Unfortunate turn of phrase, Nich, it is the closest that most people will ever get to the straight-shooting perspective of the military brass which immediately brings back Ne Win’s infamous resignation speech in July 1988.
Also the military still matters is rather stating the obvious to all of us still at the receiving end after half a century. Indeed that is exactly the point. The question is just what kind of military we want, not that it should be there – under a democratically elected civilian govt or carry on as the overlords with the people underfoot.
You will forgive the natives if they aren’t too keen on this particular museum, thank you very much. It’s all very well for foreigners and academic researchers. The shinier this one with a bottomless budget the more it will rankle. They want this interminable nightmare to end.
[…] for safer havens across Asia. China’s growing muscle in Southeast Asian affairs was shown in the forcible return of 109 Uyghur refugees from Thailand to China, despite the clear evidence for Uyghur persecution […]
[…] has renewed hope that retooled policies and rhetoric may at last help governance triumph over the political oligarchies often identified as the root cause of policy dysfunction in Indonesia. But these explanations risk “hand waving” to support pre-formed conclusions that institutions […]
Thanks for your continued replies on this forum Pavin. Interesting that NYT would not entertain your proposed piece but did print Thomas Fuller’s recent article. To my mind, it would seem important, and perhaps more interesting, to publish and hear from Thai voices on such sensitive and important issues.
The bombing of the shrine has ONLY to do with Thai Muslims, Malay Muslims, and perhaps Uighur Muslims. It may be related to the Uighur, Pattani or “Rohingya” issues. The Grey Wolves have as much to do with Thailand, or even Islamic issues, as corn beef on rye has to do with Burundi. The number of conspiratorialists posting here is absurd. Grey Wolves are involved in domestic Turkish issues. They would not know a Buddha from a Toyota. It is insane that people keep harping on Grey Wolves. Neither does this have anything to do with red shirts, yellow shirts, purple shirts or green shirts. Does anyone seriously believe that the Thai Army framed three Muslims ? The most logical explanation, I have already stated: This was an Islamic grievance against Thailand or Myanmar, using Thailand as a more accessible proxy. There are NO wolves and NO shirts remotely related to this terrorist act. Some on NM apparently are so scared to criticise Muslims, I am surprised the Malaysian Usual Suspect hasn’t come up yet.
I wonder what these ‘old’ constitution re-writers were doing on October 6, 1976 during the Thammasart University massacre … exactly 39 years ago? If there is only one ‘revolutionary’ who survived that massacre, prospered and included in today’s constitutional re-write, that would give me some … a lot really … of comfort.
It’s worth pointing out that although they are anonymous, people like Bangkok Pundit, PPT and even Tony Cartalucci maintain a consistent online identity, which enables people to form an opinion on their arguments and credibility. The problem with “Not aligned” is that he posts messages all over the internet using a plethora of aliases as well as under his own name, which can be misleading and unhelpful. I have lost count of the number of aliases this person has used. This behaviour is not responsible anonymous commentary – it is sock puppetry, and New Mandala is right to discourage it.
Thailand is really a country for old men. These men are already passed their prime. Although the combination is less ugly than the first CDC, e.g. less military generals. it gives no hope. Some figures are too controversial, like the former CC judge or the former EC. Others are civilian bureaucrats with little known achievement.
From the “Myanmar” perspective, only thing to learn frpm this heonous affair is that for all those convergent attacks and “suitcase full of cash”, no one has been able to kill Than Shwe.
I write: “I would never argue that Chomsky was a supporter of the Khmer Rouge.” And you write back that “Chomsky never supported the Khmer Rouge. To suggest that he did so is to repeat a lie.”
Who, exactly, are you trying to correct?
Meechai Ruchupan! I remember him back in the pre-Thaksin era as the man who almost always makes with the negative waves. Meechai is obviously a past master at the old old establishment game of muddying the water so much that the ‘new’ constitution is just as flawed as the old one – if not worse. Indeed, why bother with a constitution at all. I’d be more than happy to see it in the trashcan of history. All it ever does is give local pols something to ignore, corrupt the spirit of, or bend to their own ends. But then again, perhaps that is exactly what the establishment wants us all to believe.
You (and the junta you seem to love) are so far out on thin ice with the latest attempt to make it look like the red shirts are uniquely violent that I can’t imagine you yourself don’t see how foolish you look.
The odd Odd seems to have been a fake construct to try to pin a previous non-political bombing on the red shirts.
