn’t make it so. Getting friends to print your articles on the internet doesn’t meet the minimal requirements to be a journalist.
In closing – you have been asked repeatedly by people in the KNU, KNLA, refugee groups, and others working with the Karens to please stop making statements. They have asked you nicely in private. They have asked you publicly in communiques.
You do not speak for the KNU/KNLA in any capacity. You were never the consul-general, and you’re not the Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office.
And you’re not my friend anymore either.
This is my last reply to your posts on New Mandala.
Thanks to amberwaves for the comment. I wouldn’t want to be seen claiming that there were no guards, no security for the PAD prior to the Udon incident. My own observations at Makhawan in late June/early July were that there were modest levels of security, similar to going to a typical rock show.
Just after Udon, the security level rose, but at that time it was still amateurish, and included a close friend, a middle-aged architect who’s never been in a fight in his life, wearing a motor-bike helmet and carrying a golf-club. It got more professional after that. But again, I think it’s reasonable to argue that PAD security was beefed up largely in response to threats, both realized and unrealized, from outside.
Chang Noi should review again the videos from Udon, showing easily indentifiable individuals beating, stomping and kicking people who were already semi-conscious or unconscious on the ground. And reflect on the fact that the government never even hinted at providing justice for the victims. The message was clear, “You’re on your own.”
To claim that the PAD in these circumstances was the group/institution that was taking a “dangerous step away” from a tradition of political non-violence, as “Chang Noi” does, seems like quite a stretch.
Yea, it would appear to some , (who have a personal axe to grind with me), that what I have recently reported on is supposed to be a real “hush-hush” matter, when in fact the news on the fighting that goes on in neighboring Burma is really NO SECRET, however my sources are confidential (as this is how mostly all journalists operate when to give up any names could endanger those who have passed onto whomever, in this case me), and that is how it will be.
The mentioning of foreign elements assisting the Karen National Liberation Army is NO crime, and as it was reported that these foreign fighter’s were assisting the KNLA (this news is all over Mae Sot for anyone to hear so please don’t even attempt to attack me for stating what is the main topic of conversation in every bar and restaurant in Mae Sot), I passed this info onto your general readership.
Another point I would like to make is that NO one will stop NO one from entering Thailand (Mae Sot), to assist the Karen fight, however I do caution anyone who decides to go over there to keep a bit of a low profile while you are attempting to make contact with the KNLA (their e-mail address is in my book “War in Karen Country” by the way), seeing as the SPDC/DKBA are floating all over the city trying to pick up on any news of ”foreign mercenaries” (which is what they call anyone who goes to fight for the Karen struggle.
I have went into Burma from Thailand at least two dozen times and was NEVER stopped nor was I ever troubled by NO one, but then again I never “advertized” (as some of you “Walter Mitty’s” write about me and my trips to the Republic of Kawthoolei).
I continue to receive requests for information about the KNLA along with requests for any type of photos that show the Karen National Liberation Army (I have 328 photos of the KNLA that I have released as PUBLIC DOMAIN), and I continue to pass onto the appropriate KNLA leadership the names of those who want to help in some form.
While I have, in effect moved onto other things, I shall do what I can to continue to promote the Karen cause for freedom and if this troubles some of you then so be it.
Thomas Bleming
Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office
Lusk, Wyoming
The silent coup or military backup this time is very simply to figure out, I think. Well, for me, in Prem’s era they even have more intelligence to plan their silent coup.
In this era (Anupong’s era), he and his ‘clan’ just simply said that the military are ready to go out of their fence to stop ‘the red shirts’ if they protest ‘Democrat party’, but not a single sign when it came to PAD. … Can you really call it ‘parliamentary’?
I just visited this site and I’m very interesting for the devil’s discus book both in Thai and English. Can anyone tell me the link to download, please…
There was a very small village in Issan, which surprised a government social worker, I met. They had generators, which lighted their house, and even had their first village child in university. Their local wats are lighted and education was emphasized. Lesser dropouts and increased awareness with television available too. They had piped water, which help decreased the infant mortality amongst them. Better hygiene and economic productivity followed. They even covered toilets with piped water and cholera outbreaks have stopped.