The reality is that:
1. Red, yellows, others are all the same animal. Part good, part bad.
2. Odd is a ridiculous attempt to create a fake story that is convenient to the ultra-radical yellow ideologues.
3. I am sure there are equally delusional ultra-radical red shirt ideologues
4. This bombing seems to have nothing to do with domestic Thai politics.
Your comment has no value. It is just dumb repetition of the military party line. It think it is pretty obvious to everyone that painting the red shorts as violent terrorists is a core tactic of the junta and their backers. Witness the odd case of Odd.
You could equally refer to the Yellow Shirts as violent and terror-prone, but neither appear to have an appetite for this level of destruction.
Let’s all accept that there are good and bad aspects of yellows and reds. But have links to groups that manipulate their for their own interest. Both have violent elements.
But Thailand is not in the middle of some epic and unique struggle of Manichean proportions with the fate of mankind (or even Thais) at risk.
This is just a routine struggle between groups in society with different self interests and and different goals.
The attempt to make this discussion ad homonym is an attempt to diver the discussion from the issues and will result in prolonging Thailand’s conflict.
Want reconciliation?
Stop thinking of the other side as evil. Maybe even stop thinking of them as the other side.
Vichai N – and with all sincerity i do thank you for that 🙂
Just one thing – over the years i did not just chronicle the Red Shirts, but i also chronicled the many incarnations and subgroups of the Yellow Alliance equally, until i was assaulted and that door was closed to me rather suddenly and forever.
I have also a very personal interest in a peaceful, or to stay realistic – a transition with the least amount of violence as my family is Thai.
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Past and future, the military still matters
Unfortunate turn of phrase, Nich, it is the closest that most people will ever get to the straight-shooting perspective of the military brass which immediately brings back Ne Win’s infamous resignation speech in July 1988.
Also the military still matters is rather stating the obvious to all of us still at the receiving end after half a century. Indeed that is exactly the point. The question is just what kind of military we want, not that it should be there – under a democratically elected civilian govt or carry on as the overlords with the people underfoot.
You will forgive the natives if they aren’t too keen on this particular museum, thank you very much. It’s all very well for foreigners and academic researchers. The shinier this one with a bottomless budget the more it will rankle. They want this interminable nightmare to end.
Southeast Asia’s Uighur dilemma
[…] for safer havens across Asia. China’s growing muscle in Southeast Asian affairs was shown in the forcible return of 109 Uyghur refugees from Thailand to China, despite the clear evidence for Uyghur persecution […]
Ethnic learning gaps in Vietnam
[…] lс╗Зch hс╗Нc vс║еn cс╗зa c├бc sс║пc d├вn с╗Я Viс╗Зt Nam: Ethnic learning gaps in Vietnam (New Mandala […]
The empire strikes back
[…] has renewed hope that retooled policies and rhetoric may at last help governance triumph over the political oligarchies often identified as the root cause of policy dysfunction in Indonesia. But these explanations risk “hand waving” to support pre-formed conclusions that institutions […]
A conversation with Chomsky
Thanks for your continued replies on this forum Pavin. Interesting that NYT would not entertain your proposed piece but did print Thomas Fuller’s recent article. To my mind, it would seem important, and perhaps more interesting, to publish and hear from Thai voices on such sensitive and important issues.
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
The bombing of the shrine has ONLY to do with Thai Muslims, Malay Muslims, and perhaps Uighur Muslims. It may be related to the Uighur, Pattani or “Rohingya” issues. The Grey Wolves have as much to do with Thailand, or even Islamic issues, as corn beef on rye has to do with Burundi. The number of conspiratorialists posting here is absurd. Grey Wolves are involved in domestic Turkish issues. They would not know a Buddha from a Toyota. It is insane that people keep harping on Grey Wolves. Neither does this have anything to do with red shirts, yellow shirts, purple shirts or green shirts. Does anyone seriously believe that the Thai Army framed three Muslims ? The most logical explanation, I have already stated: This was an Islamic grievance against Thailand or Myanmar, using Thailand as a more accessible proxy. There are NO wolves and NO shirts remotely related to this terrorist act. Some on NM apparently are so scared to criticise Muslims, I am surprised the Malaysian Usual Suspect hasn’t come up yet.
Thailand’s constitution conundrum
I wonder what these ‘old’ constitution re-writers were doing on October 6, 1976 during the Thammasart University massacre … exactly 39 years ago? If there is only one ‘revolutionary’ who survived that massacre, prospered and included in today’s constitutional re-write, that would give me some … a lot really … of comfort.
https://nsarchive.wordpress.com/2014/10/10/declassified-u-s-documents-help-fill-void-left-by-thailands-silence-on-38th-anniversary-of-thammasat-university-massacre/
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
I completely agree to your profile . . . of a lethal bomber. Question is: who supplied the bomb? Were the black shirted vipers involved?