The social worker friend was all praise for this village which self helped itself without any support from any government or non government organisation. It was all hard earned by the womenfolk.
But at what price?
It was the income from generations of the womenfolk who were sex workers. This christian welfare worker then asked the forum for an opinion. To stop these women, as a christian or to encourage them, as a social worker. She said that the light at the end of the tunnel was that with these amenities, and education, bought with blood money. The village. may one day, stop selling their daughters to the flesh trade. Her poignant question to the people present in forum was, “Will they go to hell?”
The spiritual adviser, who is today, the bishop of Johor/Melaka said, “If there is a hell, then the government and people in power, who stopped legitimate funds from reaching these people, will be deeper in there.
LDohrs said: The turning point was July 24th, 2008 in Udon Thani when an entirely peaceful group of PAD supporters were set upon by hundreds of thugs armed with iron bars, clubs and swords…Steadily in response the PAD built up its defensive capacities.
This is a reasonable point to bring up, but would be even better if the writer didn’t shave the truth a bit himself. The idea that myth turned into conventional wisdom could stand inaccurately as history really disturbs me.
The PAD began arming itself with iron bars, clubs and swords _ I admit I can’t swear to recalling the swords _ before the confrontation in Udon. I remember talking to people who saw the weapons and seeing photos at the time, and there was some (not much) coverage in the Bangkok press.
I wouldn’t want you to have to trust my memory, however. Please start following the trail with these items:
It is truly amazing how those most shrill of voices screaming for the rule of law during the recent Bangkok Airport closures, the western press, the western tourists, and western bloggers are now shrilly demanding that the rule of law be ignored in the case of an Aussie nitwit who violated Thailand’s strict Lese Majeste law.
Which is it? The “rule of law” you scream about, or the “I’m not going to follow that law because it’s stupid” mantra of your enemy?
Oh, but you are so much better because you are (fill in the blank) !
Not sure I agree with this “will of the voters” argument. If PPP had managed an absolute majority I would agree. But they didn’t. So there’s a coalition. The parties are and should be free to join together however is best for them to form a government.
Now, as you say, PPP has been opposed by some big forces beyond its control. At this point Thailand can’t keep going on doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. So I think it makes sense that the parties are joining together to attempt to bring some calm. I am sure a good deal of horse trading was also done.
For sure this will be a shaky coalition that will be difficult to steer with so many different parties. It’s not likely it will last very long.
While I think I understand K.Andrew’s wish to maintain the legitimacy of the parliament to choose PM, I strongly think he goes too far in saying “If the Democrat Party can muster the numbers in parliament, they have a right to form government. ” (Hence the title of the post is misleading: it’s anything but ‘parliarmentary’)
Given the path to power of the Dem that K.Andrew very well describes (and further emphasized by K.Polo), I don’t think they have any ‘right’ here. This is another military-royalist coup (or, part of the same ‘ongoing coup’ since 2006), done under the guise of ‘legality’. It’s very much the feature of the current situations; the so-called “Tulakanphiwat” has of course been the most obvious component.
(One could say the Dem have the ‘right’ as much as the current Constitution has been ‘approved’ by a plebiscite, i.e. both are the product blackmail politics.)
This article is enlightening and resonates with what I’ve learned recently – including from the book “My name Lon”. I just got back from my first ever trip to Thailand (and Cambodia and Vietnam) and I’m appaled by the circumstances that force many young girls into prostitution. I’m a farang. But I did not come to “buy your country”. Quite the opposite: I want to put the money and skills I’ve gained in Europe to good use in Thailand by giving the poor and underprivileged a choice for their future. My idea was to join such causes as GAATW or WEAVE. What does the author of this article suggest?
We need to begin calling this whole thing for what it is: a silent coup. In 1980 forces behind Prem, from around him and above him, stoked nervousness and instability and finally pushed the members of Parliament to withdraw support for PM Gen Kriengsak. When elected MP Kukrit Pramoj saw a chance to succeed Kriengsak, the same forces intervened to make sure he stood aside and let Prem be “chosen” by the Parliament as PM. This was henceforth labelled the Silent Coup.
What do we have here, now? For two years PAD supported and encouraged by the same forces that brought Prem to power have been able to force out three PMs chosen in the parliament. Finally after the airports siege, a critical mass of TRT-PPP politicians had been barred from politics, and under heavy pressure much of what’s left of the coalition pull out and go to the other side because they were promised sweet cabinet positions. And a new PM acceptable to the military and palace takes power.
This was all done behind the scenes, not as simply as a process of normal political negotiations, but something dictated from above. There is no relationship to the people’s will or voters’ choice.
So shouldn’t we already be calling this The Second Silent Coup and counting it in the long shameful list of Thailand’s extrajudicial and extraconstitutional political changes dictated by the military and the highest institution?
Facebook 
Twitter 
Soundcloud 
Youtube 
Rss
Violence and politics
Re the effectiveness of a duffer with a golf club. How do you reckon it does against a grenade coming in from an m79 at 76 meters/second?
From the record, it doesn’t appear the PAD had the quality of golfer needed to accomplish that task.
Not even including the injuries and death caused by the bumbling police/tear gas incident, the strong preponderance of injuries and deaths were suffered by, rather than caused by, the PAD.
In context, the PAD can be characterized as a “fairly non-violent” or “relatively non-violent” movement, and “very violent” is inaccurate.
Does Thailand need democracy?
That last comment is like saying why does it matter what zoologists think of reptilian behavior because they are not actually reptiles themselves.
This is a forum for the discussion of , in this case, Thai politics. What should we discuss, if not Thai poltics?
My wife and children are Thai citizens and I live in the country so it directly concerns me in regard to both my daily life and the future of my children.
My opinion is that if they were paid 750 baht they would think it a great opportunity to be disenfranchised. Which is exactly what the Phantumitr is proposing- abolishing votng rights for the rural poor because they cannot make choices for themselves, many of whom were sitting in Suwannabhumi airport holding brightly colored noisemakers and drinking Fanta from plastic bags for 750 baht because the rich Chinese businessmen who don’t want to lose hold of their power were upset by the third consecutive electoral victory of a new guard of rich Chinese businessmen.
If you consider vote-buying and disruption of international transportation systems to be in violation of some “arbitrary Western standard” and not a universal infringement of democracy, perhaps we need to define terms before this discussion continues.
Volunteering to fight in Burma
Charles Foster, Jr., a.k.a. Charles F.
If your father, Charles Foster, Sr., were alive today, what would he say about your comments and behavior? He never tolerated crap like that. He was Thomas Bleming’s friend. He helped him fight for others in the cause of freedom. He would take you to the woodshed and spank your butt for what you said. You have never been anywhere or done anything your own life, but you feel the need to attack others like Thomas Bleming who have, who is leading the way for others to follow. Thank God for good men like Thomas Bleming, risking his life, to draw attention to the cause of freedom for the Burmese people. You should apologize and help, not hinder, Thomas Bleming in his efforts seeking a free Burma.
Jimmy Clendennen
Volunteering to fight in Burma
Dear Charles,
I’m sorry that it came to this.
I have never met you, but hope to one day.
God bless, we keep working to defend others less privileged.
Dan
Violence and politics
To: LDohrs
You’re right. The Udon incident should have been mentioned. And many others. But the “thesis” of the piece was that PAD was a very violent departure from a non-violent culture of protest in the past. Mentioning the Udon incident would not change that observation. Many past demonstrations have been attacked far more viciously than the PAD in Udon but the reaction was not the same.
Volunteering to fight in Burma
It seems to me that there is a small group of hardcore freedom fighters here focused on ending what appears to be a war without end. May I suggest you all begin to hunker down here in the USA and prepare yourselves for an inevitible confrontation between the forces of good and evil, depending on your perspective, and kick some relative ass. Or… maybe it’s more important to you to continue to engage in rhetoric on an unpaved road to nowhere many miles from American soil, and light years away from a blinding reality.
Violence and politics
There’s alot to be said for a nine iron wielded by an intent person.
Leave the PA(S)D alone!