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
Ingredients:
Highly biased speculation: 75%
Manipulation: 25%
Logic: 0%
Facts: 0%
A conversation with Chomsky
I’m sure there must be a thread out here somewhere on Chomsky which might be an appropriate forum for your myopic effort to trash Chomsky.
This thread is about Pravit.
A conversation with Chomsky
It’s worth pointing out that although they are anonymous, people like Bangkok Pundit, PPT and even Tony Cartalucci maintain a consistent online identity, which enables people to form an opinion on their arguments and credibility. The problem with “Not aligned” is that he posts messages all over the internet using a plethora of aliases as well as under his own name, which can be misleading and unhelpful. I have lost count of the number of aliases this person has used. This behaviour is not responsible anonymous commentary – it is sock puppetry, and New Mandala is right to discourage it.
Southeast Asian snapshots
I enjoyed reading this colourful snapshot of recent events in the region. Thanks NM
Thailand’s constitution conundrum
Thailand is really a country for old men. These men are already passed their prime. Although the combination is less ugly than the first CDC, e.g. less military generals. it gives no hope. Some figures are too controversial, like the former CC judge or the former EC. Others are civilian bureaucrats with little known achievement.
Mass killings and memory
From the “Myanmar” perspective, only thing to learn frpm this heonous affair is that for all those convergent attacks and “suitcase full of cash”, no one has been able to kill Than Shwe.
In person or in authority!
A conversation with Chomsky
I write: “I would never argue that Chomsky was a supporter of the Khmer Rouge.” And you write back that “Chomsky never supported the Khmer Rouge. To suggest that he did so is to repeat a lie.”
Who, exactly, are you trying to correct?
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
The Erawan Shrine bomb that killed and maimed hundreds was very powerful . Who supplied the bombs? A Thai connection…
The red shirts black shirted arm has the expertise and willingness to bomb and kill. My suspicions are thus pricked by past red shirts terror acts.
Thailand’s constitution conundrum
Meechai Ruchupan! I remember him back in the pre-Thaksin era as the man who almost always makes with the negative waves. Meechai is obviously a past master at the old old establishment game of muddying the water so much that the ‘new’ constitution is just as flawed as the old one – if not worse. Indeed, why bother with a constitution at all. I’d be more than happy to see it in the trashcan of history. All it ever does is give local pols something to ignore, corrupt the spirit of, or bend to their own ends. But then again, perhaps that is exactly what the establishment wants us all to believe.
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
You (and the junta you seem to love) are so far out on thin ice with the latest attempt to make it look like the red shirts are uniquely violent that I can’t imagine you yourself don’t see how foolish you look.
The odd Odd seems to have been a fake construct to try to pin a previous non-political bombing on the red shirts.
The reality is that:
1. Red, yellows, others are all the same animal. Part good, part bad.
2. Odd is a ridiculous attempt to create a fake story that is convenient to the ultra-radical yellow ideologues.
3. I am sure there are equally delusional ultra-radical red shirt ideologues
4. This bombing seems to have nothing to do with domestic Thai politics.
Were the Grey Wolves behind Bangkok bombing?
Your comment has no value. It is just dumb repetition of the military party line. It think it is pretty obvious to everyone that painting the red shorts as violent terrorists is a core tactic of the junta and their backers. Witness the odd case of Odd.
You could equally refer to the Yellow Shirts as violent and terror-prone, but neither appear to have an appetite for this level of destruction.
Let’s all accept that there are good and bad aspects of yellows and reds. But have links to groups that manipulate their for their own interest. Both have violent elements.
But Thailand is not in the middle of some epic and unique struggle of Manichean proportions with the fate of mankind (or even Thais) at risk.
This is just a routine struggle between groups in society with different self interests and and different goals.
The attempt to make this discussion ad homonym is an attempt to diver the discussion from the issues and will result in prolonging Thailand’s conflict.
Want reconciliation?
Stop thinking of the other side as evil. Maybe even stop thinking of them as the other side.
A conversation with Chomsky
Vichai N – and with all sincerity i do thank you for that 🙂
Just one thing – over the years i did not just chronicle the Red Shirts, but i also chronicled the many incarnations and subgroups of the Yellow Alliance equally, until i was assaulted and that door was closed to me rather suddenly and forever.
I have also a very personal interest in a peaceful, or to stay realistic – a transition with the least amount of violence as my family is Thai.