Sonti
Why did’t you finish the job after bwe lost many good people
It is the same as General Sorayut government
You will not have the same situation like this moment You did’t killed the snake just injour them
What to do now. You can’t start all pver again
You disappoint many good people some died for it
You see Apirug accept Navin + TRT gang Whatgoing to be from now
This is your fall You can do better But you did’t
You are disappointing the King the Thai people from alover the glob
Volunteering to fight in Burma
1) Every time we hear about you going into Burma, the number grows. We’re up to 24 now.
2) You’ve gone from being the Consul-General of Kawthoolei to now being the Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office. Do they know about this, or will we be soon reading another communique from the KNU central committee, denouncing you yet again?
3)You can cease emailing Colonel Nerdah – he isn’t going to reply to you. In fact, he deletes your emails without even reading them, like so much spam.
4) I defended you on New Mandala – and a few other web sites – without having first read your book. Once I had read it, I realized that you had deceived me. Basically, you took advantage of over 30 years of friendship, using me to defend the indefensible. Your book is chock full of omissions of fact, misrepresentations of actual events, and in a few places, outright lies. I allowed my otherwise cautious nature to be overridden by friendship, and as a result ended up looking the perfect ass for defending you.
Example 1: you told people that goons from the KNU frog marched you to their headquarters and severely grilled you about he assassination of Pado Manh Sha.
You neglected to tell people that there was a witness to this non event – that it never happened in the way you stated it. The meeting was at Guesthouse #4, and was described as cordial. They wanted you to change a few statements in your book, and you refused. The witness to that meeting regularly peruses NM, and he told me all about it. You were never asked anything about Pado Manh Sha.
Example 2: You wrote in your book that you were involved in combat against the SPDC. I know from people who were there that this is untrue. You were never allowed to have a loaded weapon, which would put you at a serious disadvantage in combat. Yelling, “bang-bang” doesn’t cut it.
Those are but two incidents. There are many, many others.
You threw hissy fits over the articles written about you by Antonio Graceffo (http://www.hackwriters.com/Adriver.htm) and Brian McCartan (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/JD02Ae01.html), but you neglect to tell people that you sought them out and submitted for the interviews. Only when things didn’t turn out like you wanted did you get angry. Why? All they did was print what you told them. Remember the stinger missiles?
5) For something that’s supposed to be secret, you sure like to talk about it. Alot. ALOT.
I counseled you many, many times to cease discussing it, yet you persisted. Your exact words to me were, “any publicity is good publicity”.
6) Which brings us to the crux of this. Your primary motivation is to sell a book. Just read your last post (#108) where you plug your book.
That’s all it has ever been about for you. To sell that poorly written book.
And while we’re still on the subject of your book – tell me one more time which company contacted you in the hopes of making it into a movie. I want to get an advance ticket. This I have to see.
7) Calling yourself a journalist doesn’t make it so. Getting friends to print your articles on the internet doesn’t meet the minimal requirements to be a journalist.
In closing – you have been asked repeatedly by people in the KNU, KNLA, refugee groups, and others working with the Karens to please stop making statements. They have asked you nicely in private. They have asked you publicly in communiques.
You do not speak for the KNU/KNLA in any capacity. You were never the consul-general, and you’re not the Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office.
And you’re not my friend anymore either.
This is my last reply to your posts on New Mandala.
Violence and politics
Thanks to amberwaves for the comment. I wouldn’t want to be seen claiming that there were no guards, no security for the PAD prior to the Udon incident. My own observations at Makhawan in late June/early July were that there were modest levels of security, similar to going to a typical rock show.
Just after Udon, the security level rose, but at that time it was still amateurish, and included a close friend, a middle-aged architect who’s never been in a fight in his life, wearing a motor-bike helmet and carrying a golf-club. It got more professional after that. But again, I think it’s reasonable to argue that PAD security was beefed up largely in response to threats, both realized and unrealized, from outside.
Chang Noi should review again the videos from Udon, showing easily indentifiable individuals beating, stomping and kicking people who were already semi-conscious or unconscious on the ground. And reflect on the fact that the government never even hinted at providing justice for the victims. The message was clear, “You’re on your own.”
To claim that the PAD in these circumstances was the group/institution that was taking a “dangerous step away” from a tradition of political non-violence, as “Chang Noi” does, seems like quite a stretch.
Volunteering to fight in Burma
Yea, it would appear to some , (who have a personal axe to grind with me), that what I have recently reported on is supposed to be a real “hush-hush” matter, when in fact the news on the fighting that goes on in neighboring Burma is really NO SECRET, however my sources are confidential (as this is how mostly all journalists operate when to give up any names could endanger those who have passed onto whomever, in this case me), and that is how it will be.
The mentioning of foreign elements assisting the Karen National Liberation Army is NO crime, and as it was reported that these foreign fighter’s were assisting the KNLA (this news is all over Mae Sot for anyone to hear so please don’t even attempt to attack me for stating what is the main topic of conversation in every bar and restaurant in Mae Sot), I passed this info onto your general readership.
Another point I would like to make is that NO one will stop NO one from entering Thailand (Mae Sot), to assist the Karen fight, however I do caution anyone who decides to go over there to keep a bit of a low profile while you are attempting to make contact with the KNLA (their e-mail address is in my book “War in Karen Country” by the way), seeing as the SPDC/DKBA are floating all over the city trying to pick up on any news of ”foreign mercenaries” (which is what they call anyone who goes to fight for the Karen struggle.
I have went into Burma from Thailand at least two dozen times and was NEVER stopped nor was I ever troubled by NO one, but then again I never “advertized” (as some of you “Walter Mitty’s” write about me and my trips to the Republic of Kawthoolei).
I continue to receive requests for information about the KNLA along with requests for any type of photos that show the Karen National Liberation Army (I have 328 photos of the KNLA that I have released as PUBLIC DOMAIN), and I continue to pass onto the appropriate KNLA leadership the names of those who want to help in some form.
While I have, in effect moved onto other things, I shall do what I can to continue to promote the Karen cause for freedom and if this troubles some of you then so be it.
Thomas Bleming
Republic of Kawthoolei Information Office
Lusk, Wyoming
Dishonourable but parliamentary
To support Khun Polo and Ajarn Somsak’s posts
The silent coup or military backup this time is very simply to figure out, I think. Well, for me, in Prem’s era they even have more intelligence to plan their silent coup.
In this era (Anupong’s era), he and his ‘clan’ just simply said that the military are ready to go out of their fence to stop ‘the red shirts’ if they protest ‘Democrat party’, but not a single sign when it came to PAD. … Can you really call it ‘parliamentary’?
With Respect
The Devil’s Discus – in Thai
I just visited this site and I’m very interesting for the devil’s discus book both in Thai and English. Can anyone tell me the link to download, please…
[email protected]
On prostitution and Thailand today
There was a very small village in Issan, which surprised a government social worker, I met. They had generators, which lighted their house, and even had their first village child in university. Their local wats are lighted and education was emphasized. Lesser dropouts and increased awareness with television available too. They had piped water, which help decreased the infant mortality amongst them. Better hygiene and economic productivity followed. They even covered toilets with piped water and cholera outbreaks have stopped.
The social worker friend was all praise for this village which self helped itself without any support from any government or non government organisation. It was all hard earned by the womenfolk.
But at what price?
It was the income from generations of the womenfolk who were sex workers. This christian welfare worker then asked the forum for an opinion. To stop these women, as a christian or to encourage them, as a social worker. She said that the light at the end of the tunnel was that with these amenities, and education, bought with blood money. The village. may one day, stop selling their daughters to the flesh trade. Her poignant question to the people present in forum was, “Will they go to hell?”
The spiritual adviser, who is today, the bishop of Johor/Melaka said, “If there is a hell, then the government and people in power, who stopped legitimate funds from reaching these people, will be deeper in there.
Violence and politics
LDohrs said: The turning point was July 24th, 2008 in Udon Thani when an entirely peaceful group of PAD supporters were set upon by hundreds of thugs armed with iron bars, clubs and swords…Steadily in response the PAD built up its defensive capacities.
This is a reasonable point to bring up, but would be even better if the writer didn’t shave the truth a bit himself. The idea that myth turned into conventional wisdom could stand inaccurately as history really disturbs me.
The PAD began arming itself with iron bars, clubs and swords _ I admit I can’t swear to recalling the swords _ before the confrontation in Udon. I remember talking to people who saw the weapons and seeing photos at the time, and there was some (not much) coverage in the Bangkok press.
I wouldn’t want you to have to trust my memory, however. Please start following the trail with these items:
http://bangkokpundit.blogspot.com/2008/05/thin-yellow-line.html
(links to:)
http://www.thairath.com/offline.php?section=hotnews&content=91252
and
http://bangkokpundit.blogspot.com/2008/06/pad-protecting-itself.html
(with more links)
Update on Harry Nicolaides
It is truly amazing how those most shrill of voices screaming for the rule of law during the recent Bangkok Airport closures, the western press, the western tourists, and western bloggers are now shrilly demanding that the rule of law be ignored in the case of an Aussie nitwit who violated Thailand’s strict Lese Majeste law.
Which is it? The “rule of law” you scream about, or the “I’m not going to follow that law because it’s stupid” mantra of your enemy?
Oh, but you are so much better because you are (fill in the blank) !
Dishonourable but parliamentary
Not sure I agree with this “will of the voters” argument. If PPP had managed an absolute majority I would agree. But they didn’t. So there’s a coalition. The parties are and should be free to join together however is best for them to form a government.
Now, as you say, PPP has been opposed by some big forces beyond its control. At this point Thailand can’t keep going on doing the same thing over and over expecting different results. So I think it makes sense that the parties are joining together to attempt to bring some calm. I am sure a good deal of horse trading was also done.
For sure this will be a shaky coalition that will be difficult to steer with so many different parties. It’s not likely it will last very long.
Dishonourable but parliamentary
Totally agree with K.Polo.
While I think I understand K.Andrew’s wish to maintain the legitimacy of the parliament to choose PM, I strongly think he goes too far in saying “If the Democrat Party can muster the numbers in parliament, they have a right to form government. ” (Hence the title of the post is misleading: it’s anything but ‘parliarmentary’)
Given the path to power of the Dem that K.Andrew very well describes (and further emphasized by K.Polo), I don’t think they have any ‘right’ here. This is another military-royalist coup (or, part of the same ‘ongoing coup’ since 2006), done under the guise of ‘legality’. It’s very much the feature of the current situations; the so-called “Tulakanphiwat” has of course been the most obvious component.
(One could say the Dem have the ‘right’ as much as the current Constitution has been ‘approved’ by a plebiscite, i.e. both are the product blackmail politics.)
On prostitution and Thailand today
This article is enlightening and resonates with what I’ve learned recently – including from the book “My name Lon”. I just got back from my first ever trip to Thailand (and Cambodia and Vietnam) and I’m appaled by the circumstances that force many young girls into prostitution. I’m a farang. But I did not come to “buy your country”. Quite the opposite: I want to put the money and skills I’ve gained in Europe to good use in Thailand by giving the poor and underprivileged a choice for their future. My idea was to join such causes as GAATW or WEAVE. What does the author of this article suggest?
Dishonourable but parliamentary
We need to begin calling this whole thing for what it is: a silent coup. In 1980 forces behind Prem, from around him and above him, stoked nervousness and instability and finally pushed the members of Parliament to withdraw support for PM Gen Kriengsak. When elected MP Kukrit Pramoj saw a chance to succeed Kriengsak, the same forces intervened to make sure he stood aside and let Prem be “chosen” by the Parliament as PM. This was henceforth labelled the Silent Coup.
What do we have here, now? For two years PAD supported and encouraged by the same forces that brought Prem to power have been able to force out three PMs chosen in the parliament. Finally after the airports siege, a critical mass of TRT-PPP politicians had been barred from politics, and under heavy pressure much of what’s left of the coalition pull out and go to the other side because they were promised sweet cabinet positions. And a new PM acceptable to the military and palace takes power.
This was all done behind the scenes, not as simply as a process of normal political negotiations, but something dictated from above. There is no relationship to the people’s will or voters’ choice.
So shouldn’t we already be calling this The Second Silent Coup and counting it in the long shameful list of Thailand’s extrajudicial and extraconstitutional political changes dictated by the military and the highest institution?